The court system is a whole culture unto itself! It has its own language and customs and procedures, and if you do not understand how the system works, that could hurt you in your divorce case. Kris breaks down what questions to ask when hiring an attorney all the way to what to do when in court.

In this episode of We Need To Talk With Kris Godinez, Kris discusses the family court system and what questions to ask when you go to hire an attorney.

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Hello and welcome to We Need To Talk with Kris Godinez podcast. I’m your host Kris Godinez, licensed professional counselor. I help people get out of, and stay out of, toxic relationships. This podcast is for informational and educational purposes only the views and opinions stated herein are mine and mine alone. They do not represent the ACA, the APA or any other therapist for that matter.

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Hi, everybody. So, okay, announcements. Um, let me think, let me think. So, the next meet and greet is going to be August 26. in Salt Lake City. If you wish to purchase tickets, go to Krisgodinez.com. Go to I think it’s appearances. Maybe events. Anyway, it’s on Krisgodinez.com. Go there, and you can get tickets for it. There are still some tickets available. So, I usually cut it off at 10. So, we have about six more tickets available. So yeah, because I want to keep it small.

Okay, so today’s topic is what you need to know about the court system, so here’s the deal. Court is not like anything you’ve ever experienced before in your life; it is truly a… it’s almost like entering a foreign country. There’s like languages that go with it. And there’s manners and things that you do and customs and, you know, that kind of thing. So, I think the thing that people get really confused with, and I forgot to do a current event.

Okay, current event. So, a couple of things are going on one, our air conditioner has officially given up the ghost, which is why I have no makeup on. Because if I had makeup on, it would run down my face and across the floor and out the door and find someplace cool. There is that. Two current events. So, what I see happening is people are dumping their animals like crazy. And it is it really makes me angry so, and the Town of Gilbert doesn’t help because they’re saying that you cannot trap them, because you feed them, and if you feed them that’s against their stupid laws. And so, none of the rescues will help trap the cats or dogs or whatever that needs to be trapped and taken to a vet and checked out and then gotten to a shelter or whatever. So, and because we live in an area where there are coyotes, the coyotes are eating the cats. And that is not something you want to wake up to on a Sunday morning. So anyway, it’s in here’s the thing, who does that, who dumps animals who dumps them who dumps them in a desert, who dumps them out in the Sonoran Desert and goes, Oh, they’ll find food, that would be a narcissist, that would be a psychopath. That would be somebody with absolutely zero empathy, zero ability to put themselves in another sentient being shoes, etc., etc., etc. So basically, watch how people treat animals. And this is all interconnected. So, the current event is Gilbert right now is having a huge issue with animals being dumped dogs, cats, whatever, they’re just being dumped, and they’re dumping them in public parks, or they’re dumping them in developments, or they’re, or they’re going driving them out to the desert, and I’m like, it’s 100 and frickin 18 outside, they’re not going to survive. And I think that’s their whole point is they don’t want them to survive. So, yeah, so it’s frustrating because like I said, I’ve been trying to contact cat rescues, and they’re like, oh, Town of Gilbert. Oh, no, they’ll sue us. They’ll arrest us. They’ll do whatever because they’ve made it illegal to feed the cats. And in order to catch the cat, you have to put food in the trap. So, they consider that feeding the cats.

Kris Godinez  04:36

Can I tell you what I think of the Town of Gilbert? It’s all four-letter words, and none of it is nice. Seriously, it’s like the people who run the town of Gilbert do not have the good sense that God gave lettuce. Don’t get me started anyway. So um, that is something to watch out for. How do they treat animals, and if the animal has to be given up now, things happen. Okay? It If the animal has to be given up, say, for example, there is a death, and you know, the cats need to be going somewhere, and nobody can take it. You take them to a rescue, or you take them to a shelter, or you try to find somebody that can adopt them. You don’t just dump them and go, Oh, go hunt. They’ll figure it out. No, they’re domesticated. Domesticated cats don’t stand the chance of an ice cube and Phoenix of surviving seriously. It just…. don’t get me started. I love all dogs, all cats, gerbils, hamsters, I’ll watch snakes from afar, but you know, it’s the reptiles. I’m not too cool with. But you know what I’m saying? So, but the point being is that you don’t just dump your animal. And that is a huge issue here. And Gilbert is just like, oh, what problem? We don’t see the problem. Oh, they’re just idiots. Don’t get me started.

Oh my god. Anyway, watch how people treat animals, watch how they care for them. Watch how they or not care for them, as the case may be. And if an animal needs to be given up, you go through the proper channels. You make sure that that animal is in a safe place, either a rescue, a shelter, your rehoming it, or whatever. And of course, be careful of the frickin what it is, the dog fighters, because they look for free, you know, free animals, and then they use them as the bait animals, and I just I hate people sometimes I really, I swear to God, and all that’s holy! Somedays, I just sit there, and I go other people; what a mistake! Seriously! The ones that do that, because I’m just like, anyway, if you see animals that are in need, basically, you can throw the middle finger at the town and Gilbert, if you want my personal opinion, give them water at the very least they need fresh water because it’s 118 out. Did I mention that? So, I’m, I’m probably a little irritated because it’s hot. And these people are heinous. So anyway, there is that. So, watch how people react to animal’s. Watch. You know if they give the Yeah, you can judge a man by how he treats animals absolutely said that was that Will Rogers, I think. But it’s true. How they treat animals tells you everything you need to know about them. How they treat animals, children, people that can do nothing for them tells you everything you need to know about them. 110% So if you’re afraid of getting arrested by the Town of Gilbert or whatever idiot town you happen to live in that’s got stupid rules, put out water, put out water for them freshwater because they’re going to need it because, like I said, 118, 117, 111, 113 is oh god. Anyway, there’s that.

So that is my current event is that usually the ones who dumped the animals and don’t care about what happens to them, or worse, tells the kids something like, Oh, you’re your dog went to a farm when in fact, they dumped him out in the desert. It just, oh my god. And then, Okay, one more thing. And then I swear I’ll get back on topic. So, I was going through, I should stop really subscribing to next door because all it does is piss me off. So, on next door, there was a story of a woman whose ex took the dogs and released them in the middle of the city, middle of the city, middle of the city so that they could get run over or, you know, taken in by one of these dog fighting idiots or, you know, coyotes or whatever. And I just…. Oh, God. Anyway. Yeah. And this is what abusers do.

So, in we’re going to talk about this in the talking about the court cases. If you are leaving an abuser, okay, and you’ve got animals, get them out, get them away, make up an excuse, and get them away from them. Because what they will do is they will use that pet to hurt you. So they will hurt the pet. They will release the pet on accident, and I put accident and ginormous bunny years. Because it’s not. I don’t believe in accidents. I don’t believe in coincidence, not with those mother Cluckers, you know what I’m saying? So they will hurt the pet. They will harm the pet; they will lose the pet. They will, you know, do heinous things to hurt you. So, if you realize you’re with an abuser and you do have an animal with them, get that pet away. Get it out. Give it to somebody that can hold on to it until you can get settled. Seriously, it’s not, trust me. Listen to me. Now, believe me later. These people and I use the term loosely, are heinous. They have no moral compunction whatsoever, no moral compass. They will think nothing of harming a dog, a cat, a gerbil snake, a reptile, whatever. Because remember, if you’re dealing with a dark triad, you’re dealing with a sadist, and they enjoy inflicting pain and they enjoy any way that they can get power and control over you. And that’s one way to do it. If you don’t have kids, they’ll do it through the pets. Anyway, that’s my current event is that people are stupid and stop dumping animals. Oh, seriously, I mean, okay, yeah, just Yeah. At least put water out for them.

So anyway, there is that. And if anybody knows of an animal rescue, they’d be willing to give the middle finger to Gilbert to help me get the cats. Please let me know. That would be very helpful. So anyway, there is that. Dumping of cats seems in dogs seems to be huge right now. And I’m not quite sure what’s going on. I don’t know if it’s the economy. I don’t know if it’s, I don’t know. But listen, dogs and cats, reptiles. Whatever pet you have is a lifelong commitment. It’s not just convenient. It is a lifelong commitment. The way I think about my dogs is since I don’t have children, they’re like my kids. I wouldn’t just kick my kids out into the desert and hope they survived. But I’ll tell you who does. Psychopaths, narcissists, evil, evil. Evil people do that. And they lie to the kids about how they went to the farm. And then the kid grows up the whole time thinking that their dog was safe and lived out a nice life. And then they realized, and oh, God, how damaging that is. So anyway, okay, that’s my current event is, you know, if you know that there are dogs and cats that are being dumped, get them to a shelter, get them to a rescue. At the very least, get water to them. If you can get food to them safely without anybody doing something stupid Town of Gilbert, then do that. So there that is. So yeah. All right. On to the topic

All right, the court system. So, court is not what you think it is. It’s not. So, if you’ve not dealt with what a family court is like, it is like entering a foreign country. It really is within its own language, its own customs, its own way of doing things. And what I see happening is that a lot of people going into the court system expect it to be instantaneous. Oh, Lord, I wish! No. The court system is glacially slow. I mean, it grinds. It really does go very, very slowly. So, you’ve got to be prepared divorcing, a narcissist. Okay. Best case scenario, they want out of the relationship, and they want the divorce. And it happens quickly. Best case. Worst case scenario is they use the court system to punish you, and to keep you stuck, and to financially ruin you and to do all of this.

Kris Godinez  13:16

So, the court is not that you think it’s not going to go fast. They’re not and they’re not always going to do lawyers don’t always do what you think they should do. And usually, if you have a good lawyer, there’s a reason why they’re not doing what you necessarily want them to do. Remember, it’s an end game, it’s an end game. So, all right. Basically, when I’m going to start from the beginning, when you realize that you want a divorce, you need to interview your attorney 10 ways to Sunday, and once you pick an attorney, make sure that they are they answer all the questions that we’re going to go through, and that you don’t start hopping from attorney to attorney to attorney to attorney because that’s going to lengthen out the divorce case. Every time you switch attorneys, they have to get up to speed on what’s going on. And then they have to do their thing. And then if you keep switching the judge is going to go Huh, huh? What are you doing? You know, so you don’t want to do that. So, some books that are going to help you if you decide to divorce your abuser, which I strongly encourage you to do just the life is too short get away from them.

Um, two books, Splitting by Bill Eddie and Randy Kreger and The No-Nonsense Guide to Divorce by Laurie Hellis. Lori’s book is phenomenal. It literally takes you through beginning to end how a divorce works. And it helps you understand why they do the seemingly nonsensical, really long time of getting a divorce and what’s going on and the judges and lawyers that this and that and it’s really good. So, I strongly recommend that book. So, all right, what we’re going to do is we’re going to dive into the questions that you need to be asking an attorney once you realize that’s it, I’m done. Peace out. Buh bye. Here we go.

So, this is Top 10 questions to ask before hiring a divorce attorney, and this is from divorce net. Okay, divorce net top 10 questions to ask before hiring a divorce attorney. Okay. All right. Okay, when you’re going through a divorce and looking for an attorney, remember you don’t have to hire the first attorney you meet. In fact, don’t! You want to talk to at least three or four different attorneys and see what their way of going about things is? So, it’s really good to meet with each one, at least a minimum of three. You want to see which one, then you know which one you mesh with. Because remember, it’s going to be a rapport thing. You’re going to be working with this person for at least probably a year, God willing, and the creek don’t rise if caveat, the aggressor, the narcissist wants the divorce, then it’ll be faster. But if they don’t want the divorce, they want to use the judge system, the judicial system, to punish you. It can drag on for frickin years, I had one where the guy dragged them back into court every two years for 12 years. before a judge finally got in there that was like, huh, this doesn’t seem right and then put a stop to it. 12 freakin years later… anybody else see a problem with this. Dear God in heaven, I see a huge problem with this family court system needs to be reformed. That’s a topic for a different day.

So back on topic. Okay, so 10 questions to ask. All right. All right. Um, you don’t go with the first one, you want to have at least three or four. And you want to make sure that you mesh well with them and that they know what they’re doing. Even if you’ve received a referral, a referral from a family law attorney from a friend or another lawyer, you should still do your due diligence, your homework, check the attorney’s qualifications, make sure that he or she has enough experience to handle your case. There are lots of lawyers out there, and many many advertise themselves as family law or divorce attorneys. However, family law is a subspecialty that involves complex legal principles, which take time and experience to master within the area of family law. There are even further subspecialties such as custody law, international custody law, guardianship, etc. all areas of all areas of the law involving qualified domestic relations orders, which are special orders required to divide certain types of retirement benefits. So, there’s lots of stuff to think about. In addition, there are various financial aspects of divorce, including financial disclosure requirements between spouses, so when you go to get divorced, you’re going to have to give them a disclosure of what you make, etc, etc, etc. Especially if there’s child custody and spousal support and all of that fun stuff involved. Restraining orders prohibiting spouses from changing beneficiary designations or transferring assets before or during the divorce. Things you need to think about alimony, how to calculate income available for alimony, and the special factors courts consider when determining settled settlement payments. Child support how to calculate child support in your state, the division of property and assets, including real property collectibles, venture capital, interest, stock options, portfolios, or other business interests, and the division of retirement benefits. So, you need somebody who knows there a hole from a hole in the ground, basically.

10 Questions to Ask a divorce attorney. Do you specialize in divorces, or are divorces just a part of your practice? So, remember, just like with counselors, there are counselors that do not specialize in trauma. It’s just part of their practice. Okay. You can transfer these questions to counselors too. So, when you’re talking to an attorney, you got to make sure that this is specific. Like this is what they do. They’re not doing divorces and wills and civil suits. And this, that and the other thing, no, family law is their is their jam. That’s what they do. And they are well versed and well respected in high-conflict divorces because this is what that is going to be. Okay. So back to the questions. Do you specialize? Or is this just part of your, part of your practice? How long have you been practicing family law? How many family law cases have you handled? Are you a certified family law specialist? So that’s all-in question one. Actually, this is more than 10 questions. That’s okay.

Second question. What is your strategy for my case? How long do you think it will take to resolve my case now, they may or may not be able to give you an exact answer but going into an attorney and being honest with them, letting them know what kind of person they’re up against, you know, they can kind of give you an idea. And I’m telling you, right? If it’s a nope, if it’s a non-contested divorce, it can be done within a year. Overdone finito, bye-bye out here. If they are going to use the court system to punish you, if they are going to continually fight you on everything, if they’re going to file motion after motion, you’re looking at a good three years, seriously. So yes, it can go on for that long and or longer if you’ve got judges that are unwilling to acknowledge, hey, dragging the person back into court over every little thing is not helping the kid. Thank you very much. You know what I’m saying and that they’re using the court system as a way to financially abuse. So yeah, so there is that? Okay, um, what is your strategy? How long will it take to resolve, but they can give you a general idea. And I think that’s important because I think a lot of people go into divorce cases thinking, well, I want out, so why should it take a long time? Well, unfortunately, when you’re dealing with custody, and you’re dealing with money, and you’re dealing with assets, and you’re dealing with property, and you’re dealing with a disordered jackwagon, that may possibly be your attorney and or your judge, got to be careful of that. Don’t pick a narcissistic attorney. Be super careful of that. Because there are a lot of narcissists in law, just like there’s a lot of narcissists in the psychiatric psychiatry, and counseling, and psychology, there are a lot of narcissists in the in the law area. So be careful of that. You don’t want a narcissist as your attorney, and you certainly don’t want one as your judge, but you don’t have that much control over the judge. So, all right.

Okay, how long do you take to return phone calls? Hugely important. I have had clients in tears, telling me that they have called their attorney and never hear from them. Like they just dropped off the face of the planet, or like a month later, they return the call or whatever. Now I realize, and you’ve got to realize, the attorney is not emotionally invested like you are. They’re not. They’re not your therapist, okay? They’re not emotionally invested. It’s a job. Seriously, it’s a job. So, they don’t think sometimes they, especially the narcissistic ones, don’t get involved with one of those. But they don’t get the emotional toll that divorcing a narcissist divorcing a psychopath divorcing, a dark triad takes on the client. And part of our issue is, is the stonewalling that we got from our family of origin or from our abuser. And so, when an attorney does that, it’s like adding insult to injury. So yes, it is really important to talk to them. It’s like, what how long do you take to return phone calls? What can I expect? What do you think an emergency is? Because what I think is an emergency and what you think is an emergency may be two entirely different things, realize you’ve got to talk through this.

Kris Godinez  23:13

Okay. How long will it take to return phone calls? How do I get a hold of you if there is an emergency? Super important. Well, anyone else, this is number four. Now, will anyone else in your office be working on my case? And this is a hugely important question to ask. So, in some of the mega firms, they hand off the cases they’ll, you know, there’ll be the face of the firm… And oh, yes, well, I can handle your case. And this, that, and the other thing, and then the next thing, you know, they’re turning it over to a junior partner, or they’re turning it over to a paralegal, or they’re turning it over to somebody else in the firm. No, no, no, no, no! You don’t want your case going from around the firm. You need somebody who’s the point of contact, who knows what’s going on, who you can talk to, who you trust, etc., etc., etc. So, I don’t recommend going with one of these, you know, mega-firms that has advertising in six different states, I think, you know, the ones I’m talking about. So yeah, you want to be really careful of that. Okay, who will be working in my case? That’s really important to know. And if he has, usually he or she will have a paralegal; they’re the ones that do a lot of the legwork. You want to talk to the paralegal as well; you want to make sure to meet them. So, you know that the whole thing is a good experience and that you guys have got rapport. This is no different than making sure you’ve got good rapport with your therapist. Super important. You got to; you got to meet the paralegal. Do you like them? Do you trust them? It’s, and we don’t have a whole lot of trust. So, it’s really important to meet them and make sure you know who is going to be working on your case.

Okay, how will you charge me? What is your hourly rate? hugely important. Do you charge for the time I spend with other lawyers, with paralegals, and or with secretaries? And if so, at what rate? What is your retainer up front? So, most attorneys, not all, but most good attorneys, tell you all this. They’ll tell you what the rate is. They’ll tell you how they charge. Do they charge every 15 minutes? Do they charge by the hour? Do they charge, you know, what is their retainer fee? A lot of attorneys charge at least a $5,000 retainer fee to be used as the court case goes on. Which again, this is how abusers abuse. Is that they know that there is charging every single time an attorney has to get involved, which is why they file frivolous motion after frivolous motion. If you have a good attorney that’s worth their salt, they’re going to counter file and put it back on them and force them to pay for it. So, talk about this stuff with your attorney. They need to be willing to be aggressive, be aggressive; seriously, they’ve got to be aggressive. They cannot be one of these wallflowers. Oh don’t want to offend anybody. No! When you’re dealing with a jackwagon that’s willing to bankrupt you. You’ve got to have an attorney that’s willing to go nose to nose with those mother Cluckers. You see where I’m going with that. So, you’ve got to get a good attorney that is willing to stand up to them and some attorneys are intimidated and terrified by the narcissist and realize the narcissist will go out and find an attorney that is exactly like them, unethical, loud, confrontational, constantly sending stuff, constantly trying to run the, the money out etcetera, etcetera, etcetera.

So, yeah. Okay, back to the questions. Okay, how will you charge me… did that? What is your retainer? What is your retainer upfront? What costs other than your own do you expect will be involved, for example, private investigators, forensic accountants, physicians, and or psychologists, and how will you charge me for them? So, if you’re having to do a psych eval on the whole family, like if your ex is cuckoo for Cocoa Puffs, dark triad abusive, has beat the kids as beat you, etc. And you need to show the court that they are personality disordered, etc., etc., etc. You’re going to have to have a psych eval done, and they’re going to, at least in Arizona. My understanding of it is that they make the entire family have a psych eval. And it’s a crapshoot. I’ve had it work for my client. I’ve had it work against my client, depending on who is doing the evaluation and what their expertise is, how long they’ve been doing it, and do they understand narcissistic abuse? Oh, god, okay. All right.

So, you want to know what the other costs are going to be? So, you can start saving up for them. Okay. What is your estimate? Do not be alarmed that most divorce attorneys will resist answering this question, as the cost of the divorce depends greatly upon the level of conflict in your case. However, the way attorneys answer this question may help you to size them up. An honest attorney will often answer that it is difficult to estimate the costs in advance. An attorney that gives you an unrealistically low ball amount may just be trying to get your business; I think this is hugely important. And you know, you don’t, you don’t want to go with a lowball amount because you’ve got to realize, if you’re in a high conflict, divorce, it can last three years. And depending on how crazy they are and how much money they’re willing to spend to bankrupt you. They will just keep demanding that their attorney file motion after motion after motion, which is why I’m saying you need a good attorney to go nose to nose to go Oh, yeah, well, I’m counter-filing. And we’re asking attorney’s fees. If I could throw a middle finger right now in that direction I would. So do you see where I’m going with that? So that is hugely important. And it does help you size them up.  A good attorney is just going to be like, well, I can’t give you an exact amount. You know, it depends on how much conflict there is, how many motions they file, how much frivolous stuff they’re doing. So, watch their answer. If they give you a lowball amount. Do not go with them. Do not go with them.

Do you allow me to negotiate directly with my spouse? Some attorneys do some attorneys don’t. How can I keep the cost of my divorce down? Are there tasks that I can do myself to cut the amount that you will charge me, and this is an important question because some of the stuff you can do yourself. Like for example, if you’re having to get like bank accounts and this, that and the other thing, you could probably do a lot of that yourself. And frankly, a lot of the clients that I work with do a lot of the running around and almost paralegal work themselves, you know, like getting information and gathering stuff and printing stuff up and things like that. So, you do what you can excuse me, you do what you can to cut down on the cost. Now something that some attorneys will do not all, some of them will barter. So, some of them will be like, Okay, well, you know, you’ve got this gun collection, I would love to have that gun collection, and we’ll you know, let’s get an estimate. And we’ll put that towards the cost of the divorce. So, you can do that as well. If you have stuff that you want to barter with them, you can ask. The worst they can say is now the best they can say is yeah, let’s barter, which is excellent.

Okay, got that. Based on what you know about my case? How would you predict a judge would rule on it? Well, now that’s kind of a hard question because it depends on the judge. Some judges are with it some, believe it or not. They’re out there. Some judges get it. Some judges are like, Oh, no, not going to put up with the abuse. Thanks for playing bye. Other judge’s narcissistic POS is that, yeah, that would rule for the abuser. And it’s happened, and I’ve had several cases where it escalated to the point where there was involving the bar because it was clear that there was a lot of unethical stuff going on. So, it just I… It makes my head hurt. Okay. All right.

Um, what can you do to help me understand the tax effects of the decisions I will have to make. So that is something a lot of people don’t think about. They don’t think about taxes. They don’t think about, you know, having to redo their will, etc., etc., etc. So, a good attorney will answer your questions, and we’ll be kind about it now, um, you know that I love my guy, Brett Bryson’s my dude. And he is a poker player, man, when he’s in attorney mode. I can’t read him at all. So, he does come across as kind of distant, but that’s a good thing. You want an attorney who is poker face gray rock because that will do two things that doesn’t give away what you’re doing. And it riles up the opposition, and when the opposition gets riled up. I know if I told you the story, I’m pretty sure I did. We had a court case once where we had to go against this attorney. That was just… there’s no nice way to say it. Bat Shimomo crazy. I mean, the attorney was nuts as nuts as the other person. Do you see where I’m going with that?

Kris Godinez  32:28

And the calmer we got, the more wound up the other guy got, and the more the judge sided with us. So that’s what you want. All right. Okay. All right. So, let’s see. Okay. All right. So, we’ve got the whole getting the attorney thing. So, I’m going to go a little longer on the explanation, I will get to the questions and if I don’t get to all of them, I will get to them on Wednesday. Okay, so let me back it up.

So this one is called the divorce process, a step-by-step guide, and this is on Forbes, advisor, Forbes advisor, the divorce process a step-by-step guide. Okay. Um, all right. Okay, there are different types of divorce, and there’s separation, as well. If you decide to separate and you do a formal separation, it can help stop with the financial abuse. So, in other words, if they are using your credit cards, running up debt, etc., etc. and you file for a formal separation, all financial obligations stops at that point, and you’re only responsible for your stuff. So that is one reason you would do that. I personally would just go straight for the divorce if you’re with an abuser, but that’s just me. There are different types of divorce, including fault and no-fault most places have no-fault divorce, and I really don’t want to see fault divorce coming back because then you have to prove to the judge why you have to get divorced, and the judge gets to decide whether you get divorced or not. And that’s exactly what narcissists want. All right, there’s separation.

Divorce cannot happen overnight. And that is the biggest mistake I see most people make is that they think it should be quick. Now, in an uncontested divorce. Yeah, it can be done in as little as three months, you bet. With a contested divorce, you can be looking at years, so and there’s a waiting period. So, in Arizona, they force you to wait, I think it’s 60 days. It’s like a cooling off period, which to me just says ability for the abuser to continue to abuse period, stalk, etc. Don’t get me started it. It blows my mind that the state is unwilling to allow adults to go Yeah, we’re done. Yeah, we’re finished. Yeah, let’s get it done. You know, it’s like, oh, well, you need a cooling off period, according to who. All that does is give the dark triad a chance to abuse, stalk, harass, intimidate, etc., etc., etc. So that’s just my opinion. I’m just on a roll here. Okay. There’s a waiting period, it could range from as few little as few weeks to as long as a year depending on the state, although there are some locations that don’t impose a waiting period at all, which I wish none of them had waiting periods. During the waiting period, you may be formally or informally separated from your spouse if you are informally separated, you live apart. In some states, you can do this in the same house. If you are legally separated, you have a written agreement, or order about money Custody and Support. This can be helpful if your spouse is not being cooperative, which I don’t think a lot of abusers are… no none are. For example, by not allowing you access to your home your children or denying you financial help that you need. It is very important you understand whether your state requires a period of separation before your marriage ends and how your state defines separation. Otherwise, you could end up delaying your own divorce. An experienced divorce attorney can explain this aspect of the divorce process where you live. That’s why it’s so important to get an attorney even if you cannot have one represent you because I know they’re expensive, and I know not everybody’s got the money to do the retainer fee, go in and speaking to a retired attorney, you’re going to need their help. You’re going to need help filling out the paperwork you need. You’re going to need somebody to explain to you how the system works, you’re going to need somebody to explain to you what’s in your best interest, what’s in the children’s best interest, etc., etc., etc.

So, look at places like Catholic Charities Fresh Start Women’s Resource Center. You know, ask around universities. A lot of times, retired attorneys will do seminars and help people fill out paperwork and things like that they cannot represent them in court, but they can at least cut some of the costs by doing the paperwork and showing you how to do a filing showing you how to get it served etcetera. Okay. Doo doo.

Okay, grounds for divorce. All states allow all states allowed no-fault divorce, which is good. You don’t have to prove wrong doing or justification. It’s just based on the fact that you and your spouse have irreconcilable differences, and no-fault divorce is granted even if your spouse does not want the divorce. So that’s good. Some states allow for fault divorces. This means there are specific grounds for divorce, such as abuse, abandonment, or adultery. But then I’ve seen abusers use that to get to the target. Fault divorces can be more complicated and expensive. But you may request a fault divorce for several reasons. You may want it on record that you believe the other party was to blame for your breakup. Or you may think it can influence the court’s decision about issues such as asset division custody, proving your spouse wronged you. Here’s what you need to know. The courts really and truly give zero clucks. Zero, they don’t care. At any one point in time. All of the judges, at least here in Maricopa County, have got 800 Plus cases on their dockets 800 Plus. They don’t give a click who did what they really truly don’t, I do not recommend doing that. So, all they want, and if you want to get on the good the judge’s good side, they just want you off their docket, they want you off their docket, just be reasonable. That’s really what they’re looking for is reasonable. You know, everything here is 50/50 custody 50/50 Everything. So, you want to be reasonable, you want to show that you are the reasonable one, you do not want to bring in the emotion, okay, judges don’t care. They want you off their docket. Let’s be real. Okay. So, there is that, um.

Filing for divorce filing is one of the most crucial steps in the divorce. In this process part of the process, you actually file paperwork with the court to begin the process of formally dissolving your marriage. If your state imposes a waiting period, make sure you have been separated for the required length of time before filing for divorce so you don’t have to start the process all over again. You may also need to make sure you file your petition for divorce in the appropriate court. This is usually the family or divorce court in the county in which you reside. You or your spouse reside as there are residency requirements in most locations, you will need to provide some crucial information in your petition, including names and contact information for you and your spouse, the grounds for the divorce, whether you have children, if so personally identifying information, ages and locations and what you desire with regards to the division of property and child custody, as well as whether you were asking for alimony or child support. Then you’re going to have to have it served when you file for divorce; your spouse must be formally served. Now what I’ve seen abusers do is they hide; they know the divorce is coming. They don’t want to end it. Remember, they would have rather have a messed-up connection to somebody than no connection at all. So, they’ll hide it. It’s a very immature way of operating. It’s kind of like, oh, well, if they can’t get a hold of me, they can’t divorce me. Oh, contraire. So, there’s other ways of getting that served. So, if you cannot find them, let’s see where that goes. Okay, if you don’t know the location of your spouse, you still need to attempt to ensure that they have received notice of the divorce filing. You can do this by publishing notices in local newspapers if the court gives you permission. And I don’t even know how that works anymore because who reads the newspapers seriously? Before you can move forward with the divorce process, you must be able to provide proof to the court that your spouse was served, or that you attempted to serve the papers. So, you can have the sheriff serve the papers, or you can hire a processor to do it. And basically, they keep a record of how many times they attempted to serve the papers, etc., etc., etc. So that’s probably a good way to go.

Kris Godinez  41:14

Response or default divorce. In most cases, when you serve your partner the divorce papers, they have a set period of times to respond. If your partner does not do so, you can petition the court and request a default divorce, also sometimes called an uncontested divorce. Now this does sometimes happen. And if that happens, that’s when you throw yourself down on the ground, and you praise Jesus or Buddha or Buddha Baba, or I don’t care, because that is unusual with the abuser, sometimes it does happen because they can’t be bothered, or they don’t want to spend the money or whatever. So, but if you get that, you’re thank your lucky stars because that’s what you want. So typically, however, your spouse will respond after you have filed the petition for divorce. This means your spouse will have to submit an answer to your initial petition. Your spouse might agree with you in the answer or may disagree with your assertations. Your spouse can also file a counter-complaint and introduce new allegations or information for the court to consider. If your spouse responds, they typically must serve you with a copy of that response and provide proof of this service to the court in order for proceedings to continue.

So, something I have seen abusers do is they don’t make sure that the other person has got the response or whatever. And then the other person has to continually watch the docket the court docket, so you do want to keep your eye on the court docket to make sure that they’re not pushing something through that you don’t know anything about. Because they’re looking for the no fault on your part. Did I mention they are sneaky little… Yeah. So, you want to keep an eye on the court docket, you want to make sure that nothing involving you is coming up that you don’t know about. I’ve seen them do that too.

Temporary hearings. In some cases, a temporary hearing will be held after the petition for divorce is filed. But before the official court proceedings begin to develop dissolve the marriage. This is typically likely in states where there’s a long waiting period between the time the couple separates and the time the divorce can take place. In the temporary hearing the court can address issues that are that are unable to wait until the full trial. So temporary custody agreement awarding temporary financial support for spouses or children, putting a domestic violence restraining order in place putting restrictions on the sale of joint assets or bring in appropriate division of expenses during the divorce proceedings.

All right, and then you have discovery and preparation. Once the case begins, your attorney will gather evidence they may subpoena documentation hold disposition, depositions, not dispositions depositions, or send questions to the opposing counsel. Then you have the settlement or the trial. That final step before your marriage is dissolved involves either negotiating a divorce settlement divorce the court can sign off on or going to trial to decide how support, custody and division of assets will work. It is generally best if you can move forward with an uncontested divorce in which you and your spouse come to an agreement on the issues involved in ending your marriage. Now, I do want to have a caveat here. What I have seen survivors of abuse do is they give up literally everything. I do not recommend that. Because that’s a bad idea. Because they keep thinking, Oh, if I just give them everything they want, they’ll leave me alone. What ends up happening is they go, Oh, I got everything I wanted. And I’m going to continue to abuse them. So don’t give them everything. It 50/50 fair. You want to be fair. You want to be according to the state laws or the state rules. You want to show that you’re being reasonable. So, if they come back and you’re offering 50/50, and they come back and they’re like I want it all, the judge is going to look at them and go, Ah, no, we’re not doing that. So anyway. Oh god, I’m okay.

Okay, you may wish to work with a mediator if you can’t come to an agreement on your own.

Sometimes mediation works most of the time; with an abuser, it doesn’t. Negotiating an out-of-court settlement can save you money and help you come up with a settlement. If you cannot come to a consensus on the issues raised near divorce, you will need to proceed to trial. During the trial, each party can argue their case, including presenting witnesses and evidence. The court will consider the details as well as the state laws governing the division of custody and property when deciding contested issues during divorce.

Do you need an attorney? I would say yes because I’ve seen them hire just nasty, awful, horrible attorneys that will take advantage of the fact that the spouse doesn’t know the court system. That’s why I would say yes. Although you can learn about the divorce process step by step, it can still be challenging to complete all of the legal requirements, and there are a lot an experienced divorce attorneys there for you during all steps of the divorce. Your lawyer helps you understand the requirements, files the right paperwork in a timely, timely manner negotiates a fair settlement, and maximizes the chance that you end up with a divorce judgment that you are okay with. Um, all right. So, there is that that is Forbes advisor, one last one and then we’ll get to the questions. No, that’s it No, yes.

Six strategies for surviving a high conflict divorce. So, when we’re dealing with a disordered person, they’re going to demonize the other person; they’re going to have a destructive communication pattern. This is on divorce net six strategies for surviving a high-conflict divorce. They’re going to constantly argue about the divorce issues with no end in sight. The needs of the children in the backburner; they don’t give a damn, they just want to get you. They want the divorce drama. And they want to make you feel powerless. So, the person that you’re up against has got rigid demands and thinking black and white thinking blaming others playing the victim, unmanaged emotions, and extreme behaviors or threats. A high conflict person will often escalate small disagreements into major battles. They may feel under attack or like they are being put down or controlled. Bill Eddie, one of the founders of the high conflict Institute, estimates that about 10% of the US population has a high-conflict personality. Honestly, it’s higher than that!

High-conflict person or high-conflict personality disorder. So, most of the high conflict flicked divorce cases you will see. And this is according to Eddie, they have either antisocial, borderline, histrionic or narcissistic, which are all cluster B’s big surprise there. You want to be careful when you are filing for divorce. If you have been with an abuser, they are likely if they’re the dark triad type and they’re the harassing type. And they’re the stalking type; they’re going to be checking your phone, they’re going to be checking your iPad, your computer, etc. So, when you decide to file for divorce, don’t use your own stuff or use stuff that they’ve had no access to, I cannot emphasize that enough. Because they’ve been known to put tracking devices, they’ve been known to put things that will turn on the microphone or the camera or whatever. So just be aware of that.

Strict six strategies from a high-conflict divorce coach, do not broadcast your high-conflict divorce story that is for your therapist. Basically, the abuser will use it against you. So, you don’t want to be running around telling everybody how horrible they are. Now you can tell the truth, for sure. But you don’t. You don’t want to be telling this to everybody because you don’t know what they’re going to use against you. So, you’ve got to be a little careful about that. Don’t disparage your spouse to your children. We’ve talked about that you can talk about behaviors, contrasting behaviors, healthy behavior versus unhealthy behavior, do not name call, do not put them down, you know, etc., etc., etc. Don’t respond immediately to every text or email. What narcissists do is they want you to respond immediately. They want you to be in a heightened emotional state so that you say or do something that is going to make you look bad or that you say or do something that they can then use against you at a later date. So, everything you say is going to be used against you at a later date. Don’t respond. Give it a cooling-off period, 24 hours 24 hours. That’s reasonable. It’s like you get their text unless it’s an emergency. If it’s an emergency about the kid, then yeah, you got to respond to that. But if they are baiting you and they’re taunting you, and they’re throwing out, you know you did this, you did that, you guns, etc., etc., etc. Don’t respond ever, period. It has to be directly related to either the divorce or to the kid if it’s related to the divorce sort of the kid, then you can respond. But give yourself a cooling-off period. Let yourself chill out, write it out a few times and then respond, do not immediately respond because that’s what they’re doing. They’re poking the bear, trying to get you to respond immediately and say or do something that will make you look bad in the court. Keep communications and neutral, brief, informative. Only provide necessary information, do not overshare, do not overshare, do not overshare. Did I mention don’t overshare, do not explain yourself. You don’t have to explain yourself. Stick to the topic at hand. And if it’s irrelevant, you don’t even respond. Keep it civil, don’t get snarky, don’t get passive-aggressive, don’t get anything. It’s not going to do any good. Keep it civil but be very firm. So firm. No, we’re not talking about this. No, I’m not going to respond to that. No, you’re going to have to talk to my attorney. Okay, no emotion, no emotion.

Shift from blaming to problem-solving. So, when they love to do the whole, well, this is a problem. And this is a problem. And this is a problem. One thing you can do is you can say, Okay, well what’s your idea of the solution?

Kris Godinez  51:12

And nine times out of 10, they blow up because that’s not what they want. They don’t want it back in their court. They wanted to use this as a way to upset you. And so, they can’t come up with a solution because they don’t want a solution, which then works in your favor. Because remember, all communication. Listen to me. Now, believe me, later, all communication is going to be written. You’re not going to do phone calls, ever. Why? Because they can say XY and Z on the phone. And then when you go to honor that, oh, I never said that. That never happened. Or you said this, that, and the other thing. And then, of course, that didn’t happen. So, everything is going to be written either text or email. Our family wizard excellent. Make sure that’s in your divorce decree. Everything has to be through our family wizard. And you’re going to keep a record of it. They keep a record of it. It’s Yeah. So do that. No verbal, no verbal communication at all, period. All right. And you put it back on them? How do you have any ideas? How can we solve that? What do you suggest we do? And, of course, they’ll blow up, and you just kind of smile and know that they’re going to blow up and know that that’s going to be seen by the judge. So that’s good. And then if they come back and go, Well, what would you do? You can offer your suggestion, and of course, they’ll have a fit with it. And you just go, okay, well, let’s table it for now. You know, there, because that wasn’t, that’s not the reason they got a hold of you, they got a hold of you to make you upset. So just realize it’s a game, it’s a game for them.

Limit contact after the divorce if you don’t have kids. If your former partner has a high-conflict personality, and you don’t have children, you don’t ever need to contact them again once the divorce is settled. And it is tempting, I know, for people to go, Oh, but I want closure; there is no such thing as closure, guys, there is no such thing as closure, Count yourself lucky that you got out and run, run to the nearest exit as far and as fast as you can and don’t ever look back. Don’t ever look back. You don’t need to contact them. You don’t. If you have children, only contact them if it’s an emergency. And if it has to do with a child. That’s it. That is the only time you are to contact them as if it has to do with the child. And it’s an emergency. If it’s something that can be settled without having the other partner involved, settle it without them, you know, they can piss and whine and moan as much as they want. Hire a high-conflict divorce attorney or mediator that understands these type of personality disorders.

So essentially, when you’re with them, you’re going to gray rock. When you’re on the stand, you’re going to carry a bottle of water with you. And every single time the opposing attorney asks you a question, you’re going to unscrew it; just take a sip of water. And then you give your answer, and you’re doing this because this is going to buy you time to think. And if you’ve got an attorney, that work is worth their payment; they’re going to prep you before the case; they’re going to prep you before the court because they need to get you ready for how to deal with a really aggressive attorney that’s trying to rattle you. And if you really want to piss them off, get that water bottle and take a sip before you answer every question now, what the attorney is going to do. If they’re unethical, and they’re not good people, they’re going to do the whole two-part question. So, one part of the answer could be yes; the other part could be No. If you get a two-part question, you’re going to play dumb. I’m sorry, I don’t understand the question. Can you rephrase that? And you keep doing that until those sons of beetches get it down to a yes or no? And then you can answer yes or no. You want to keep your answers yes or no, no explanation. And how I see people hanging themselves is they start trying the inner child, inner child starts coming out and trying to appease trying to find to that aggressive attorney absofreakinglutely not! This is why you got to get your inner child handled before you go into court because otherwise, you’re going to sabotage yourself. So, there is that good lord I have talked the entire time.

Alright, let me get to some of the questions. I don’t think I’m going to be able to answer all of them. Okay, how to stop or reduce contact with an ill abusive parent? Doctors told me to avoid stressing my mother as it would worsen her condition. So, I fear pulling away will negatively affect her health, not your problem. If they’re abusive and they’re ill. You pull away. It’s not your problem. Get with a good trauma therapist get with a good trauma therapist. You don’t need to take care of them. She’s ill. She’s abusive. If she wanted somebody to be around her, how about she not be a jackwagon? So, you have to do what you can live with. But if she’s abusive, and she’s continuing to be abusive, even though she’s on her deathbed, there is nothing on the face of the planet that says you have to stick around and put up with that. So, get with a good trauma therapist and start working on that.

Okay, what if I’m doing techniques and even the thinking the right things, but still stressed out? I’m okay, hourly, but my mind is doing flips, if that makes sense. Okay, so sometimes we have been under such duress for so long. those neural pathways are super wired to be like high alert; you may want to look into anti-anxiety meds seriously if you’re having repetitive thoughts, you’re ruminating, it keeps coming back. It keeps coming back it keeps coming back no matter how many times you do the thought, stopping and replacing with the positive, it may be time to look at anti-anxiety meds. So that would be my suggestion. Okay, let me get to this last one. Because I’m running out of time.

Are flying monkeys? Whoa, are flying monkeys brainwashed by the narc and then become narcs themselves? Flying monkeys are one of two things. They are either ignorant. They just don’t understand that there can be this level of evil in the world. And they don’t understand that the abuser is really truly abusive; they can’t wrap their head around it; they’re ignorant they don’t get narcissistic abuse, or they are minor narcissists themselves attracted to the major narcissist, so that’s what flying monkeys are. If after you’ve explained to them that this person is abusive, and they’re still in contact with them, then you’re dealing with a minor narcissist. Absolutely. If they stop contact with them, and they realize, oh my god, I didn’t know you went through all of that. Holy crap. I’m so sorry. And they have nothing more to do with that person than they were just ignorant. And there are those are the two types. It says either ignorance the ignorancey wow, I just made a new word. It’s either ignorant or it’s there are minor narcissists themselves. Okay, kids, I think that is it. I will get to the questions that I didn’t get to. I know there were other ones. So, I will get to that on Wednesday.

So, on Sunday, next Sunday, I’m going to be talking about flim-flam artists, Grifters, con men con women. We’re going to talk about all of that because, guess what, they are all cluster B’s. So, we’re going to be talking about how to watch out for that because I have noticed a huge increase in all of the scams coming through on the email and things like that. Also, if you guys could do me a huge favor. I don’t know what YouTube is doing. I’m losing subscribers, I’m losing listeners. I’m losing likes, I’m losing everything because they’ve. I don’t know what they’re doing. If you could please share these videos with people, that would be great. Like, Subscribe, etc. That would be awesome. So anyway, that’s it. All right kids. I will talk to you on Wednesday, and the next Sunday is going to be flim-flam con artists grifters. All right, talk to you, then you guys be good to yourselves and each other. Drink plenty of water, and I will talk to you later.

Thank you so much for listening to this podcast. You can always listen live on YouTube every week Sunday at noon, Arizona Mountain Standard Time. And if you want to find out more or listen to other episodes, you can go to Krisgodinez.com and if you have a chance, subscribe to this show on whatever podcast app you use and let other people know about. I want to thank my sponsor betterhelp.com. They are an online therapy company. Whether you are in the US or international. They will set you up with a qualified licensed therapist. PhD level or Master’s level. If you are interested in more information, go to betterhelp.com/krisgodinez.

You’ve been listening to the podcast version of We Need To Talk with Kris Godinez.

The post 07-30-2023 What You Need To Know About Court appeared first on Kris Godinez.

Have you ever had your parent’s voice come flying out of your mouth? Nine times out of ten that happened when you were stressed out, and it was a knee-jerk reaction. What can you do when that happens? Are you aware of all of the bad parenting that your dysfunctional family of origin gave you and how that plays out in your own parenting?

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Hello and welcome to We Need To Talk with Kris Godinez podcast. I’m your host Kris Godinez, licensed professional counselor. I help people get out of, and stay out of, toxic relationships. This podcast is for informational and educational purposes only the views and opinions stated herein are mine and mine alone. They do not represent the ACA, the APA, or any other therapist for that matter.

I want to thank my sponsor betterhelp.com. They are an online therapy company. Whether you are in the US or international. They will set you up with a qualified licensed therapist. PhD level or Master’s level. If you are interested in more information, go to betterhelp.com/krisgodinez.

Okay, so a couple of things. Obviously, I am in the car, I am not driving. Thank you very much. John is driving. We are on our way back from our epic “Let’s avoid the heat” trip. Which we did pretty good, but it’s still gonna be what 110 Today, 107, 113 Yay, Phoenix. Anyway, so um, so we’re on the way back to the house, we’re probably gonna get to the house in the middle of all this. So just bear with me during the craziness as we unload the dogs. So. All right, a couple of announcements I wanted to make. I will be doing my next meet and greet in Salt Lake City. Those tickets are available on me. Hey Andrea, those tickets are available on KrisGodinez.com. So I will be in Salt Lake City if you wish to go see me there, and we’ll have a good chat and all that sort of good stuff. I haven’t come up with the next one after that. The one that I do have planned is in Florida. So that will be on December 2 will be in Florida. August 26 will be Salt Lake City. So, if you want to get your tickets go get ‘em because I’m trying to figure out how to pack let me know alright?

Current event, so I wanted to talk about the strike the AFTRA, SAG, writer strike etc. etc. I am 100% for it. I am remembering I my degree my bachelor’s degree is in theater arts. So, my heart lives with the actors. So, I agree with them. I think what they’re fighting for is right. As much as I love Bob Iger, he makes what did they say, 73 million a year or something like that, something ridiculous. And he’s complaining about them wanting to be compensated for their likenesses and their voices and things like that. Part of the issue is that they’re saying the AI can mimic their appearance and mimic their voice, and not cool man pay them for it. That’s weak. That’s how do you wouldn’t demand that your dentist work for free. Why are they demanding that actors work for free? Do you see where I’m going with that? And if you want to know why I support unions, read the jungle by Upton Sinclair. It’s all about the meatpacking industry in the early 1900s. And how brutal it was, and how they didn’t care about the workers. They didn’t care whether somebody got hurt. They didn’t care if they fell into the machines or got ground up into hamburger meat. So, it’s a really good book. So, I would strongly suggest reading it. Workers need to be valued. Their work needs to be valued, no matter what their work is. It’s like I have this sense that some of these narcissists who were CEOs are like, Oh, well, you know, you’re just a this. So, therefore, you don’t need compensation. Well, that’s a real narcissistic attitude. That even the people who are fixing our food have value, and they are valuable to us because they provide a service, pay them enough to make enough to get an apartment and have a car and pay for gas. That’s all they’re asking. So anyway, that is my current event. And there you have it, why I support you.

So, I’m all right today. We are talking about bad parenting. So, I think there is not a survivor out there. That came from a narcissistic family that hasn’t experienced bad parenting, and we tend to pick up fleas from that. So, I just want to validate that our go to our knee-jerk reaction when we’re super triggered. And we’re super upset and very emotional is going to probably be one of the things that our parents did to us. So, first of all, I just want you to acknowledge that that’s going to happen. It’s going to happen we’re going to have Please. So, something to think about. And this isn’t bad parenting. This is just. This is just kind of an FYI. When we have kids, okay. And our children hit the age that we were, when we got abused, we’re going to find ourselves triggered like nobody’s business, and we may or may not be able to put together why. So that is just something to think about is that when we have children and our children hit the age that we were, when we were abused, we’re going to get triggered, and everything is going to be very, very hyper, hyper vigilant, hyper aware, triggering, etc., etc. Sometimes when we get triggered, we are going to have our parents pop out of our mouth. So, but the difference between a bad parent and a good parent, a good parent, as soon as they know that their parents have popped out of their mouths, they are going to go, Oh my gosh, that was my mom. That was my dad, that is not you. I am so sorry. Let me make amends. I want to make sure you’re okay, that wasn’t okay for me to yell at you, or whatever. Do you see where I’m going? Whereas a bad parent just does the behavior doesn’t own, it doesn’t take ownership, doesn’t try to make sure the kid is not getting damaged. Does that make sense?

So, one of the things so basically, forgive yourself, it’s going to happen. You know, when we come out of these abusive relationships, especially family of origin, we’re going to have fleas, we’re going to do things that our parents did or said, but as soon as you catch it, you make amends, fix it, you make sure the kid is okay. Mentally and emotionally, physically, whatever. And you make sure that it doesn’t happen again. You nail down that flea. Squish that flea. So bad parenting. I want to talk about some things I have seen parents, bad parents, narcissistic parents do in divorce and not divorce and in staying with the abuser, etc., etc. So, what somebody asked me a question, can you talk more about narcissistic mothers and emotional incest? Okay, so emotional incest does not just happen with narcissistic mothers. It also happens with narcissistic fathers; it can happen to either sex of the child can either be the son or the daughter doesn’t matter. And what emotional incest is, is it the parent, the narcissistic parent, or the disordered parent, dumps into the kid, all of this emotional stuff, so they use the kid as a confidant, or they use the kid as a counselor, or they use the kid as a secret sharer. You know, they tell the child about the affair that they’re having. But don’t tell mommy, don’t tell daddy, whatever. Or they overshare they tell the child way too much about what’s going on. You know, my mom did that a lot. They use the child as a counselor, try to get them to fix their problems, etc., etc. So that is emotional. incest that is absolutely emotional incest.

So, you want to make sure that you’re not oversharing with your kids. And if you have a parent that is doing that, they will continue to do that no matter how old you are. You’ve got to be the one to put a stop to it. You’ve got to be the one that says nope, no more, we’re not doing this. I’m not listening. This is not my job. I can’t handle this; I can’t deal with this. You know, you need a therapist, here’s the number, you know, that kind of thing. So bad parents will do that. And you’ve got to realize that parents will be bad parents until the day they die. They don’t stop. They just don’t. If they’re narcissists, they don’t stop. If they’re not narcissists, you know, they can, they can have some growth, okay? But, if they’re truly disordered, and if they’re truly harming, and if they’re truly doing things like emotional incest, they don’t ever stop. They will never ever stop being inappropriate and what they say or what they do, or you know, how much they overshare or things like that. So, for us, when we’re faced with a bad parent, a parent who’s just inappropriate, you have to be the one to put the brakes on it. You’ve got to be the one to go thank you for wanting to share this with me. I am not interested in being your secret holder. I am not interested in being your therapist. Here’s the name of a therapist. And if you continue, this conversation is over. Now, they’re not going to like it. They’re not absolutely 110%. Remember, it’s a power and control issue. So, they want to make you feel fear, obligation, and guilt. F.O.G. right.

Kris Godinez  09:51

So, if you’re the secret holder going around the corner, okay? If you’re the secret holder, then you’re you’ve got a lot of burden on you on necessarily so. And if you accidentally say something, you know, let something slip, then it’s all your fault. So, for example, and I’ve had this happen, the abuser told one of the teenagers that he was having an affair. And the kid obviously went to the mom and said something, and then the dad and I use that in bunny ears because that’s not a dad. That’s a sperm donor, then blamed the child for the breakup of the marriage. So that’s bad parenting, that is 110%. bad parenting. That’s too much of a burden for the child. Children should not be given adult secrets ever, ever. So, another thing that I see in divorce, besides the emotional incest, is let’s talk about the whole bad-mouthing the other party. Now, a lot of people mistake not bad-mouthing the other party who’s disordered and is abusive, with being quiet and condoning it somehow no, no, no, no, no, no.  There’s a big difference between pointing out behavior and bad-mouthing. Let’s talk about that. So bad parenting is bad-mouthing the other parent, calling them names, putting them down, doing essentially what a narcissist does, right? Name Calling put-downs, discards, devalues, etc. But what you can do is you can point out the behavior. Okay, your mom is doing this. But healthy people do this. Can you see the difference? That’s all you got to do. And that’s not putting them down. That’s not name-calling. That’s not. You’re calling out the behavior. So, you always want to point to the behavior. How are they behaving? What is their behavior? What is going on? Does that make sense? So bad parenting is where obviously parental alienation. But again, what is the motivation of that particular bad parenting thing?

So, let’s talk about this. Most of the time, when narcissists, malignant borderlines, malignant histrionics, etc., do bad parenting, it’s because they have an agenda. Because it’s a power and control. And it’s also maybe I’m abdicating responsibility. So that’s why those parents do what they do. It’s not that they suddenly, you know, decide one day to go through a book, every single stupid thing they could possibly do to a kid, it’s with an intent, there’s, there’s an agenda, there’s something else going on. So, the parental alienation is a power and control issue. The parental alienation is to get that child away from the healthy parent and siding with the abuser because then they can go…Hah! See, my child loves me more than you. That is not healthy parenting. Healthy parenting is the kid loves both. But the kid probably sees that there’s issues with one of the parents. That’s healthy parenting. So, it’s not a matter of getting them on your side, it’s not a matter of win-lose, you know, because that’s black and white thinking that’s splitting. And narcissists always have to win. And that’s why they do parental alienation. It’s not because they love their child and they want all of their attention all the time. Nine times out of 10, what I see happening is they do the parental alienation. They get the child full-time, either legally, or the child just says I don’t want to go over anymore. Because, you know, dad or mom says you did this, that the other thing and the child chooses to stay with the abuser. But then once they get the child, they start giving up time with them, or they don’t spend time with them, or they slough them off onto a babysitter or they, you know, start complaining about how expensive they are or whatever. And eventually, what I’ve also seen is that kid go back to the other parent and just go, okay, I get it, I saw it firsthand, I see this now, you know what I’m saying. But that’s with a with an abuser. Its parental alienation is a power and control issue. It’s a, I’m going to take something away from you, that is valuable and will hurt you. That’s what this is about. It’s not about spending time with the kid. They could care. They couldn’t care less about. Because they don’t, they don’t if they really truly cared about their child, they would make sure that there was not parental alienation going on.

Now. caveat, here’s another part of bad parenting that I’ve seen. And a lot of people coming out of abusive relationships do this. But it’s important for my child to be with that parent. Full stop. If that parent is abusive, and that parent is not wanting to spend time with that kid, count your lucky stars and take that child and spend as much time with that child if you possibly can, as you possibly can. Because here’s the deal. Narcissists really don’t care. And what I’ve seen also in bad parenting is the divorce will go through. They weren’t really around during the marriage. But then the divorce goes through. And suddenly, they’re gone. The abuser is gone. They’re off trying to find new supply. They’re off with maybe their new family. And they basically ignore the children from the first marriage. That’s what happened with my dad, with his kids. You know, when he married my mom, suddenly, my sisters and I were all, you know, all the thing, and the other two got ignored. So, um, and that’s bad parenting. You don’t do that when you have a kid; you have a kid for life. Like you know even when my mom was in her late 80s, and I was in my 50s, I am in my 50s, the early 50s. You know, she still was like, You’re going to, you’re going to come visit, I love seeing you. Let’s hang out, I miss you. You know, it’s like, she was still parenting me. She was still trying to parent me. And in a good way, not in a bad way. And, but narcissists give up time with their kids. They don’t want to spend time with them, sometimes not all the time sometimes. And they will abandon the child. And instead of going, what a godwink, some parents out of a mistaken thought or idea that that child needs that parent. No, no, no, madam. No, sir. They do not. If they are abusive and that parent has given up time. Thank Your Lucky Stars. You spend that time you mark down how many days are giving up, and then eventually you go back, and you file for full custody, or you file for more child support or whatever it is that you need. So yeah, so bad parenting is based in agendas, okay? It’s an agenda. It’s not what is for the greater good of the kid. It’s always me, me, me I, I, I, more, my genitals. It’s never about what is good for the child. So, I think that is the biggest thing that I see with narcissists and the behaviors that they Hello, the behaviors that they do. So, let’s see. Okay, and because I’m kind of on my own, I’m going to try to do the questions as they come up.

Do narcs tell the child secrets in the hopes that the child would tell the other parents so that they can punish the child? Yes. 110% the other parent so they can. Okay, it turns out, it seems the narc is always looking for a reason to show off and to punish. Yes, 110%. Again, there’s always an agenda. There’s always a game. Always, always, always. There’s always, you know, what’s in it for them. And because they are sadists, bad parents, narcissistic parents absolutely do trick the kids into doing something that will piss off the parent, so they have an excuse to punish them either verbally, or physically or emotionally because that’s just what these wankers do. Mostly, what I see with narcissistic parents. And this is another thing that damages the child incredibly is that they make the child responsible for them; they make the child responsible for their happiness, for their sadness for their being alone; they become parentified the child. So that’s bad parenting. parentified the child is horrible, because it puts, again, an undue burden on that kid to be responsible for things that their little brains cannot be responsible for.

Kris Godinez  18:42

And I’ve seen them parentify children as young as four, like, Oh, you’re four years old, you’re old enough to watch the younger child Nuhu wrong. Okay, I see a question.

Okay. How do you find trust and security after growing up in a chaotic, addicted household, okay? Trust insecurity starts here. It starts with you. You must be able to trust yourself. You must be able to be secure in yourself. And out of that, you will recognize people who are trustworthy versus people who are not trustworthy its trusting your gut. So, my suggestion would be getting The Self-Esteem Workbook by Glenn Schiraldi. That’s, okay that’s another bad parenting. They don’t give us self-esteem. In fact, they give us the opposite. They give us low esteem, they, they teach us to not like ourselves. They teach us to put ourselves down. How we are spoken to as children is what then becomes our inner critic. Let me say that again. How we are spoken to as children becomes our inner critic. That’s what we hear. It just keeps getting spewed out just like, you know, my dad’s big thing was oh, you’re stupid. You’re stupid. You’re stupid. You’re stupid. You’re cute. You’re stupid, right?

And it’s overcoming those messages, so it’s going to be working on your self-esteem. Self Esteem  workbook, Glen Schiraldi. The Disease to Please by Harriet Braiker getting rid of that codependency, The Inner Child Workbooks any of them, I don’t care go grab them work them, because we’re having to undo all of the mistaken thoughts and the mistaken beliefs that our abusers gave to us all of those nasty things they said to us, become our inner dialogue. So, we have to speak to ourselves with absolute kindness and absolute clarity and absolute. What’s the word? I’m looking for? Compassion and gentleness.

Question, Should I run away screaming from these red flags? Yes. If there’s, if there’s red flags, yeah, absolutely. Yeah. If you’ve got enough red flags that it’s starting to look like a communist parade, it’s time to get out. And actually, you want to train yourself so that even when there’s one red flag, you’re like, Okay, I know that one. See, ya wouldn’t want to be ya, you know what I’m saying? So yeah, you absolutely when you start seeing lots and lots of red flags, and there’s no movement or work on their part. They’re a narcissist, because even autistic people work on themselves, okay. They know when they’ve heard somebody, and they don’t like it. narcissists, on the other hand, enjoy it. So that’s kind of that kind of goes with that question that I had last week about autism versus narcissism. Autistic people can be very self-centered or very unemotional. Like, they don’t recognize emotions. But they can work on that. And that changes with them. With narcissists. It does not. So, if somebody is intentionally being avoidant, intentionally not sharing the emotional burden of whatever is going on. That’s a huge red flag. That is a huge red flag, especially if you’ve talked to them about it. And they’re still like, nope, nope, nope, nope, I’m not going to. I’m not going to participate because I’m feeling overwhelmed or threatened, or I don’t know what to do with it. So yeah, you want to be aware of red flags. And you definitely want to pay attention to them, and you want to act on them. You don’t want to just sit there and take it. I’m saying, Okay, so where was I? Okay, bad parenting.

Another thing that bad parents do that narcissists do when the narcissist abandons the kids, so like, makes it clear that they’ve chosen the second family makes it clear that that child is not important to them. And the reason it’s dark in here is because we have all the shades shut, trying to keep it cool. That child starts thinking that they’re not worth it, that, you know, obviously, I have no worth, or my mom or my dad would pay attention to me. So, this is where a lot of abandonment issues come in. So um, I would strongly recommend, again, get with a good trauma therapist if you had parents that called your names, prentified  you put you down, made you feel responsible. ignored you, or shared over shared, that’s all trauma, that is all trauma, all of the bad parenting that we had to put up with any and all of that is trauma. And we are going to get triggered, and we are going to if we don’t work on it if we’re not conscious about it, we start acting it out unconsciously. And you don’t want to do that. That’s why we tend to be attracted to people. That’s why the inner child does the picking. It’s why I keep saying the pickers broken. picker. Okay, hold on.

Is it common for a narcissistic mother to have lost? To have lots of children as a way for security and old age? Yes. 100%. My late narc mother expected children to look after her in her old age and became aggressive when we didn’t yes, that you know what? If you ever watched the movie Like Water for Chocolate, it’s an old movie 1990s. Like Water for Chocolate is all about a family who had these very strict roles that they had to play and generationally in that particular movie. The youngest child was assigned the role of never marrying and staying single and taking care of the mom. That was the role of the youngest child and I’m like, I wouldn’t run away. So it basically, the movie is all about how the youngest child rebels and falls in love, and of course, it has a tragic ending because it was an Academy Award winner what Academy Award winner doesn’t have a tragic ending? Anyway, great movie and that really shows how generational trauma, and it also shows the very confining roles that children are given by a narcissistic mother, so I strongly recommend that one. It’s called Like Water for Chocolate it is in Spanish, I think there is a dubbed version, but I don’t like dubbed versions because they always get it wrong. So, I like the What am I trying to say? The subtitles, thank you the subtitles, because you know, then you can kind of read along and, and all of that. So um, yes, they do have children in order to take care of them. Again, that is giving the child a job that is not theirs.

So, let’s talk a little bit more about that. Another bad parenting thing is that narcissists and disordered people will have children for absolutely the wrong reason. So, they’ll say, Oh, I’m going to have this baby to save my marriage. Please don’t, please, no, no, that is not the thing to do. So, giving a child a job before they’re even born is abusive and not fair. That’s not that kid’s job to save the marriage. Again, too much pressure onto a little one. That’s not their job. Plus, the fact children are extremely stressful to have if you’ve got a narcissistic partner, that partner will be jealous of that child, I can guarantee 110% they will demand that the mom pay attention to the narcissist rather than the new baby. And the baby will be left to cry in the crib. That’s what happened with one of my sisters. They’ll be ignored. They’ll be, you know, a burden you they’ll be, you know, etc., etc., etc.

Okay, can you talk about the Barbie parent one of uses and the other does nothing? Okay, I did a video on this a couple of weeks ago that very quickly. It’s really a frustrating situation. What will happen is that the enabler, let’s call him an enabler rather than a Barbie parent. An enabler will allow the abuse to happen, knows that the abuse is going on. And they’ll do absofreakinlutely, zip. And it’s because of their inner child. Well, but if I intervene, they’ll come after me. But if I intervene, they will punish me. That’s literally what they’re thinking. My mom did the same thing. I think I talked about this, you know, she knew point blank, my dad was abusing me, and I talked about it in my book, What’s Wrong with Your Dad, available on Amazon and audible. But I talked about how she was standing at the window one time he sexually molested me. And she knew what happened. And she was like, well, we don’t want to piss him off. Because, well, you know, we need the money. And what would we do without the money and da, da, da,. And I’m sitting here going, you know, now knowing her family history going, Wow, that was your inner child. So, it gives the message loud and clear that you’re not worth it to protect. That’s really what that saying to that kid. And that’s abusive. It is. Because the message is I’m more worried about me. And I’m not going to put myself out to protect you. So that then sets us up for a lifelong issue with abuse if we don’t work on our self-esteem, which is why I’m saying Self-Esteem Workbook Glen Schiraldi all the start working it because what our parents or non-protecting parents did or did not do had everything to do with them. And absolutely nothing to do with us. 110%.

Kris Godinez  28:39

So yeah, it just is crazy. And then let’s talk about incest, incest. So, my dad molested me. There are mothers, narcissistic mothers that they don’t parentify, they the only word I can hear in my head is they Babyize. That’s not it. But they make the child a child. They take away… infantilize. There we go. They infantize, I’m sorry, it’s been a really long day. We’ve been driving forever. I’m glad we’re home.  So, they infantize the child. That’s another way. So, they tell the child that they’re not competent. They don’t allow the child to cross the street on their own. They don’t allow the child to pick their own friends. They don’t allow the child to have a bank account. They don’t allow the child to learn how to manage money. They don’t allow the child to fill in the blank. And if you take that a step further, the really psychopathic ones turn those kids into second spouse so they will resist allowing the child having their own bedroom and own space and there was one I dealt with where we were just about to call CPS because they refused to get the kid who’s a teenager, their own bed, and I was like I know that technically CPS won’t find anything wrong with that, but knowing who this person is I have tons of issues with that. So um, yeah, absolutely.

Um, Why do narcissists talk about the person to others? The people who are wise to the narc think he’s odd, but it doesn’t seem like he sees that. No, of course, they… so narcissists are all about… it’s a popularity contest, okay, it’s a win or lose popularity contest, I must win, I must have the most likes, I must have all the friends, I must have everything. So, everything is black and white to them… all good, bad, nothing, you know, nothing, everything. You just see where I’m going with that. It’s like very split in their thinking. So, they start trying to gather flying monkeys to them. So, they will literally have seen them call up the parent of the sane spouse and start complaining to the parent about their child, fully expecting that parent to agree with them. Yeah, they’re. They’re cuckoo for Cocoa Puffs. I’m not even kidding you. So, it’s a popularity contest. And it’s a I must win at all costs and smear campaign, and with the smear campaign, they absolutely want to cast aspersions on your character. So, they’re trying to make you untrustworthy, you know, they’re going to lie about you. They’re going to say you did X, Y, and Z when you didn’t. It also helps them look like the victim. Oh, this person did this that and the other thing to me, poor me, boohoo. And they get to play the victim. So, narcissists can flip between the different types of narcissism, they can be the victim, and then other times they can be grandiose, you know, so it just kind of depends.

Okay, trigger warning question. Can a parent molest you without touching you? Yes. That’s verbal incest. That is emotional incest. Sexual talk demanding hugs or touch. Yes, that makes 100% sense. So even though they don’t touch you. And this is something my dad would do. He would always tell the filthiest, and I mean, absolutely disgusting, inappropriate jokes in front of me or to me and expect me to be like, Oh, that’s funny. And so yeah, it is a grooming technique. This is what sexual abusers do is they groom. And they say things like that to gauge your reaction to see how resistant you are to that. So yeah, this is that’s a grooming technique. That’s abuse. 110%.

Okay, question. narcissist is like a small child themselves? Yeah, because they’re about two, seriously. When you’re looking at a narcissist, emotionally speaking, they are operating about at a two-year-old, if not below level. Is that part of the reason they infantilize their targets? No, that is not part of the reason. They infantilized their targets for power and control. If you can make somebody less than what they could possibly be, if you could make them doubt themselves, if you can make them dependent on you for literally everything, you win the war, that kid will never grow up, never move out, never get their own stuff. Never have a boyfriend or a girlfriend never grow. And so, it’s intentional. Again, everything they do is with an agenda. Their agenda for infantilizing is to have all the power so that you never leave them. It’s an automatic lifetime supply for their ego. So, it’s the narcissistic supply 110%. So bad parents. In contrast, good parents, their whole job is to get that child self-sufficient. Self-esteem, self-empowered self, what’s the word I’m looking for? It’s like they’re ambitious. They want to go. They love mom and dad, they want to visit, they want to, you know, visit the mom and dad, but they also want to go explore, and they want to go test out the waters and try the world and see what’s going on. So, a good parent allows that child to discover who they are and gives them the wings to fly. So, it’s not just you know, punting them out of the nest of 18 and go fly bitch. You know, it’s like, no, it’s like, here’s your wings. You know how to use them. We’re right here if you need us. Come have fun exploring, write when you get work, you know, like that kind of thing.

Okay, so given that the inner critic comes from the harmful parental messages, what do you think of the idea? I heard EMDR about befriending my inner critic. I think it’s a technique. I don’t think it would have worked for me. But if that works, then great, do it. You know, me coming from a CBT background. For me, it’s very helpful. And it’s very what’s the word I’m looking for? Cathartic. To really put that inner critic back where it belongs, it’s like, Oh, Hello, Bob, this is not my thought. This is not me. This is my dad’s bs. And guess what? Jackwagon I’m handing it right back to you. So, for me, the anger is cathartic. And you could be friend to the inner critic and try to help them but I kind of feel like that would be trying to befriend the abuser and trying to help them, but you know, if it works, great. If it doesn’t work, you tell your therapist and go nope. And going back to doing it this way. Or whatever works for you. Or if it works, Hazzah all you know that for me personally, it’s I love Pete Walker’s candidate back candy that is not ours. It was not our luggage, put it back on the carousel, it’s not ours. So that is hugely important. And you’d rather not befriend, either. Okay, good. Well, when you tell your therapist that because honestly, that’s kind of like befriending the abuser. Because that negative stuff came from the abuser. That’s nothing. I wouldn’t be friends with that. That’s something that you kick out. That is something… exorcise it. Gone, be gone, be gone. Not today’s Satan. You know that kind of thing.. But you hand it back to the person belongs to it’s, not yours. You don’t need it. It’s not yours. You don’t have to be friends with you don’t. You need to recognize it and go yup. That’s not my thought. That’s my mom. That’s my dad. That’s my grandparents. That’s whoever. Guess what I’m handing that thought  right back.  So, there is that.

Kris Godinez  36:54

Alright, so bad parenting, any and all of the things that we went through as kids, any and all of it. And if you will notice, the main theme for all of it is an insane lack of respect. They do not… bad parents do not respect themselves. But they also don’t respect their kids. And the kids are seen as an extension of them which they are not. They are their own little being or they are seen as a burden. So again, it’s that split thinking it’s like, you know, good bad, black, white, all nothing. So, the kids are a mini me, which is not good. And they try to turn them into the golden child and put them into these neat little boxes. That’s bad parenting.

Or, oh God, here’s something else I’ve seen narcissists do that. Just it angers me so much. So, the child will be a hugely talented artist, say for example, either singing or arts, or, you know, crafts or painting or theater or whatever. And the parent being jealous and not understanding the art that they are doing, or maybe not liking it, or maybe because they can’t do it tells the child No, they can’t do it. No, you need to do that. No, you want you want this. So, they tell the kid you want something when they don’t want something, and they will redirect the child to go do a different thing. It’s not their thing.

That’s so damaging. I cannot even begin to tell you how damaging that is. So, when you have a child, and you tell that child No, you don’t want that you want this. The kid has got people pleasing going on anyway, that’s setting them up to be even more of a people pleaser, putting themselves completely on the backburner and doing something to support or help or make that parent like them. So, the kid gives up ballet, or dance or art or painting or singing or piano or trombone, or whatever. And they regret it the rest of their lives because they know that that’s what they love to do. And meanwhile, their parent made them go, say for example, go play sports or vice versa. The kid is really good at sports, and they shove him into some sort of art program. It’s like no, you play to the kid’s strength and the kid is athletic and put them on athletic stuff. If the kid is artistic, put them in artistic stuff. That Narcissus cannot listen to me now, believe me later. They cannot tolerate or handle differing opinions. So, if you like something and the narcissist doesn’t understand it, they’re going to insist that you do what they do understand. 110% And that is so damaging to kids because, again, what is the message? The message is my wants and needs are not important. And that’s not okay, because then that makes us grow up into. Oh, no, that’s okay. I’m going to be a martyr, which is not us either. That’s them. That’s the covert stuff. Oh, no, that’s okay. I’m going to put my stuff on the back burner. That’s okay. I don’t need to do that. No, that’s all right. Then you start settling, and where does it stop? That’s a really slippery slope. Because it’s like, you start settling in one area, you’re going to start settling in another, don’t settle. Absolutely. If you are in love with sports, go do it. If you’re in love with the arts, go do it. And it’s never too late to start. And that is something I really, really, truly want to point out. So many clients of mine come to me, and they’re like, Ah, I wish I’d known this when I was 20. I wish I’d known this when I was in my 40s. I wish I’d known this earlier. It’s too late. No, it’s not. Now granted, if you’re a singer, you’re, and you’re in your 50s, you’re probably not going to get on American Idol and go win the thing. But there is nothing to stop you from singing. There is nothing to stop you from performing. There is nothing to stop you from doing local community theater. There is nothing to stop you from playing in local bands. John plays trombone he plays with the Maricopa County, MCC, the community college. He plays with the with the band there. And he also has another band that he goes and plays in Mesa. He loves it. And I encourage it. And that’s what healthy people do. They encourage each other to do the things that they love. If a parent is discouraging a child from doing something they love, oh my God, that’s abuse, that is abuse, it is abuse, it is not letting that kid be that kid and enjoy what they know they enjoy. So, there is that.

And on a smaller scale. Whenever a narcissistic parent tells a child, Oh, you don’t want this, you want that. They’re doing the thinking for them. And that makes the kid dependent on them. And pretty soon, the kid doesn’t know how to do something without that parent. And that’s when you get couples that are very codependent. What do you want for dinner? I don’t know. What do you want for dinner? Well, I don’t know. What do you want for dinner? I can guarantee you if you look at their background, their parents probably were the type that told them what they wanted. And it wasn’t okay for them to express Well, geez, tonight I want Italian. Or geez, tonight. I want Mediterranean Oh, geez, tonight, I want Chinese or geez, tonight…Do you see where I’m going with that. Because then the parent be like No, no, you don’t want that. Because that’s not what I want. Do you see where I’m going with that one?

They do it in the grocery store. I talked about this the other day when a child says, you know, oh, you know, I want that candy bar. Instead of going well, honey, I know you want it, but you cannot have it. We’ll get it maybe next. You’ve been following through on your word. They go no, you don’t want that Candy bar Actually yeah, the kid does want that candy bar. So, what you’re doing is you’re telling the child not to trust their own perception. Is there an agenda behind that? Oh, you betcha. Because then they’re basically saying no, no, you don’t see the pink elephant taking a crap in the corner of the living room. When you do see pink elephant taking a crap and call me. Do you see where I’m going with that? So, they absolutely try to make us doubt ourselves. Make us not trust our own gut. Make us not believe what we see that whole thing. So, all of the things that we went through as kids are bad parenting, and if you notice, the main theme is disrespect. And it’s the agenda. They have an agenda. There’s an agenda behind. There’s 100%. You know, what’s in it for me? How is this going to benefit me? How is this going to make aggrandized me? That’s all of their stuff.

So, good parenting is the polar opposite of bad. It’s lots of compassion, lots of understanding, which narcissists don’t have, lots of reflective listening, making sure that the message is received, lots of good communication. That’s a good parent. So, as we have kids or grandkids or great-grandkids, or whatever, it’s really important to check in and make sure that you’re not getting triggered and that you’re not perpetuating the generational trauma. Just because it happened to you doesn’t mean you have to act it out on another generation.

Okay, do narcs have an evil face? Yes. When I remember my narc, I do not just see her face but something evil in the way she looked. Yeah. 100% 100%. Okay. They put on a mask for a certain amount of time. But when that mask finally slips and falls completely off their true intention. The true intention is It is there. And yeah, they are evil, 110%. And I’m sick and tired of apologists who are like, Oh, they just are like they weren’t loved enough as children. No, no, that’s not the issue there is there’s something missing with them. They’re missing a cog. They do not feel they do not feel love the way that you and I feel love. They have no empathy. They literally they can do the most heinous things and go straight to sleep. Whereas the rest of us, if we do something that we’re we think we’ve harmed somebody, I can guarantee you that we’re sitting up there going, Ah, geez how do I make this right? okay, I’ve got to make this apology. And, wow, I hope I didn’t screw up, you know, and then we go fix it, you know, we face the consequences of making a mistake. Whereas narcissists, they, don’t they? Absolutely, yeah, like, here’s going sideways today. They absolutely don’t face the consequences of what they’ve done. They don’t make apologies that are real. So that’s, that’s another thing, a good parent, when they screw up, the kid acknowledged it, makes amends, and makes sure that it never happens again. So, and that’s, I think the big difference is that bad parenting is ego based. good parenting is self-esteem based.

Kris Godinez  46:31

It’s like, how can I be the best guide to this little one that I’ve been given, so that they grow up with good self-esteem, and they grow up with confidence, and they grow up with listening to their gut, and trusting themselves, etc. So really and doing all of this stuff all boils down to self-esteem, working with the inner children. So Inner Child Workbook, Catherine Taylor is experiential. So that is the one where she has you hold yourself as a baby and rock yourself and see if anything comes up. And then another one is where she has you spread out a blanket and you know, smear food on your head. I actually had fun with that one. But um, you know, and see what comes up and it’s experiential, the Lucia Cappacchione Reclaiming Your Inner Child, is you write the child with the non-dominant hands and the adult with the dominant hands, can you have a conversation back and forth. So whichever one works the best, do that, or you can do both, you know. And it’s funny what you discover working both of them soft; some stuff comes up with the experiential, and the other one comes up with the doing the writing. So, it’s really important to work with the little ones inside and understand that they were victims of bad parenting and that you get triggered because of what happened to them. And sometimes I know people, when they start working with their inner children, they either are feeling anger towards them, or disgust or whatever, and that’s your abusers. That’s not you. That’s your abusers. That little one that you’re having the hardest time with needs your love and needs, your compassion, needs to have their handheld and told, hey, you know what? It’s going to be okay. I love you; I hear you. I hear you. I believe you. I know what you went through. And I’m sorry you had to go through it. And let me just tell you a little one. Nobody’s going to do that to you again because I will break my foot off in their ass, you know what I’m saying? So, you let them know that they’re safe, and you talk to your little one inside of you. So, you can do like guided imagery.

You know, it’s like, you go someplace safe in your head. You call them to you. And you sit them on your lap and hug them and kiss them and say, Hey, I love you, you’re a good little one, I love you. What do you need? Ask them what they need. And nine times out of 10, that little kid is going to say I just need to be protected. Or I just need to be heard. Or I just need to be believed. Let them know I believe you. I will protect you. I am protecting you now. I believe you, I hear you. Absolutely 100%. You’re important to me. And I think that’s important because the message a lot of us got growing up with bad parenting is we didn’t get that message that we were important at all. And we didn’t get that message that we were believed or heard or truly loved, or respected or anything else because the narcissist doesn’t know how to do any of that.

So all right, I think that was pretty much it on bad parenting. If you find yourself, you know, mom or dad come flying out of your mouth. First of all, forgive yourself. It’s going to happen, guys; it’s going to happen. So, when that happens, you just acknowledge it, and you clean it up. And then you do work on that you basically write mom and dad letter and be like, you do not get to come flying out of my mouth anymore, you do not get to hurt another generation. Does that make sense? So, you basically evict them. So CPTSD From Surviving to Thriving Pete Walker, the Self-Esteem Workbook, Glen Schiraldi The Disease to Please Harriet Braiker, Inner Child Workbook, Katherine Taylor, Reclaiming Your Inner Child by Lucia Cappacchione. All of these are going to help you as parents and grandparents, great grandparents, to not keep continuing the generational trauma. And really love that little child inside of you, or those little children different ages inside of you.

So, love that little one inside of you love them. And if disgust or anger or whatever comes up, put it on hold, you can put it on oh my gosh, thank you put it on hold and figure out where that Disgust is coming from because it’s not you. It’s not you. 110% It is not you. That little child did not deserve disgust or anger or blame or, you know, whatever, you’re a burden, whatever they said did not deserve that did not deserve that. So, you undo that. So that’s what people ask. They’re like, Okay, what is re parenting yourself. So, re parenting yourself is confronting that inner critic, writing it out, sending it back to the people it belongs to, but then replacing it with what a good parent would say. So when you’re doing the mirror work, you’re literally talking to your inner child, seriously, you’re talking to your subconscious, you’re talking to the inner child, and you do things like Hey, good to see you have a great day, I give you permission to like yourself, or I give you permission to be competent, or I give you permission to be funny, or I give you permission to have all of your emotions. It’s okay, I’m right here and I got your back. Then you walk out, because that’s what a good parent would say.

So anyway, I think that is it. If there’s any last questions, please let me know because I’m about to put a fork in it for today. It is really hot. So just so we left June 23, we’re back July 23. About three days after we left, we started getting emails from our house sitter it’s hot in here. And because it has been so ridiculously hot in Phoenix, or air conditioner could not keep up. So, we’re keeping it like what 80, 81, 83. Anyway, it’s hot. It’s really. I see I see a new air conditioner in my future. So, thank you guys. Oh my gosh, I’m so anyway, I just want to reaffirm is that we all had if we came from families of origin of a chaotic and abusive and this and that the other thing. We all had bad parenting. And everyone saw that bad parenting is going to come flying out of our mouths. And the difference is we recognize it. And we can do something about it. So, and we can change it and we can clean it up.

Oh, I love you guys too. And you know, that’s something I wanted to tell you guys. I love my fan base. You guys are so awesome. And I really love the fact that we have a community forum where people feel loved and heard, and supported. And thank you, thank you for being loving and concerned and supportive for each other and everybody. So that is awesome. All right, guys. I think that is it. I cannot for the life of me remember what I’m talking about next week. So, I’ll go figure it out. Any questions that I missed I’ll go back through the chat and make sure I caught all the questions, and I’ll answer other questions on Wednesday. So, there is that, all right, my love’s you guys go be awesome. Take good care of yourselves. Drink plenty of water, be careful in this extreme heat if you’re in an area that’s got the extreme heat. And I will talk to you on Wednesday and then we’ll see you on Sunday. Talk to you guys later. Bye.

Thank you so much for listening to this podcast. You can always listen live on YouTube every week Sunday at noon, Arizona Mountain Standard Time. And if you want to find out more or listen to other episodes, you can go to Krisgodinez.com and if you have a chance, subscribe to this show on whatever podcast app you use and let other people know about. I want to thank my sponsor betterhelp.com. They are an online therapy company. Whether you are in the US or international. They will set you up with a qualified licensed therapist. PhD level or Master’s level. If you are interested in more information, go to betterhelp.com/krisgodinez.

You’ve been listening to the podcast version of We Need To Talk with Kris Godinez.

The post 07-23-2023 Bad Behavior in Parenting appeared first on Kris Godinez.

When a person comes out of an abusive relationship, they almost inevitably have anxiety. When a person is stressed out and at survival the amygdala enlarges and the anxiety increases. The good news is that with mindfulness, the amygdala shrinks.

In this episode of We Need To Talk With Kris Godinez, Kris discusses anxiety and why almost every single survivor of abuse has anxiety. She also discusses what you can do to help mitigate it.

Link mentioned in this episode: Signs of Anxiety, PsychologyToday.com

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Hello and welcome to We Need To Talk with Kris Godinez podcast. I’m your host Kris Godinez, licensed professional counselor. I help people get out of, and stay out of, toxic relationships. This podcast is for informational and educational purposes only the views and opinions stated herein are mine and mine alone. They do not represent the ACA, the APA or any other therapist for that matter.

I want to thank my sponsor, betterhelp.com. They are an online therapy company. Whether you are in the US or international. They will set you up with a qualified licensed therapist. PhD level or Master’s level. If you are interested in more information, go to betterhelp.com/krisgodinez.

We are not in our normal spot. We are in Trinidad, California, right now. Just enjoying the cool. Can’t say I’m loving Trinidad really a lot. They were not very friendly as far as it comes to dog-friendly restaurants. And then we go to get takeout, and they’re like two hours away from closing, and they’re like up. Nope, we’re busy. We don’t do takeout. And I’m like, You’re a tourist town. Oh, don’t get me started. So, needless to say, I’m not probably going to come back here. But anyway.

Um, current events, let’s talk about current events. So, I was reading today that they are investigating the FDA is investigating another brand of energy drinks. And I just, I cannot stress to you, energy drinks, no bueno for your body, they usually have a lot of caffeine, like something like three or four cans of sodas worth of caffeine. They’ve got like tons of sugar. They have other things in them. You know, it’s really, it’s ooh, it’s not good. And I know a lot of people use the energy drinks because, you know, they’re they need the boosts, they’re super busy, etc., etc., etc. So yeah, it just don’t do energy drinks. They’re not good for you. Not the caffeine is good for you anyway, and I’m guilty of drinking coffee. But it just it’s scary to me when people start getting addicted to the energy drinks. And you know, it causes problems, guys, it does. You don’t want to get addicted literally to anything if you can help it.

So, and I think the biggest concern is that they’re questioning what else is in there besides the huge amount of caffeine, which by the way, if you drink too much caffeine, it can cause heart. What’s it called afibia? No, not afibia. Heart palpitations, it did a Bonguda, Bonguda, Bonguda, Bonguda, and not in a good way. So, um, anyway, just, you know, if you’re drinking those energy drinks, I really encourage you to get off of them. You know, wean yourself off, try something else. Arhythmia. Thank you. That was the word I was looking for. Not Bonguda, Bonguda. Bonguda. And anyway, just, you know, I don’t know, it just it bothers me that companies put stuff into it. And it’s, it’s now getting investigated. I don’t even know the name of the thing. It wasn’t one that was well known. But anyway, it was on the AP, so and I happen to see that, and I was like, oh, and I know a lot of people use energy drinks. So honestly, just don’t do it. Don’t do it. Water is great. And and taking care of yourself. teas are great. You know, coffee if you have to in the morning. And then don’t drink caffeine after like noon, because otherwise, you’re going to be all funky dunky with your sleep schedule. So, all right.

And speaking of which, if you drink too much caffeine, it will create a lot of anxiety because your heart is pounding like crazy. It kind of mimics a panic attack. So, let’s talk about anxiety. So, I named this a case of the nerves because people were asking about anxiety in regard to post traumatic stress disorder. So, post-traumatic stress disorder complex Post Traumatic Stress Disorder. One of the things it used to be in with the anxiety disorders, which is interesting. Now it’s in with the trauma disorders. So um, one of the things about PTSD is that people get a huge amount of anxiety, we start having nightmares, we start avoiding things that remind us of our abuse. We have panic attacks. So, I want to go into all of that and how to help yourself with that, of course, a sense of foreshortened future, like a sense of doom, that is very common in people that have come out of abusive relationships.

So, let’s excuse me, let’s talk about why. So, first of all, let’s talk about the physical things that are going on when you have anxiety. So basically, what’s going on is your amygdala your amygdala is enlarged, your amygdala is working overtime. And they’ve shown this in study after study after study on anxiety and amygdala is our amygdala is enlarged, and it’s working overtime to try to keep us safe, because we’ve had abuse either from a family of origin or from, you know, romantic partner, a boss, coworker, whatever.

So, the amygdala is job. The amygdala is a little almond-shaped organ that sits about an inch inside of each ear. Its job is to keep us safe, which is normally great. But if it’s enlarged, and we’re hyper-vigilant, meaning we’re looking for danger, looking for danger, looking for danger, looking for danger, where’s the danger? Where’s the danger? This little guy is going to be on steroids, seriously. So, this little guy sits about an inch behind each year. It’s almond-shaped, and when it perceives a threat now, here’s the thing, a threat can be anything to the amygdala because the amygdala cannot tell the difference between an energy drink making your heart pound, okay? Or no, I’m serious. amygdalas are really stupid. They’re like three O’s, oh, my god, stooopid! They cannot tell the difference between heart pounding because of an energy drink. Or a threat, a thought. You think about something threatening. You smell something that reminds you of when you were abused. You hear something, you see something, you taste something, this all makes the amygdala go. OMGOMGOMG! And then, it tells the hippocampus and the hypothalamus to release cortisol. So, cortisol is our stress hormone. So, we start tensing up right, now we’ve cut off the oxygen to our lungs, our heart is pounding, okay, we’re taking in puffy little breaths that don’t go anywhere. racing thoughts, racing heart. And at this point, the brain goes, Oh, my God, oh, my God, we need energy to get out of here. Oh, my God. And it tells another part of the brain, which is a little further down on the brainstem. So, a little bit more reptilian. We need adrenaline we need adrenaline. So, it tells the adrenal gland to release everything at once. So now we’re really shaking like a leaf, racing thoughts racing thoughts pounding heart pounding heart.

Kris Godinez  07:35

And at this point, we do one of two things, we either go into your stereotypical panic attack, which is the print and then we keel over, or we turn into the Incredible Hulk, we get angry, we get really, really, really rageful angry. And it’s a trauma response. It’s a way to keep people away from us, it’s a way to stay safe. The other thing that happens, and we’re going to talk about how to deal with that hold on. The other thing that happens too, is we have this generalized anxiety, we have this generalized sense of doom, you know, like, Oh, I’m not going to live very long or, or, you know, gosh, I just feel like something bad is going to happen. Well, it’s because when we were kids, or when we were with the abuser, something bad happened on damn near a daily basis. So, it’s that, you know, trying to stay safe again, trying to predict what’s going to happen. So, if we go for the negative, and it doesn’t happen, then Oh, good, you know, but if we go for the negative, and it does happen, then, okay, I knew that was going to happen. So, it’s a weird way of keeping ourselves safe.

So, to give you a couple of examples, when I was a child, my dad was literally a loose cannon, like, you never knew which way he was going to go flying across the deck. Okay. And whenever we went someplace new, I threw up because I was such a nervous wreck. I never knew how he was going to behave. Was he going to embarrass us? Was he going to scream at us? Was he going to hit us? Was he going to, you know, do something stupid, you know, and you usually did. So, um, so we get this, you know, anticipation of bad things happening, or we get this generalized anxiety. It’s like, oh, it’s someplace new. I don’t know what’s going to happen. And that, for me as a kid, that was the big thing. That’s why I threw up because I didn’t know what was going to happen. It was like, something’s going to happen. I just don’t know what. And so, I would throw up. That was the only thing I had control for. So um, so we get this anxiety, we get this incredible sense of anxiety, we get social anxiety, we get afraid to leave our house, we get agoraphobia, where we don’t want to go anywhere, or we get anxiety where it’s like, ooh, too many people. Now I also have had that happen to me. So like John and I, one time when we lived in LA, we went to one of the malls. And it was during Christmas time, and I remember turning to him and going get me the hell out of here yesterday. Get me out because I was starting to have a panic attack, and there’s just too many people bumping into you and the whole thing and it just didn’t feel safe. So um, so yeah, so anxiety is kind of part and parcel of PTSD. That’s just what happens to us because we’ve had so many bad things happen. And because our inner child is trying to keep us safe and anticipating, well, what if this happens? And what if that happens? What if, what if? What if? What if? So, basically, what happens is our subconscious starts living in what if? What if this happens? What if that happens? So, when we’re living in what if we’re in anxiety all the time because we’re trying to see what’s going to happen? What’s, you know, what’s going to happen now? What’s going to happen now, what’s going to happen now?

So what ifs are your clue that you need to check into what you’re thinking? Okay, so let’s back it up to the panic attack, and we’re going to tackle all the other forms of anxiety. So, when we have a panic attack, it’s because something our thoughts, something we saw, something we heard, something we tasted, something we smelled, made the amygdala go, Oh, my God, here, now, here, now here. And now it’s because the amygdala cannot tell the difference, like I said, between an energy drink making your heart pound, and fear making your heart pound or a thought that’s dangerous, or something that reminds you of your abuser. It’s all here, now, here, now, here, now, here, now, no logic, okay? So, when you realize you’re having a panic attack, what is your first clue that you’re starting to have a panic attack? So, for a lot of people, their first clue is their clenching up, that’s their, and holding their breath, that’s what we do. It’s like we hold our breath, and we clench up, okay? Or you can feel the heat rise, that’s another way to know that you’re starting to have a panic attack.

For some people, they don’t know they’re having a panic attack until they’re into the point where they are, and that’s fine. You know, it’s like, wherever you can catch it. That’s okay. So basically, as soon as you know you’re having a panic attack, the best thing to do is to take a super deep breath and hold it. So, you just and then force your shoulders down, force your chest out so that you’re kind of relaxing that whole area, and then slowly let it out. And as you’re letting it out, I’m safe. I’m okay brain, shut the bleep up. I’m fine. Everything everything’s okay, there is no saber-toothed Tiger. It’s all good. Let it go. We’re okay. You know, and you kind of do some self-soothing, it takes about five minutes for the adrenaline to flood out of the system. So, you’re going to have to sit there and do really, really slow, deep breathing with self-soothing.

So, remember, when we’re having a panic attack, it’s generally because our inner child is freaking right, the bleep out. So, you, you comfort yourself, the way you would in a small child, you’re safe. You’re okay. Everything’s fine. It’s all good. You’re good. Nothing’s going to hurt you. It’s okay. Try rubbing your arms, try rubbing your legs, remind yourself that you’re in the here and now, and everything’s good. So that’s the other thing is that what also causes panic attacks, flashbacks. When we are in flashback mode, and we are having a full-blown oh my god, this reminds me of my abuser. Holy crap. Oh, you know, it sends us into a complete and total panic, you know, being accused of something you didn’t do. That’s enough to send me into a rage. Usually, it’s like, Oh, hell no, we’re not playing that game. You know what I’m saying? So yeah, I mean, that’s, it’s part and parcel of PTSD. So breathing is going to be your best friend and self-soothing as you’re allowing your system to calm down. That’s another reason why I think energy drinks are a really bad idea for us. I really do because we can’t handle that. That arrhythmia. We can’t. Our bodies are just like, Nah, you know? So, I’m okay. So, I have some articles that I wanted to talk about.

Signs and symptoms of anxiety and this is on Psychology Today. Why do I feel like something terrible is about to happen, a sense of impending doom is a common accompaniment to bouts of anxiety and especially panic attacks. Not only may it seemingly strike out of the blue, but it also tends to exacerbate the anxiety. The more it exacerbates that sense of impending doom because we’ve had a panic attack. We know what that feels like. We don’t want another one. And oh my god, I don’t want it. I don’t want it. Oh my God, I don’t want it. I don’t want it. Well, if we’re focusing on that, guess what? We’re going to have it because our body is just like, well, we’re just going to do that so you can stop worrying about it. The feeling that something bad is about to happen is triggered by the body’s response when the mind senses a threat, hormones cortisol released are as part of the body’s stress response, put the brain on high alert, scanning relentlessly for danger. So like danger, where’s the dangerous danger, high alert, hyper, hypervigilance, hypervigilance. And if there is none there, we sometimes manufacture with the what ifs in order to get over it seriously. So, this is why we’ve got to do a two-pronged approach. It’s got to be a physical thing. And then we’ve also got to rein in that what if, what if, what if? And if you hear, well, what if this and what if that, that’s your clue to just totally tell that to shut the bleep up? Seriously, thank you for your input. Oh, kitty cat. Shut the bleep up. Sorry. Shut the bleep up. I’m not playing that game. I’m not living in a future that has not happened. And that’s the really important part is that it hasn’t happened. You’re living in a future that has not happened.

Okay, hormones, high alert. Relentlessly scanning for danger. And a strong stress response can lead to the feeling that catastrophe awaits. measures to tamp down the stress response, such as deep breathing for a few minutes, can dampen the sense of impending doom. So yes, absolutely. You want to take good care of yourself, recognize your anxiety triggers. So, you know, for me, it’s anxiety too many people. Recognizing, you know, hey, if somebody is accusing me of something I didn’t do, Oh, hell yeah. Game on, you know, I mean, it’s, it’s almost figuring out what your triggers are, write them down, write them down, challenge them, write them down, take your power back. I mean, they’re, they’re there to kind of protect you.

Kris Godinez  16:44

But now they’ve gone into what’s the word I’m looking for. They’re no longer helpful. They’re hurtful. So, write them down, challenge them, reaffirm that you’re safe, and you’re okay, and everything’s fine. And this is something to work on, seriously. And then baby steps, seriously, baby steps. So, if, for example for so for me going someplace new, it took years, probably until I left home, to get over that whole throwing up when I went someplace new because I was such a nervous wreck. Well, part of that also was getting away from my abuser. Because I realized it had to do with my dad because it was like he was a loose cannon, I didn’t know what he was going to do; was scary. You know, never knew if he was going to be kind or mean or embarrassing, or whatever. So, getting away from the abuse honestly helps. The second thing we need to do is work on The Inner Child Workbook by Catherine Taylor or Lucia Cappacchione. Why, because you’re dealing with all that trauma that happened when you were a little kid, that’s affecting us now, as an adult, and you want to challenge that stuff, and comfort that child, and make sure that child knows they are loved. They are heard, they are believed, and you’re going to protect them, and you will break your foot off in anyone’s hind in that tries to hurt them. That’s really what it’s about. Because we didn’t get protected. I talked about that last week; we did not get protected as kids. So, it’s really important to work with your inner child around the anxiety that came from somewhere.

So sometimes, too anxiety is a learned behavior. So, if we had a super anxious parent, we’ve picked that up. So again, fleas, so if it’s not yours, and it belongs to Mom or Dad, that’s when you have to separate it out, write it out, is this a fear of mine? Or is this a fear of mom and dads? Or is this a fear of grandparents? Or is this a fear of a teacher? Or is this a fear of whatever? Whoever taught the fear? You know, and is it real? Or is it just a fear? So, fear, false evidence appearing? Real fear is just a thought, you know, so is this something that you need to be freaking out about? Or is this something that you’re trying to plan for in the future? And if it is, take your power back live in the present moment, that is really the best way to get rid of that kind of anxiety.

Okay, going on. So, um, let me see if I can find the title of this one. So, this is just called Signs of Anxiety, and it’s on Psychology Today. Okay, hold on, it feels like we’re going to have a heart attack because we have the heart palpitations. That’s why. So, one thing that I tell my clients to do if they’re in the middle of a panic attack, and they’re like, oh my god, I’m going to I’m going to have a heart attack. Raise your hands above your head. Oh, look, you can raise your hands above your head. If you’re having a heart attack. You couldn’t do that. Can you stand up? Oh, yeah, you can. You’re fine. But that’s a way to shut that brain off when it starts going. What if. What if. What if. Oh my god, I’m dying. I’m dying. I’m dying. No, you’re not. You’re having a panic attack. It’s okay. So, this is common, guys. When I was in college, I would have panic attacks thinking I was dying. So, you bet. Absolutely.

When you And why, why? Well, when you get away from your abuser, and you start working on yourself, and you start challenging those basic assumptions that they gave you that were wrong, that were incorrect, it causes a lot of cognitive dissonance, it causes a lot of fear, we start realizing that the family that we thought we had, that we thought was supportive was not that, in fact, we had been orphans our entire life, and just didn’t know it until we started working on ourselves. So, you know, realizing that we are kind of alone and that we are kind of working on all of this lovely baggage that was handed to us that wasn’t even ours. Yeah, that can cause a lot of cognitive dissonance, it can cause a lot of what ifs, it can cause a lot of anxiety, I mean, abso-freakin-lulely. PTSD is not fun, and I don’t recommend it for most people. It’s not something you want to do. So um, but the point being is, is that you’re not crazy.

This is part and parcel of healing, unfortunately. So, it’s learning how to cope with the anxiety, kind of pushed through the anxiety so that you are running the anxiety, and the anxiety is not running you. It’s a bully, think of it as another abuser, that’s really a good way to think about it. It’s kind of like another abuser. Because why? Because it stops us from doing things, it stops us from going out, it stops us from going to like malls, it stops us, because we try to start avoiding all the things that make us anxious.

So, and social anxiety, this is huge for us as survivors. Why? Well, if we had truly crazy parents, they didn’t know how to socialize, they didn’t know how to be a normal human being, you know, and so going out into public was always an incredibly stressful thing. At least it was for me because it was like, what is what stupid thing is he going to do now? What horrible thing is he going to say about his family? Now? How is he going to embarrass us? Is he going to hit us? Is he going to, you know, say something stupid, you know what, you know? So? And and, and I talked about this in my book, what’s wrong with your dad? Um, you know, you get a reputation unfairly because of the crazy parent. You know, it’s like, oh, yeah, I know those people. Yeah, I don’t want anything to do with them. And it’s like, I have nothing to do with my dad. I’m not him. Thanks for playing. So yeah, it creates this sense of I can’t go out because I’m going to be associated with this crazy family, or I can’t go out because I don’t know what my abuser is going to do. You know? So, it’s totally normal. This is totally, totally normal.

So, all right, signs and symptoms. Let’s go back. Okay, why does my body shake? It’s because of the cortisol. You can’t concentrate. When you have anxiety. You feel like you can’t breathe because you’re holding your breath. It is a fear response. And yes, children do get anxiety they absolutely do. And it is a learned behavior. So that is the biggest thing to remember. Okay, let me see. Is this the one I wanted to look at? No, this is not the one I wanted to look at. Let’s look at PTSD. Okay.

So post-traumatic stress disorder. It causes unwanted distressing memories of the traumatic event, reliving the traumatic event as if it were happening again, flashbacks. And that’s because of the amygdala. So, the amygdala, like I said, cannot tell the difference between past, present, future, thinking about a threat, smelling a threat, hearing a threat tasting a threat, you know, it’s all here. Now, here. Now, here now, right here, right now. It’s happening. It’s happening. It’s happening. So, you’ve really got to be able to be like, Nope, I am safe. I am okay. In this present moment. My abuser is not here. I’m all right. So, calming yourself down, dealing with the amygdala. So, when you bring oxygen back into the system, so you take the big deep breath, and you hold it for a little bit, and you let it out, self-soothing, I’m safe. I’m okay. Everything’s fine. What that does is that tells the brain that released the adrenaline, oh, we’ve got oxygen, we’re safe. Okay, I can shut down the adrenaline process. Okay, cool beats. So, it starts shutting that down. And then as you keep breathing, the hippocampus and hypothalamus also go, Oh, we don’t need to be tensed up so, we’re ready to fight, fight, freeze or give in fawn. So that’s what that is all about.

Kris Godinez  24:59

So, PTSD, upsetting dreams or nightmares so people often wake up from it I wake up in the morning having a panic attack, not knowing why. Because we don’t always remember our dreams. And especially because we can believe it or not, we can dissociate when we’re dreaming. So, it’s like something happens. In our dreams, we wake up panic attack, but we don’t know why. Well, obviously, we were dreaming about something that was traumatic, obviously. And our brain just kind of went, nope, nope, not going to remember it. So, it’s enough to know that something triggered you, you were dreaming about something, I strongly recommend keeping a dream journal. So you can start writing things down. When you go to sleep at night, this is really important. You’re going to give yourself the suggestion that you sleep well. So, what I like, remember how we do the mirror work. So, the mirror work in the morning is going to be Hi, good to see you. Have a great day, I give you permission to like yourself, go be awesome. And then you walk out, right? At night, especially if you’re having panic attacks in the morning. Now you can do the whole Hey, good to see you. Again, here are three things you did right, which is always great. But the other thing you can do is add in, you know what, you’re going to sleep safely and soundly. And you’re going to have happy dreams, and then you go to bed. So, you give yourself that suggestion that that’s what’s going to happen that night. It may not happen immediately. But the more you tell your subconscious, this is what I want, the more the subconscious will start going, Oh, okay, we’re going to dream happy dreams. And how do I know this works? Well, a few years ago, I had to have a colonoscopy. And I told John, I will be having nice happy dreams about Oded Fehr, right. So, I come out of recovery. And the nurse goes to China and goes who’s Odin? babbling about? Good, fair. He’s an actor. He’s cute. Anyway, um, so yeah, it happens. So, but it takes practice. So, all of this takes practice because we’re having to undo all of the damage that the abuse has done, to our psyche, to our subconscious, to our self-esteem, to our sense of safety, to our sense of everything. So, a sense of safety is really the key to getting rid of the anxiety. So little kids are the ones who do the well. What if this? And what if that? What if I plan for this? And what if I play? You know, I’ll do I’ll do this, and it’ll be fine. And you know that kind of thing. So, you’ve got to calm down the little, the little inner child, comfort them. It’s great to come up with plans.

That’s great. One, maybe two plans. That’s it. And then you don’t allow the thought process to keep going, well, I’m going to do this, if that happens. And I’m going to do that. No, we’ve already done that. We have a plan. We know what we’re doing. It’s okay. Let it go. So seriously, keep a dream journal. Allow yourself to remember your dreams. Allow yourself to dream happy dreams. It’s okay. It’s really, really okay. Work on that, that is a huge thing to do. Okay, hold on just a second. One more thing. I wanted to get to severe emotional distress or physical reactions to something that reminds you of the traumatic event. Absolutely. stomach aches, somatic things, headaches, muscle aches, you know? Absolutely. And emotional distress. So, our bodies keep score, Bessel Van de Kolk. Great guy, I’m actually going to be going to a continuing education conference with both him and Dr. Ramani. I get to see them both. I’m so excited. So, I’m going to you know, I’ll bring back whatever I learned from them, which is awesome. That’ll be in October. Okay, so avoidance, we try to avoid things that causes anxiety, negative changes in thinking and mood, and negative thoughts about ourselves or other people in the world. hopelessness about the future, sense of doom, memory problems, not remembering important aspects of the traumatic events, difficulty maintaining close relationships, feeling detached from family and friends, lack of interest in activities you once enjoyed, difficulty experiencing positive emotions, feeling emotionally numb.

So, we do that with PTSD because it’s kind of like, well, if I’m happy, somebody’s going to ruin it. Like, seriously, that was my thought when I was having to live in the house with my dad because if I was happy, I knew he would ruin it. So, you know, and then he would get mad at me for being a moody teenager. And I’m just like. You can’t have it both ways. Anyway. Um, so yeah, so we do that. It’s kind of like we ruin it ourselves. So, nobody else can. Or we protect ourselves by not having close friends because we don’t want to get hurt. So, but it’s a way of really not living. So, it’s also a way of allowing the abuser to win, so don’t allow the abuser to win! You’ve got to be able to be like, Okay, this is my anxiety. This is my fear false evidence appearing real. What can I do to mitigate it and still go have a lovely fun life? Because I get to, you get to, you get to, and then clearly the message we got growing up was, oh, don’t you dare and it’s not okay and blah, blah, blah. So, my suggestion would be also writing letters to whoever created the anxiety around you. And basically, taking your power back. It’s like, Look, mother clicker, you’re dead. You have no power over me anymore. Or Look, Mother Clucker. I’m away from you. You have no power over me anymore. Guess what? I’m not going to allow your crazy thoughts to run my world. And take it out to the barbecue. Read it out loud once burn it, you know, and we have to be careful of what we think. That’s the other big thing. Thoughts, create emotions, emotions, create thoughts, back and forth. So, if you’re having anxiety, what were you just thinking? What if you’re having a panic attack? What were you just thinking right before you realized you were having a panic attack? A lot of times, people are dissociating, and they don’t quite know. But sometimes they’re able to go, Oh, I just thought XY and Z. Great.

Okay, now we know what caused the panic attack. Excellent. Let’s work on that. So that’s kind of what I want you guys to work on is that you’re not crazy. This is part and parcel of PTSD. This is part and parcel of CPTSD because we’ve had so much trauma that we’re trying to keep ourselves safe. The amygdala literally is enlarged, and it is trying to keep us safe. And it’s stupid. Three o’s cannot tell the difference. Past, present, future, thought, seeing something, hearing something, smelling something, tasting something. It’s all here, now, here, now, here, now. So, you kind of have to remind yourself, I’m safe. I am okay. Everything is fine. There is no danger right now. I have some fear. For sure. I’m going to validate and acknowledge that, that there is no danger.

So gentle, gentle, gentle anxiety is, what’s the word I’m looking for? It is the gift that keeps on giving. So, they gave us anxiety because of the abuse. They gave us anxiety. So, the anxiety was trying to keep us safe. And it served a purpose at one point in time. You know, you know, honestly, I think for me with the throwing up is if I was throwing up, my dad kind of left me alone. So, I think that’s why I kind of clung to that for so long when he was around. So, um, you know, you think it thank you anxiety. That was lovely. That was a lovely thought. And I know you’re just trying to keep me safe. And because it’s an and world. I don’t need you anymore. We’re done. I don’t need you anymore. I don’t need to do this anymore. It’s harming me now. Write it out, challenge it. What can you do instead? How are you safe, you know, remind yourself you are safe. Work with your inner child. Work with the Self-Esteem Workbook by Glenn Schiraldi. C-PTSD from Surviving to Thriving by Pete Walker. So, work on all of this. And this is totally normal. And to be expected having a huge amount of anxiety is to be expected if somebody comes out of a traumatic thing and says that they have absolutely no anxiety.I am going to call bull dinky on that. So, because our bodies, our minds, man, they are Yeah. So, anxiety is normal for having been abused. And we get to be the master of the anxiety, not the anxiety be the master of us. So, it’s breathing. It’s being aware of what you were thinking what you were feeling. What did you see? What did you hear? What did you smell? What did you taste? What triggered the panic attack? What is the thought that stopping you from going out? The What if challenge it and then Baby Steps Start doing very, very little. Because you don’t want to just, you know, like, for example, when I first started working on my anxiety, I would not just immediately go out into a mall. That would not have been a good thing. But if I could go out to like a grocery store, you know, and lots of people in the grocery store, okay, I’m okay with that. And then you up it to maybe a mall later on. So, Baby steps, baby steps, baby steps, and gentle with yourself, and do not make yourself wrong. Do not, and anyone who makes you wrong for having anxiety is probably not empathic and probably not a person you want to be around. So, this is normal for those of us who have come from abusive situations. Okay, let’s dive into the questions. Okay.

Kris Godinez  34:51

I cannot get over the grief of my mother, who died 28 years ago. I have intrusive thoughts and feellings all day. And I don’t know what to do. It’s on year two. After memories came up, what shall I do? Okay, first of all, she died 28 years ago. Holy cow. Okay, I would strongly suggest getting with a psychiatrist and looking into probably some meds for obsessive-compulsive thoughts given that you say it’s all day. And it’s been happening since the year two. And so that’s for 26 years this has been happening. So, I would say get with a psychiatrist to work on that. There is, you know, there’s a workbook hold on half a tick that I really liked. So, it was called the intrusive thoughts, intrusive thoughts workbook. Overcoming unwanted thoughts. Okay. So, there’s overcoming unwanted thoughts that’s on Amazon. Then there’s the intrusive thought toolkit. So honestly, any and all of these books on Amazon, either overcoming unwanted thoughts or the intrusive thought toolkit, can help. At this point, I would definitely, though, if those don’t help you, I would definitely look into getting with a psychiatrist and see about maybe some OCD meds to help with that. Absolutely. And the thing of it is, is that you’ve been doing this for 26 years, if I’m, if I’m reading, I’m reading that right, right, John. Okay, so you’ve been doing it for 26 years. So, the more we have a thought, okay, the stronger that connection gets, which is why it’s so important to do thought-stopping. So thought stopping is where the thought pops up, and you acknowledge it, you go, Yeah, I hear you. I see you. I hear you knock. And yeah, can’t come in. And you send it on its way, which is different than resisting it. So, when we resist a thought, it’s when we go, oh, thought, oh, I don’t want to think about it. I don’t want to think I’m not thinking about it. I’m not thinking about it. I’m not thinking about another. What am I thinking about the whole time? I’m thinking about that thought. But if you go, Yep, I hear you. I see you. And I don’t really want to deal with you right now. Because there’s nothing I can do about it. So, bye, you know, and you send it on its way. The other thing to think about, too, is grieving. So, if you were not allowed to properly grieve, that could be another reason why these thoughts keep popping up. So, what you may want to do is write your mom a goodbye letter. Ooh, I know. That’s… I know. So, write her a goodbye letter. And see if that helps. You know, Dear Mom, you know, if she was abusive, it may be a Go screw yourself letter. But if she wasn’t abusive, it’s probably going to be a very sad letter. You miss her. So, write her a goodbye letter, and then trot it out to the barbecue, read it out loud once burn it. So, if after doing that, and doing the intrusive thought toolkit book and the overcoming intrusive thoughts. If that doesn’t help, then it’s time to get a psychiatrist. Absolutely.

Because that the thing, like I said, is that when we think something constantly, it makes that connection in our brain strong. Okay. So, it’s kind of like, how do we explain? It’s kind of like wagon, the wagon ruts that you can see from all the wagon trains that went through in the Midwest, you can still see them because so many went through there, right? So, you’ve got to change the route. So, and the same goes for when we get obsessive about our abuser. So, if we’re constantly calling up the thought of our abuser, especially if it was romantic relationship, in our heads, you want to be like, nope, not my problem, not thinking about them. Thank you very much. I hear you knocking I see you. And no, I’m choosing not to think about this person. So that’s what you want to start doing. Because our thoughts have been so ingrained, think about the abuser and think about, you know this person or think about that person, you want to start doing thought stopping so when the thoughts pop up, you just go no, no, thank you, after you’ve worked through the grieving so, you know, our society is really weird about grieving, they don’t allow us or they don’t like it when we really truly have a deep amount of emotion abusers don’t at all. So grieving is a very deep, very genuine emotion. And everybody seems to think that oh, you know, you grieve for like two months, and then you’re over its new grieving is lifelong. For sure. It’s not intrusive, though. It’s not like every day, all day. But you know, every once in a while, you know, I’ll think about my mom, she pops into my head, you know, or, you know, I’ll think about somebody who’s died that I liked, you know, but grieving is a lifelong process.

We never stopped loving that person. Let’s be very clear. When we grieve. We’re loving that person. We miss them. And sometimes we don’t let go of them because we’re afraid if we stop thinking about them, we will stop loving them. And that’s not true. You were always going to love them, if they were good to you, you’re always going to love them. If they’re an abuser, you may be keeping them stuck with you with anger. That’s what I did with my dad. And it was funny because one of my one of my counselors awesome. She was like, You’re angry at your dad because you’re still trying to fix him. And you keep calling him up because you’re still trying to fix him. And I was like, Whoa, because I was thinking about him a lot, especially in the early years when I was working on my, you know, trauma and everything like that. So, you know, think about it, it’s like, why are you calling this person up all the time? Is it to fix them? Is it so that you still feel loved? Is it, you know, what’s going on? Grieving is normal. Grieving is normal. And grieving is a lifelong process. You know, it’s like, you’re always going to, if you love the person and they loved you, you’re always going to love them, and you’re always going to miss them, and you’re always going to grieve their loss, you bet. It’s just not going to be as intense. So, and like I said, in our society, it doesn’t allow people to grieve. It just doesn’t. They’re uncomfortable, whether it was literally it’s been six months, no mother, it takes, you know, a year for normal grief, normal grief to kind of go through all the firsts. And then after that, it’s like, okay, this is the new normal without them, you know, and then after that, it gets a little easier, you know? So, I would definitely say try those two books, try writing and burning the letter. I don’t know whether it’s an abuser or whether the mom was a loving, kind mom. So um, either way, if it was an abuser, right of the go pound letter, if it was a loving, kind mom, you know, do the grieving letter do the I miss you letter, and I wish you were here letter, you know, do that one. If, after doing the books, and all of that, it doesn’t work, get to a psychiatrist. Look into OCD bets to help with the intrusive constant thoughts. So, there is that? I hope that answered that question.

Um, do narcs have anxiety which they transfer onto their children? My mom was nonstop anxious and always creating drama over nothing and blamed the children for it because she was worried. That sounds more like borderline, to be perfectly honest, borderline personality disorder. When they get malignant, they’re very anxious, and they create drama all the time, and then blame it on somebody else. So that sounds like Oh, my goodness, my leg has gone to sleep. Holy cow. Wow. Um, that sounds more like borderline personality disorder. Um, but ya know, they the borderline personality disorder absolutely can and they’re very much into drama. And I’m talking malignant guys. I’m not talking traits of I’m talking when they have refused help. And they’re harming people. And they’re screaming Mimi’s and drama, drama, drama, drama, drama, drama, drama, then yeah, absolutely. So that sounds more like borderline honestly. And again, I’m not diagnosing; I’m just saying what that sounds like.

Um, okay. Wow, we can’t move out of our home in a building where we received physical abuse from deranged neighbors is 2018. The police and judge do nothing. Is there a way to stop being locked in? Okay, so you can’t move out of our home in a building where we receive physical abuse from deranged neighbors. Since 2018, the police and judges do nothing. Is there a way to stop being locked in? I’m not quite sure of the situation. Um, that sounds like more of a question for an attorney. Honestly, if the police and judge are doing nothing, and if these people are still abusing then or being harassing or whatever, and I kind of talked about this last week. Apparently, the Supreme Court has made it more difficult to get a restraining order, which is only going to harm people who are being stalked by crazies. Men get stalked, too. So, this is not just harming women. It is going to harm men as well.

Kris Godinez  44:22

So, I would say if there’s still a harassment situation going on, you cannot get a restraining order if the police and judges are not doing anything. It’s time to talk to an attorney. Because sometimes, Honestly, the only thing people understand is if you hit them in the pocketbook. So that would be my suggestion for that. As far as free attorneys are concerned. There are sometimes the universities that have law schools will do clinics, free clinics, where they’ll answer questions. Sometimes retired attorneys will do free clinics will where they will answer questions or help you fill out paperwork. In Arizona, Fresh Start Women’s Resource Center offers legal advice. They’ll help you fill out paperwork. They’ll answer your questions, you know, that kind of thing. It’s for a small fee for like 15 bucks. So, so you’d have to look around and see if you could get some free legal advice. The other thing you could look into would be Catholic Charities might have some free legal advice you could get, or Jewish Family Home Services. That’s another possibility. So, look into, look into talking to an attorney because at this point, that sounds more illegal than it does psychological. So um, okay, let’s see.

My kitty Sabrina passed away last month. I’m so sorry. I cry every day at least once, sometimes more. I can’t seem to get past this part of my ptsd. Is this part of my PTSD? Does it make the grieving process longer? No, sweetie, that’s normal grief. So, a month is nothing. A month is nothing. It is no time at all. A month is nothing. When we lost Scotty. Oh, god, that was awful. So yeah, you miss him, you know, and it was really hard because you know, he was our last dog. So, before we got these guys, a month is nothing. a month, you’re just starting to even scratch the surface of grieving. So normal grief. Let me say this again. Normal grief takes the entire year. It does. A month is nothing. Allow yourself to grieve. And is it going to be every day in that first month? Probably. You betcha? Yah. Yah, you betcha. And you just acknowledge it, and you validate it, and you allow it, don’t resist it. It’s kind of like, Yeah, this is normal. This is me loving this little Sabrina cat. You betcha. And you allow yourself to grieve. And again, it might not be a bad idea to do a goodbye letter, dear Sabrina, your great little kitty, and I loved you so much. You know, and just let her know how awesome she is. And just take it out to the barbecue, read it out loud once allow the smoke to carry the words to where it needs to go. So yeah, grieving is a lifelong process. The intense grieving is going to be the first year seriously. So everyday thinking about the cat. Yeah, that’s when Scotty died. Every day, I would think about him. And especially sometimes I would think I would hear him coming into the dog door. Which was than that, I’d go, oh, no, he’s gone. You know? And then I cry. And, um, yeah, it’s, it’s, it’s only been a month, sweetie. It’s only been one. That’s what I was saying about our society. In a healthy normal society, they understand that it takes a year, a year in a day, a year and a day. Seriously, it’s like, allow yourself that year to get through all of the firsts, you know. And it is a lifelong process. There are days when I think about Kitties and dogs that I’ve had when I was a kid, and I miss them, and I’ll grieve over them, you know? So, it’s lifelong, so gentle with you. Don’t make yourself wrong, write and burn a goodbye letter. And just realize it’s going to take a year. It’s going to take a year at the very, very least. You betcha. All right, let’s see what the next question is.

Um, how do you back away from new people who learn some of your triggers and continue to do said triggers and laugh about it, I want to ghost to them. But we’ll have to give up my group of friends. Um, well, they’re not your friends if they’re doing things like that. If these people are condoning what these people are doing, then they’re not your friends. So let me be very clear. People who are your friends support you, people who are your friends, love you. People who are your friends do not tolerate anybody pushing your buttons and creating triggers, okay? Or, you know, creating a response to triggers. So, these people are not your friends.

So, what is friendship? Friendship is respect. Same with love, friendship and love are all about respect. And if they do not respect you, they do not like you, and they do not love you. So, if they are disrespectful, you get rid of them. So, you don’t owe anybody an explanation. You don’t you, that’s the big thing. It’s like, so here’s the thing. Ghosting people, I’m not a huge fan caveat unless they’re abusive, if they’re abusive, then yeah, you have the right to go no contact. Absolutely ghosting, otherwise known as no contact. So, but ghosting has come to be like, you know, oh, you’re hanging out with somebody, you’re dating somebody, and then you just disappear. That’s ghosting. Okay? No Contact is when somebody is abusive. Pushing your buttons, getting you triggered, laughing about it, making fun of you, being disrespectful. You have the right to go no contact with those people. So, because that’s abusive, let’s be clear. Let’s be clear, that’s abusive. And if your friend group is unwilling to support you, is going along with what these people are doing. You don’t need them. You do not need them, clean out your friend closet make room for Healthy People. Healthy People are not disrespectful. Let me say that again. Healthy People are not disrespectful. They have boundaries, they know your boundaries. This is a boundary.

So, what’s your list of deal breakers? Let’s go over that. What is a deal breaker? A deal breaker is anything that is going to harm you. So, a deal breaker is if somebody is disrespectful to you, these people are disrespectful to you. If somebody causes you harm, these people are causing you harm. calls you names, gaslights you, lies, makes fun of you at your expense. Those are all deal breakers. Nobody should treat you like that. Nobody has the right. Self-Esteem Workbook by Glenn Schiraldi, read it. Boundaries. The Disease to Please by Harriet Braiker read it because you don’t need these people. And sometimes I think we’re afraid to let go of people because we’re afraid that nobody else will ever like us. Wow, does that sound what like the abuser said nobody will ever love you. Nobody will love you the way I do bla bla bla bla bla. God, I hope not. You know what I’m saying? So, you definitely want to let them go. If they’re being disrespectful, if they’re hurting you, if they’re harming you, and if the rest of the people are going to go along with that, you don’t need them. You don’t need them. Work on yourself, work on your self-esteem. Okay, let’s see. I mean, and, and if you’ve already told them so, what you could do is if you’ve told them that this is not, you know, you don’t like this, and this is harmful, and they do it again. Absolutely get rid of them. If you haven’t told them, then you might just be like, No, I really don’t appreciate that. And then if they do it again, get rid of them. But honestly, if they’re like intentionally and making fun of you, just get rid of them. So, there is that.

Okay, my loves I think that is it for today. I will do the questions on Wednesday that I did not get to. Let me see what next week’s show is going to be. Here it is. Oh, what does a healthy family look like? Yes, we’re going to talk about healthy families. We’re going to talk about green lights, we’re going to talk about the good stuff, so next week is going to be what does a healthy family look like? What a healthy people look like healthy friends look like? etc. etc. etc. So that is it. My love’s you guys go have a great week, and I will talk to you on Wednesday with the answers and questions and answers and next week what a healthy family looks like. All right, my love’s go be awesome. Talk to you later. Bye.

Thank you so much for listening to this podcast. You can always listen live on YouTube every week Sunday at noon, Arizona Mountain Standard Time. And if you want to find out more or listen to other episodes, you can go to Krisgodinez.com and if you have a chance, subscribe to this show on whatever podcast app you use and let other people know about. I want to thank my sponsor betterhelp.com. They are an online therapy company. Whether you are in the US or international. They will set you up with a qualified licensed therapist. PhD level or Master’s level. If you are interested in more information, go to betterhelp.com/krisgodinez.

You’ve been listening to the podcast version of We Need To Talk with Kris Godinez.

The post 07-09-2023 A Case of Nerves appeared first on Kris Godinez.

Have you ever wondered why the other parent did not protect you? Have you wondered why people just allow abuse to occur? What gets in the way of people acting to protect? These and many more questions will be answered in this week’s episode of We Need To Talk With Kris Godinez discussing When People Do Nothing!

Links to resources mentioned in this episode:

• When Good People Do Nothing
• Supreme Court Overturns Stalker’s Conviction In First Amendment Case Over ‘True Threats’
• Child Abuse and the Role of Parental Denial

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Hello and welcome to We Need To Talk with Kris Godinez podcast. I’m your host Kris Godinez, licensed professional counselor. I help people get out of, and stay out of, toxic relationships. This podcast is for informational and educational purposes only the views and opinions stated herein are mine and mine alone. They do not represent the ACA, the APA, or any other therapist for that matter.

I want to thank my sponsor betterhelp.com. They are an online therapy company. Whether you are in the US or international. They will set you up with a qualified licensed therapist. PhD level or Master’s level. If you are interested in more information, go to betterhelp.com/krisgodinez.

So, I’m doing the Portland meet and greet today at two o’clock very excited. Portland has changed a lot since John and I lived here. We lived here in the mid-1990s. Nine think we left in 2001. Lots of homeless I got chased by a homeless man today. That was fun. And when I say fun, I mean terrifying. So, there was that Hello, darlings. Um, yeah, that was kind of weird. It was it was a very strange morning. So, we got up to take the dogs down and, you know, walk them along Tom McCall Park. And Tom McCall Park has changed a lot. There was a lot of graffiti, lots more garbage, lots more homeless people. So, this one homeless guy sees me and John coming with the dogs. And he’s like, Oh, she’s a good person. She’s a good person. And then, like, he starts yelling about losing $12,000. I mean, it was obviously mental health issues, probably schizophrenia, possibly borderline with psychotic features. Who knows. But then, as we were walking back on our second walk, this homeless guy just started following me. And as I was running across the street, he started running across the street. And then John had to place himself between me and him. And he finally just kept walking. It was really weird.

So yeah, the homeless population definitely has increased. And it is an issue not just in here. But in Portland, but literally everywhere, the homeless population has increased, and there are no services, and why? Well, the homeless population doesn’t have any money. And politicians are not going to do anything about it, because who’s going to finance it? People don’t want to finance it because there’s no money to be made. And it’s really annoying. And it really makes me angry because a lot of these homeless people are mentally ill. And can they be dangerous? Yeah. If the voices told them to hurt somebody if they have command hallucinations, you betcha. And I would have to say both of those guys had command hallucinations. So anyway, there was there that, but Portland is beautiful. And it is fun to be here.

So, I am looking forward to seeing people today. That’s awesome. Um, okay, so current events, aside from the homeless issue, which is nationwide. Apparently, the supreme idiot Court decided that they were going to loosen up the definition of stalking. This is not okay. So basically, they’re saying, Oh, well, it’s intent. They didn’t intend to terrorize you. They didn’t intend to scare you. That wasn’t their intent. Okay, back the hell up Bipidi Bobbidi back the hell up, biotch. So, here’s my issue with that this person. Apparently, this is in Forbes magazine. See if I can find the article. Forbes magazine. There it is, for a Supreme Court overturned stalkers conviction in First Amendment case over true threats. So, this guy sent these messages to this singer. Apparently, the Supreme Court ruled in favor to seven to two in favor of Billy Raymond Counterman, a man who was convicted in Colorado of stalking after sending repeated messages to female musician Coles Whelan that made her fear for her safety, including one that suggested he knew where she was, and told her to die and eff off permanently. countermine was convicted based on an objective test that considered whether a reasonable person would believe his comments constituted true threats, which, unlike most speech, aren’t protected by the First Amendment. But his attorney argued that the Supreme Court should instead impose a subjective test that takes the speaker’s intent into account. Okay, if you’re dealing with somebody who’s crazy, and they’re stalking, their intent is to harm, let’s just be clear here. So, 90% of communication is verbal and auditory, okay, and then of course, there’s the micro expressions center, etc, etc. When you are receiving threatening emails, threatening texts, threatening mail threatening anything, you can’t hear or see what they’re doing. Okay? So, if you’re feeling threatened, perception is everything you ask any good therapist, perception is everything. If you’re feeling threatened and you’re feeling threatened, it doesn’t matter what their intent was. healthy, normal people that are not dark triads, or cuckoo for Cocoa Puffs, hearing voices telling them what to do. Do not, listen to me now, believe me later, send texts that say things like die now, eff off permanently, I would take that as a threat.

I had one on YouTube a few years ago that I ended up calling the police and saying okay, this is. I’m threatened by this. This is they’re saying things like you’re going to end up dead if you keep doing this. How else am I supposed to take that? You know, there’s no context. So, they’re saying, Oh, it’s subjective. No mother clucker. It is not. If somebody is saying they’re going to hurt you. They know where you are. They want you dead. They want you know, etc. That’s a frickin threat, and for the supreme idiocy court to say that no, that’s not, and that’s protected under freedom of speech. That’s a load of crap. That is misogynistic. And that’s not just misogynistic. Women are not the only ones who get threats like this, guys do, too. And what pisses me off more than anything else? Is that when a man is being threatened by a woman, the police do not take it seriously. Oh, well, you’re a guy. Oh, well, but no, it doesn’t matter. Crazy is crazy. Gender aside, crazy is crazy. So, if somebody is crazy enough to start sending out threats, then yeah, so I would strongly suggest writing your senators and saying, Ah, this is not okay. This is directly affecting anybody who’s got a restraining order against one of these cuckoos. This is directly affecting anybody who is in a domestic violence situation where their ex is saying things and guess what, gaslighting? This is gas? This is gaslighting. 110%. Oh, my intent wasn’t to terrorize. Die now. eff off permanently. How would you take that? I take that as you know where I am. You’re threatening me. You’re basically saying you’re going to harm me. Oh, but that wasn’t my intent. That’s gaslighting at its worst. It really is. And it makes me angry because now this is giving carte blanche to all of the abusers out there to be as heinous as they want to be. And the Supreme Court, the courts are just going to go oh, well, you know their intent. They’re saying that that wasn’t their intent. Well, if it wasn’t their intent, why were they writing it? See where I’m going with that? I have a huge problem with this. This is This is dangerous to survivors of domestic violence.

This absolutely is this is 110% the wrong message to be sending. We need to be sending letters to the Supreme Court. We need to be sending letters to our senators, we need to be doing something about this because it’s so easy for the defendant to come back in and go oh, well, that wasn’t my intent. Oh, I was just kidding. Oh, I did. Oh, well. But when you’re reading something, you’re not hearing it. You’re not seeing it. You know. So, what is their intent? You can only take it off of what it says. And I think this is a disservice to survivors. It’s a disservice to people who are dealing with stalkers. stalkers are dark triads, they’re narcissistic, psychopath Machiavellian, so I can guarantee you all of them that have restraining orders are going to go running out and going, Oh, wasn’t my intent. I was just kidding. Screw you. That just pisses me off. It really does. And, and there’s a political aspect, obviously to this too, because they’re trying to make it easier for people to send threats to political people. And I’m just like, you know, what, how about we all just have manners? How about we all just stop treating each other horribly? How about we just stop being stupid? It just. I hate the Supreme Court. I really do. They’re making bad decisions. They’re, they’re doing things that are harming other people. And that is the devil. We’re going to get into that today. So, here’s the deal. If you see somebody doing something harmful, like the Supreme Court, you don’t want to just sit by and go, Oh, it’s too big.

Kris Godinez  09:22

I can’t handle it. I can’t do it. You can. If enough of us get in together and write letters and let people know that we’re upset and it’s not okay, change can happen. And this plays into what I am talking about today, which is when people do nothing, so.

Okay, now we’re diving into our topic. So, a topic that I got today was from several people going but why did my other parents stand by and do nothing? Why did my teacher do nothing? Why did this person who knew about the abuse Do nothing? So, we’re going to talk about that. So, I pulled up a couple of articles on Psychology Today and one from Where’s this one from? Mentalhelp.net. But let’s start with the Psychology Today one. So, this is When Good People Do Nothing on Psychology Today was published in 2020 September 15. And bystander intervention versus bystander apathy, decades of research by psychologists like Latane and Darley have identified the steps that prevent people from intervening to help versus the circumstances, circumstances under which they stand up. So that you can get to the information that particular study on this page, which is what I like. So basically, they have a graph and in the graph, it says, okay, the emergency happens, and then people notice the event, but what stops them is they’re distracted, they’re in a hurry. They don’t want to get involved. They just don’t want to get involved. I’m in a hurry. I got to go do this. So, they don’t do anything. The other thing that happens is they interpret the event as an emergency. But they, again, they, they talk themselves out of it, oh, it wasn’t really that bad. Oh, it wasn’t really this. It wasn’t really that. And I’ll give you a great example. My mother-in-law calls us, and this was years ago, and says, Oh, I saw this kid in the parking lot yelling that this guy wasn’t his dad. And I’m like, did you call the police? And she was like, oh, no, I didn’t want to get involved. I would rather call the police and have it be his dad and the kid just being acting out or whatever, than to not call the police and have this guy be a, you know, child trafficker. So. So she convinced herself it wasn’t an emergency, and that the kid was really just, you know, that guy’s son and etc., etc. So, this is, like I said, years ago if I had known I would have Yeah.

Okay. And emergency happens, people assume responsibility. But what ends up happening is diffusion of responsibility, have failed to assume personal responsibility. So, this is like, in the case of Kitty Genovese, in New York City, in the 60s, she was murdered in front of literally hundreds of people, her apartment building had windows, people were seeing her being stabbed. All of them assumed that somebody else was going to call the cops. Because they didn’t want to get involved. Oh, well, there’s a lot of people, somebody else will do it. No, no, I would much rather, again, be the 20th person to call the police than to not call the police and somebody gets hurt. So again, this is a lot of that fight, flight, freeze, or faun, a lot of freezes involved with this. And we’re going to get into why the good parent doesn’t get involved. This is all kind of playing into this. So, stay with me on this one. Okay. So then, okay, so then emergency happened knows appropriate form of assistance, but what stops it is a lack of knowledge, lack of competence, can’t offer appropriate help, so it doesn’t know what to do. So, you know, they go, Oh, I don’t know what to do. So, I’m just not going to do anything. So, emergency happens, and this is the last one, implement decision. Okay. So, what stops it is danger to self-legal concept concerns, embarrassment, or the cost of helping are too high. So, this is going to play into why parents do not protect their kids. Okay, hold on. Yeah, many complain, few act. That’s and that’s the thing if everyone acted, we wouldn’t be having the issues we’re having right now, with our protection from stalkers happening. So, this is why it’s important to speak up. This is why it’s important to act in mass. It’s like even one voice even.

Do you remember the Lord of the Rings? To remember when Frodo was just giving up hope and like, I’m so little, I don’t know how I can do this. And it was, I can’t remember what it was Galadreal or if it was Gandalf, but they said to them, it was like, yes, but your voice makes a difference. You make a difference. So even though it’s just one of you, you make a difference. So don’t give up that idea that you make a difference. You do make a difference. Okay, so hold on.

So, um, let me get over to, all right, Child Abuse and the Role of Parental Denial. So, this is by Dr. Schwartz. Allen Schwartz, PhD. This December 11 2009 on mental help.net. And so, the question was, you know, why did my parents do nothing? Okay? Denial is a powerful, powerful and primitive defense mechanism someone who is dependent, so remember, we talked about that last week, somebody who is totally dependent, codependent, you know, can’t see their way out of this relationship, is financially dependent on the abuser is emotionally just brainwashed by the abuser frightened. And themselves, a victim of abuse can remain silent and not even see or hear the abuse in order to maintain the desperately needed relationship with the abuser. In a way, it is a variation of the old saying, hear no evil, see no evil, well, people do hear it and see it and fail to act.

So, this is important, guys. Because when we’re raised in a toxic family, and we have a family member that’s abusing us, and our other parent does nothing or worse, comes up with a ton of reasons why they’re not going to stop the abuse. What is the message that that sends to that kid? And ain’t good. Let me just be clear on that. The message that that sends to that kid is I’m not valuable. I’m not worth protecting. I’m not, you know, I don’t mean anything to either parent. One parent uses me as a beating post. The other one is just allowing it to happen. So personal experience. My mom did that. She absolutely did. And I talked about it in my book. I tell …where do I have my book somewhere? No, of course not. Of course, I don’t. Um, so in what’s wrong with your dad? I talked about it. She sacrificed her kids on the altar of security. Because Oh, well, if I leave him, I We won’t have any money and you’ll starve and this that and the other thing. Okay. Well, in the meantime, he’s beating the crap out of me, and he’s sexually molesting me. So, I think I’d rather starve. Thanks. You know, so it was in then, of course, if you play it back to her connection, her mother was an abuser. Her mother was a narcissist. Her mother abandoned her constantly, like physically abandoned her constantly, and left her to be abused by other adults. So, it makes sense as to why the parent does this because they’re replaying their childhood stuff now. Does it excuse it? Hell? No. Hell no, it does not excuse it not in any way, shape, or form. But it does explain it.

So, hold on, let’s go on with this. Okay, both abuser and spouse can be mentally ill people who collude out of a mutually shared sadism. Now, that is also a possibility. In other words, there are a few people who can get a sense of pleasure out of out of treating children abusively, yes, that can occur. Over the years, I’ve known a few cases in which the wife was in such deep was in such deep need to avoid sexual relations that they preferred that their husband engage in audible relations with the daughter. This is usually unconscious it with full denial and operation. Absolutely. 110%. And I think that’s what was going on with my mom. I think a part of her was like, Oh, good. I don’t have to do it. Seriously, you know, because like I said, she and I talked about this after my dad dropped dead. May he roast in hell. So, you know, it’s like, that’s what we that’s what we talked about. And yeah, there was an aspect of that going on. And again, when she was six years old, she was molested by a step-grandfather. So, this totally is starting to make sense to me. It does not excuse it, it does not excuse it. I absolutely will hold her feet to the fire on that one. You know, it’s like okay, and you should have protected me, and you should have you know, so. Okay, hold on.

Kris Godinez  19:14

Um, okay, another case is chronic and severe drug and alcohol abuse loosened the inhibitions that otherwise sober people and sensible people would have. So, they do things that they would not normally do. Again, it explains it, it does not excuse it. There are parents who have been raised in strict and abusive environments, then repeat the pattern once they are parents, the vicious cycle of abuse is probably the major cause of domestic violence in the United States. So, it’s interesting that, again, it goes back to family of origin generational trauma 110%. So, okay, so there are reasons why the other parent does nothing, and usually, it has to do with their family of origin and who’s running the show. It would be their inner child, and their inner child is all about staying safe. And their inner child is helpless, right? And their inner child doesn’t want to get involved in their inner child doesn’t want to get in trouble. Interesting, because if they had confronted the abuser, what would have happened? Well, they would have gotten the beating, they would have gotten the sexual abuse, they would have gotten the verbal abuse. So, it makes sense. It doesn’t make me what’s the word I’m looking for? I can have compassion for that. It’s like, wow, that sucks. And you had no business having kids. Seriously. If you could not stand up for that child and say no to the abuser, you had no business having kids, Period. Period, you know. So generational trauma, generational trauma, so it’s like the grandparents abused, this parent abused. If this kid doesn’t go, get help. They’re going to abuse if they’re not conscious, which a lot of times they’re not, so there is that.

Okay, so the next article is when one parent is hurtful and the other stands by this is by peg Streep. This is on psychology today. This was posted July 11, 2019. Okay, not long ago, I got this message from a woman now in her mid-50s. For years I focused on my tyrannical father and how afraid of him I was. Mind you; my two brothers were scared of him too. But they dealt with it by being the boys he wanted them to be. I was paralyzed, voiceless, and had to work hard at disappearing from view.

But that didn’t stop him from picking on me mercilessly for being an embarrassment to him. It was only when I got into therapy that I started to realize my mother’s role wasn’t passive. There’s nothing passive about standing by and watching your husband abuse your children. So, 100% Correct. She isn’t alone. I often hear this from daughters whose fathers either stood by or retreated to safety of a den or workshop or hid behind a newspaper, or even worse, encourage their children to be accepting and understanding of the abuser. This was the emotional crucible for Jenna, now age 60. I think my dad loved me in a way. But he also left me utterly confused about loyalty and trust. My mother was hugely critical of me and snapped at me unfairly and constantly. She’d never let an opportunity go by to put me down. Or alternatively, ignore me. If I messed up, she’d go on and on about how I was a failure. If I did good or succeeded she’d pretend it didn’t happen or tell me it wasn’t important. When I got older, I started to push back; my father would step in, he’d appear to acknowledge that I was being hurt. But then he told me to placate her or apologize. He’d say, Oh, it’s just the way she is. Or she’s a good person deep down inside or something that made me feel as though he’d sold me down the river. That was as damaging in the end as my mother’s sniping, so 110% I cannot tell you the number of times my mother made me apologize to my father for him hitting me. Let me just say that again. Oh, it was your fault. Oh, you need to apologize to him. Oh, his feelings are hurt. I’m sorry, what? Yeah, that’s not Oh, K. Not okay. In any way, shape, or form. So yeah, the other parent will seemingly kind of go Oh, yeah, I understand. And oh, well, but that’s just the way they are. Ah, no, no, absolutely. 110% not you stand up for that kid. You stand up for that kid. Because that kid has no voice. And again, the reason the parent doesn’t is they’re afraid of the punishment that the abuser is going to get out to them. Yep. So Okay.

Um, when mom is firmly on Team Dad or vice versa, the daughter or son usually struggles with feelings of being singled out and ganged up on and not heard and not believed and not valued and not trusted and not. Yeah, that’s basically it. It’s like not heard, not believed, not trusted, not valued. It’s a betrayal. It is a huge, huge betrayal. That’s especially true if the parents play favorites or use scapegoating. To keep children in check. That kind of dynamic creates a very specific kind of damage. But the parent is bystander or one who acknowledges but palliates, I have to look that word up; creates a deep mistrust of others, and even distrust of love in which the child can last a deep distrust of love, which can last long into adulthood. Age 43 wrote, my mother is my father’s staunchest defender. My father is a control freak and bully, but she considers him strong, she thinks his put-downs are a way of keeping us from getting too full of ourselves. His criticisms a way of motivating us, his authoritarian style the mark of a man who knows his mind, I don’t think she is cruel by nature. She is meek and afraid, but she just gave up her own thoughts. It has taken me years to really understand that loving someone does not require you to lose your soul. And that how she treated me was about her, not me, I still have trouble trusting people and feeling safe. 110% The emotional confusion created by the bystander parent is very real and can complicate the process of recovering from toxic or damaging childhood experiences. Okay, am I focusing on my father because I can’t bear to blame my mother? That’s a question I received a few weeks ago from a reader who would believe that her issue with her father was with her father until she began to read my book, daughter detox, recovering from an unloving mother, and reclaiming your life. Let me just say this again, daughter detox recovering from an unloving mother, and reclaiming your life. She had always seen her father as the villain of the piece. But she began to see that what she considered her mother’s passivity was much more than that. She wrote to me to say that she was surprised by the level of betrayal, that she felt.

This realization that my mother was being active and not passive has thrown me for a loop in a weird way. I am angrier with her at the moment for doing nothing that I am for him for doing something isn’t that strange? Well, no, it’s not. It’s hard enough to confront the fact that one parent isn’t treating you as he or she should. But to focus on the roles both parents played in your treatment takes it to a whole other level. So basically, when you are working on your family of origin, hugely important, don’t just focus on the abuser, focus on who was standing around, who didn’t do anything. Who did jack diddly squat, what the eff was going on with that? See where I’m going with that. And it’s like, really, really, it’s like kneading dough. It’s like getting through it all. It’s like, you know, let’s get this. Let’s, let’s figure out all of the roles here.

So, abuse cannot happen in a vacuum abuse has to be allowed. And it has to be done in secret or with denial or whatever. So, who was around who didn’t protect you? Who didn’t speak up? Who was a bystander who played the victim? Who did all this? And that’s something to work on because none of this abuse was because of you. Let me just say that again. None of the abuse that any of us went through was because of us. It was because of the other people 110%. Okay, hold on. I will get to the questions in just a second. Okay. Okay. Takes it to a whole other level. Okay. It’s no wonder that some daughters choose to look away as best they can. This is what Greta share. I totally see my mother as the victim. And while I’m unhappy with how she treats me, I honestly feel she can’t help it. Because my father is super controlling. No, she could help it. This has caused a huge rift with my older sister, who sees my mother as a harpy who focuses on her father’s faults, has always berated him for not being a good enough provider, or anything else, and is cruel to her and me. She has very little to do with her mother and skips family visits and takes Dad out on her own. She and I have become distanced and estranged without declaring war as our parents age. She thinks making mom a victim is sick stuff on my part. I don’t know what to do. I just want everyone to get along. Oh, God, and that is it.

Kris Godinez  28:52

Kids just want to be loved. Kids are light little beings that just want love. And they just want everybody to be happy. And they just want to be able to play. And they just want to be able to be enjoyed and enjoy other people. That’s really what kids want. So, if you sell yourself to sell to get peace, right, you’re not going to have peace. You’re not, you know, you think, Oh, if I do this, it’s going to it’s going to be peaceful. Maybe it will stop, maybe they won’t yell, maybe they won’t. But in the long run, you’ll just start getting smaller and smaller and smaller and liking yourself less and less and less. And eventually, you’re going to be gone. And you don’t want that. Okay. That’s what these people are doing when they’re placating an abuser. They’re losing themselves every single time. Every single time. Hold on a second. Let’s get back to this article.

Okay, it’s worth saying worth saying from a cultural point of view. It’s easier to be open about an unloving father than it is to talk about, and unloving flies in the face of all the mother myths that all women are nurturing no, They are not, that mothering is instinctual. No, it is not that all mothers love their children. No, they do not. Anecdotally, at least, there is much more denial involved when it’s the mother who is abusive and cold, uncaring, narcissistic, or manipulative. And that’s true. It’s unfortunate, but it’s true. And yes, there are some crazy mother clickers out there. You bet yet Oh, narcissistic dark triads stalkers? You bet. Which is why I’m so angry about the idiot court because it’s like you mother. Write your senators. Okay. I will get to the question. I’m almost done with this article, hold on.

Third player your parents’ marriage, it is impossible to begin to understand the dynamics of your parents’ relationship. When you are a child, and remains difficult even into adulthood. We never become peers but always remain offspring. And especially in in dysfunctional relationships. That dynamic never change in a healthy mom dad kids’ relationship that mom and dad realize the kids are growing up and are adults in and of themselves. And so, the relationship grows in an adult way. But toxic, people always want the kids to be kids and never grow up. We never become peers but always remain offspring limited in our view of their marriage by the relationship we have to them and the fact that we weren’t around when their connection began. And they settled into their roles as spouses. We can analyze it all we want. But when it comes to understanding the influence, their relationship had on how we retreated. The chances are good that we will never get past the guessing stage. True, but you can do an educated guess, and you’re probably going to be right. It’s a very real blind spot. Working with a therapist can of course, clear away some of the brush, which will help. That was true of a daughter named Julia, who I interviewed extensively, she was marginalized and ignored by her mother and picked on by her father in childhood. And later, she went on into therapy, the specifics of her story helped her understand the role she played in her parents’ relationship. So, this is true. So, if you’ve got a family of origin with an abuser, and a passive, seemingly passive spouse, the kids are given roles. The kids are given roles distraction, comedian, second mom, second dad, you know, second spouse, you know, they’re given roles to play, and it has nothing to do with the kid. Nothing.But that kid. Not all out. So yeah, absolutely. therapists can help with that. 110%. Um, okay, let me see.

Okay, my birth was the cause of all hardship and strife. I was never allowed to forget it. They chose to have two more children later. And it was always clear that they that unlike me, my sisters brought them happiness and pride. That was the family story. And they have never deviated from it. Not in 50 years, I am still the source of their disappointments, large and small. And that is part of their bond in a weird way. Their marriage has thrived because they had someone to blame for their occasional unhappiness from the very start, my mother still dismisses me, and my father finds me lacking; it will never change. And I know that. So again, the role of the scapegoat, the role of the whipping kid, you know, it’s like, okay, so that’s, that’s who they put all of their stuff on to. Um, okay, let’s see. Anyway, the article goes on. It’s just really good about it really puts into perspective why some spouses stand by and allow the hurt to happen, why some actively engaged in it, etcetera, etcetera, etcetera. So, basically, their behavior towards us had absofreakinglutely, nothing to do with us. Nothing, zip, zero, zilch. Nada. It had to do with their inner child, their family of origin, what they were protecting, etcetera, etcetera. Now, does that excuse it? No, not even a little it explains it. And hopefully, that will start unraveling that self-esteem issue of I’m not worthy. When you realize that it had nothing to do with you. Their idiocy, they’re not interfering. They’re not protecting you had nothing to do with you. It had everything to do with them, their inner child, what they were afraid of their fears, their codependency, their need for security, etc., etc., etc. Which is why it’s so important to get this stuff nailed down if you’re considering having kids, because you do not want to pass on this generational trauma to the next generation.

So all right, let’s recap. So, to recap, people stand by and do nothing because they talk themselves out of it. They are convinced that they can’t do anything or that somebody else is going to do it. So you can’t assume somebody else is going to respond to an emergency or respond to abuse or whatever, you report it, you report it, which is why the things that have been happening lately are so chilling to me, because it’s like, okay, well, if you’re handcuffing people reporting abuse, who’s watching out for the abused, you know if you’re taking away the ability to punish a frickin dark triad who’s saying die now, eff off, who’s protecting that person? Again, stand by mentality, you got to stop it, you got to get involved, you got to get involved. And again, when I was growing up, I told people, I told people, I was being harmed. Nobody did anything because they didn’t want to fill out the paperwork. They didn’t want to take the time. They didn’t want to get involved. And they were afraid of being sued because my dad was an attorney.

So, you got to tell that fear to eff off it. Could you be sued? Well, hell yeah. In this country, you could be sued for anything, anytime, anywhere, for any reason? Yeah, absolutely. Is that a problem? Yeah, sort of. But you know, what, if it means saving someone or protecting somebody, then I’ll do it. You know, it’s like, bring it bitch. I don’t care. You know what I’m saying? So, it just, it annoys me greatly the bystander mentality, especially in toxic families. So, when you get that parent that’s like, oh, but that’s just the way they are. We don’t want them upset at me. You know, a wrong, an incorrect response, please go off the island. You know what I’m saying? I’m saying it’s just, uh, anyway. So basically, the way the parents behaved had everything to do with them, everything to do with their family of origin, nothing to do with the kids, nothing to do with you. It was not your job to protect them. That’s often the way it ends up happening is that the kids protect the other parent from the abuser. It’s not your job to make their marriage good or happy or whatever or be a scapegoat for them. It’s not your job to be a second mom or second dad. You did not ask to have 20 million children. And it’s not fair that an abusive parent makes a five-year-old babysit younger kids. Oh, yeah, that happens. You know what I’m saying? So, it’s this has all abuse has to do with the abuser. It does, and the standing by has to do with the family of origin issues of that parent, probably code a parent to parent, codependent parent, do you see where I’m going with that? So, they’ve got their own issues. They’re acting out of inner child stuff. Get to a therapist, if you are in an abusive relationship and you find yourself siding with the abuser, or you find yourself not protecting your kids, get out, get to a therapist, help yourself, help your kids, because here’s something to think about. You are role modeling for them. What a relationship looks like, do you really want them to get involved with somebody that’s just like your abuser? Hell, no, you don’t. So do something to help yourself. Do something to help those kids.

Kris Godinez  38:33

Okay, let’s hit the questions. Here we go. Do narcissists enjoy seeing their children, especially their daughters, getting hurt? I saw a narc protecting her sons more and being dismissive to the daughters. Like they don’t matter at all. Yeah, in some cases. Yeah. But here’s the thing. I think with narcissists, psychopaths’ dark triads, it depends on their family of origin again, so if they have, you know, daddy issues, or whatever, they may be more abusive to the sons and protect the daughters or vice versa or whatever. Do they enjoy seeing their children get hurt? Yeah, they do. They’re sadists. I cannot stress this enough, guys. When I say that narcissists, dark triads, especially, are sadistic and sadists. I am not just whistling a tune here. They enjoy inflicting pain because it makes them feel powerful. It is a power and control issue. That’s what it’s all about. And when I say they want you dead, I’m not just whistling a tune. I’m not. They want us dead. And this whole thing about, oh, it’s subjective. No, it’s not. If somebody says die now and eff off permanently, that says to me, that’s a death threat. Okay, so here’s what I think needs to happen. We need to get a psychiatrist to challenge that because, I Honestly, there is no subjective about this Perception is everything. If somebody sends me a threatening message, I’m going to take it as threatening. Thank you very much. And I should. So anyway, don’t get me started. But yes, they are absolutely sadists. They absolutely do enjoy it. Yes, they will play favorites. Yes, they will protect the daughters and not the sons or protect the sons and not the daughters, depending on what their own personal peccadilloes are.

Um, would you consider a parent who refuses to act a kind of dissociation? It can be? Yeah, absolutely. It 100% can be because if the abuser is abusing, and it sends them into dissociation, and they’re unable to act, that’s why I’m saying Fight Flight freeze are faun. But here’s the thing, after the fact, if the kid comes to you and says, mom or Dad just did this, okay, well, we need to do something. This needs to stop. So, I mean, somebody’s got to protect the kid. And I understand yes, dissociation can happen. 110%. But after the dissociative episode, and the kid says they’re being abused, that child needs to be protected. Period.

My stalker won’t stop, even with a restraining order. Should I move? Okay, so, stalkers are crazy, okay, with a restraining order, they generally don’t stop if they are dark triads and crazy enough, what should be happening is if the order of protection is being violated, you should be calling the police every single time and demand that they do something, because there’s an order in place this guy needs to, or this girl needs to be in jail, period. So, you could continue to call the police. If you’ve been calling the police and they are doing nothing, I would get vocal. I would go to the media, I really would. Because that’s the kind of biatch I am. So, you know, it’s like, let’s put a spotlight on this, let’s show how corrupt this particular police system is, you know, let’s, let’s do this. So, um, I would start, and I would reach out to a domestic violence shelter, domestic violence shelters have ways of literally you can change your name, you can get things so that they can’t look up your address, you can do things to disappear, basically, if you are being threatened like that. So, I would contact the National Domestic Violence Hotline. I think it’s the National Domestic Violence Hotline. So, they have information on how to get safe, what to do, etcetera, for sure. Okay, um, okay. Answered that question answered that question. Should you move? You know, it depends. If, if your police department is not doing anything, and you’ve made them aware that they’re not doing anything, then I would look into, Yeah, moving. Absolutely. But here’s the thing. If the stalker is really crazy, that’s a good possibility they could follow, which is why if you’re going to move, you want to disappear from the public records, you want to make sure that they can’t just do a public search and find Thank you, John, find your new address your new phone number, I mean, etc. Is it a pain in the hind end to do that? You bet. But if it gets rid of a stalker, it’s worth it.

So again, I would contact your domestic violence shelter. You might also look into a lawyer. Because here’s the thing, if you’ve got an order in place, and the police are doing literally nothing, you may have a lawsuit. So, look at that. So anyway, because I swear to God, it’s like, public agencies do not listen. But if you hit them where it hurts, which is in the pocketbook, they suddenly start paying attention and start doing things. Funny how that works. All right.

Um, okay. I am in long-term recovery from a very toxic family five years, no contact. How do I keep strong? Oh, Kay. So, leaving a toxic family is difficult it is because that’s been our family, right? And that’s what we thought was normal until we came out of it. And we’re like, whoa, this isn’t normal. So, you want to have support, you want to be in a support group support groups are great. Now keep in mind, though, that there are a lot of predators in support groups, so you’re going to have to be careful, but support groups are really good. It’s good to get support. It’s good to go talk to other people that have gone no contact that are, you know, working on themselves. Get with a good trauma therapist. This is how you keep strong as you keep working on you. You will keep working on you. You cannot fix them because you did not break them. You work on you. They may have broken you are bent. You can work on you. So that’s what you want to do so you want to get with a good trauma therapist. Get into a support group out of the fog.net. I think has support groups you can look up narcissist survivors there’s tons of support groups out there get with a good trauma therapist work the books I recommend C PTSD from Surviving to thriving by Pete Walker, the disease to Please Harriet breaker. The Self-Esteem workbook by Glenn Schiraldi The Inner Child Workbook either by Lucia Cappacchione or Catherine Taylor. All of those are great books get plans in place. I think the betrayal is something that kind of literally knocks us off our feet when we realized that our family of origin was no bueno, didn’t support us, wasn’t kind wasn’t good to us, you know, really betrayed us. The betrayal is really hard to deal with but necessary write and burn letters Dear mom Dear Dad, dear abuser, dear brother, dear sister, whoever was abusive, you go through the whole thing the good, the bad, the ugly, the horrific, the unforgivable, and at the very end, kick them out of your head. Y’all don’t have any space up here anymore. I’m evicting you by the by now go pound sand by you’re not up here not allowing it by trot it out to the barbecue. Read it out loud once burn it, let it go. Okay.

The other thing you want to do is get plans in place so when we go no contact with a family. We are going to look at things differently holidays, birthdays, anniversaries, important events, family emergencies. What are we going to do? Deaths in the family, how are we going to go to the funeral or not? You know, do we need to be involved with it. So, it’s really sitting down and deciding what your boundaries are. With the family, you’ve gone no contact with so so and to be aware toxic families will do a Hoover toxic families will do the whole Oh, medical emergency so and so is dying; you need to get back in touch with the family you need to get back in touch with your sister or brother you need to get back. Be careful because they do medical Hoover’s, they do a family emergency Hoover’s. They do Hoover’s to try to drag you back into the family to be in contact with them. So, you want to sit down and decide, okay, am I going to contact them? If they say there’s an emergency? Or am I going to kind of feel it out and see what’s going on? I would suggest feeling it out and seeing what’s going on and making sure it’s a real emergency and not just, you know, come back into the fold emergency if that makes any sort of sense. So, its deaths in the family. That’s another thing. So, it’s like okay, so do you really want to go to the funeral? You don’t have to if you don’t want to now, society will say Oh, but you have to go; why? They were abusive? Why would I go? The only reason I would go is so I could probably put a pile of flaming dog doo-doo on their grave. No, thank you. I don’t want to go, no, thank you. You know, so really, it’s sitting down and deciding what you want and what your boundaries are.

Kris Godinez  48:14

If you’ve gone no contact, stay no contact. You know, if there’s a family emergency, suss it out see what’s really going on. See if this is a Hoover it very well could be if there’s a death in the family that’s up to you whether or not you want to go or what you could do is wait until after the funeral and then go visit then go visit the grave. That is something you could do. Thank you, Siri. I’m so that’s something to think about. So, these are all you know, when we go no contact, we don’t really think about all of the things that are included with that. So, with holidays, right? So, in the past, you might have gone and hung out with a dysfunctional family. Well, now you don’t have to and rather than looking at it as a oh my gosh, I don’t have any family to hang out with it should be uh, oh my gosh, I don’t have any family to hang out with. Huzzah! I get to do what I want. So, plan something for you. Go do something that you’ve always wanted to do. What have you always wanted to do on Thanksgiving? What have you always wanted to do on Christmas? What have you always wanted to do for New Years? What have you always wanted to do on your birthday and not have it ruined by a bunch of narcissists? What do you want? Start thinking about that. And or this is why  I like support groups. There are things to do with other people. You can have friends giving friends Thanksgiving or a friend’s Christmas or, you know, whatever. There are other ways to have community without being in a toxic family, and don’t let that trip down memory lane drag you back into the family.

So, the biggest thing that happens to people is they leave an abusive family. The holidays hit and they get nostalgic and they’re like oh, but well that’s your inner child get with your therapy. Just work on the inner child, do something else, do something fun, do something you enjoy that you’ve always wanted to do that you couldn’t do because of the family. So that is my suggestion for that. Make sure you have friends, make sure you have support, make sure you have people to talk to. This is really important. You’re not alone. Dear God, you’re not alone, there are so many of us that have gone through having to go no contact. Now with me, I had my older sister, so I wasn’t completely no contact. But for a good portion of my family. Yep, I didn’t speak to them. So anyway, there is that. And that is how you keep strong, you work on yourself, and you come up with contingency plans so that you’re not alone or feeling alone. And you don’t avoid your emotions. That is really important is that that’s the other thing is that when we get out of an abusive relationship, or family relationship, one of the things I hear a lot is, I don’t, I don’t want to feel, I don’t want to think about it, I don’t want it. Well, guess what? You got to deal with it. You do. Because if you don’t, if you just shove it underneath the carpet, if you just, you know, oh, it’s dirty, I’m just going to put it under the carpet, you’re going to get a lumpy carpet, that’s going to be really hard to vacuum. And it’s twice as hard to get clean. Do you see where I’m going with that? So don’t be afraid of your emotions.

Don’t be afraid of your anger. You’re going to be pissed you are, you’re going to be sad because you were betrayed, you’re going to be, you know, all sorts of stuff happy because they’re gone. And you don’t have to deal with them. Wow, you know, relieved all sorts of stuff. So, the emotions are okay, allow, allow, allow process, get with a good trauma group, trauma support group, get with a good trauma therapist, you know, and try different modalities. So, like I said, you know, CBT is great talk therapy in conjunction with EMDR. I think those are that’s a really good combination because you’re hitting it from two different levels. So, there’s tap therapy; there’s EFT, there’s, I mean, there’s all sorts of modalities that work really well with trauma. So, find a good one.

Now, when you’re looking for a trauma therapist, make sure that they’re not just trauma-informed, they need to know they’re a hole from a hole in the ground. Nothing pisses me off more than when I hear somebody went to somebody who was trauma-informed, informed, and they didn’t know what they were doing. So yeah, make sure they know what they’re doing. So, ask other people who do they see. Do they like their therapist? Do they understand narcissistic trauma? Do they get toxic families? Do they get having to be an orphan at age 50? Do they get that? Do they understand what it is to finally figure out the betrayal and the abuse? that’s those are the questions you got to ask. Okay. Um, alright.

What can we do if people if the people being abused our nieces or nephews, I have tried many times to protect my niece. But her mother seems to put her right back in unsafe situations. You just have to keep calling. Unfortunately, CPS, you call authorities, you know since the mom is not doing the right thing, then you have to take it up to the next highest level. Seriously, that’s what you do. That’s what you do. And you work with those kids as much as you can if you have access to them. I don’t know how old they are, you know, but you let them know nobody has the right to hit them. Nobody has the right to scream at them. Nobody has the right to sexually molest them. Yeah, and you just take it up to the next you’re going to have to probably call authorities. You’re probably going to have to call CPS or DCS or whatever. They’ve named it. lipstick on a pig if you ask me, but, you know, there it is. Okay, let’s see.

Um, have I decided on the meet and greet date yet for Salt Lake City? No, I haven’t. But I am looking at probably August, just as close as I’ve gotten because I’m doing all of this stuff this right now. And soon as I get back from all my travels, I promise you, I will throw in Salt Lake City. So, it’ll be either August or September. So, I promise I promise. I promise. So, there is that. Okay. Do we have any other questions? Let me look. Oh, we’re done. Okay. All right. So. So Salt Lake City will be either August or September, I will get the data. Give me a couple of weeks. I got to kind of finesse things through and figure out what I’m doing. Okay, thoughts. What am I thinking? That one after that is in Florida, and that’s December 2. So that’ll be in Clearwater, Florida. The tickets are for sale on krisgodinez.com. That is, it.

Other than that, we need to write letters. We need to contact people. We need to stand up for the homeless. We need to stand up for ourselves. We need to stand up for those who are being abused, and I think the thing that annoys me It is when I hear somebody go, Oh, well, that doesn’t affect me. You are selfish. Don’t get me started. It affects all of us because once an abuser feels confident in their abusing, they continue to abuse, and they abuse other people, and they push the envelope because they’re psychopaths. Which part of dark triad psychopaths Do you not effing understand? So, they don’t stop. They don’t stop there. They’re like the Terminator. So, you’ve got to stop them. They’ll stop if the benefits do not outweigh the cons. So, if they’re getting embarrassed publicly or if they’re going to jail or if they’re whatever, they’ll stop doing it because it’s no fun anymore. So, for them, it’s their idea of fun is really twisted anyway. So, there is that so write your your congressman write The Supreme idiot court. You know, tell them this is not okay. Tell them this is not this is not okay. This is not subjective die now is a threat. So all right. That is, it. All right, you guys have a great week. And what am I talking about?

Next week, we’re going to talk about anxiety. So, we will be talking about anxiety and how to cope and why we get nervous over seemingly odd things. So, we do it’s like social anxiety or going somewhere new or driving or, you know, what is that about? So, I’m going to call that a case of nerves. Because if I say anxiety, YouTube is going to be like, Oh, we can’t talk about so. Anyway. All right. So, a case of nerves so we’re going to talk about anxiety, we’re going to talk about what it is, why it happens, and what you can do to help yourself because you show me somebody who survived abuse. I will show you somebody who has anxiety. There it is. Alright, guys, have a great week, and Happy Fourth of July and I will talk to you next week. I will talk to you on Wednesday. Okay, bye.

Thank you so much for listening to this podcast. You can always listen live on YouTube every week Sunday at noon, Arizona Mountain Standard Time. And if you want to find out more or listen to other episodes, you can go to Krisgodinez.com and if you have a chance, subscribe to this show on whatever podcast app you use and let other people know about. I want to thank my sponsor betterhelp.com. They are an online therapy company. Whether you are in the US or international. They will set you up with a qualified licensed therapist. PhD level or Master’s level. If you are interested in more information, go to betterhelp.com/krisgodinez.

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The post 07-02-2023 When People Do Nothing appeared first on Kris Godinez.

Have you ever wondered why some people just cannot make a decision without asking everyone and anyone? What causes a person not to trust their own judgment? Have you ever met someone who just wanted to be taken care of to the point of clinginess? That would be someone with a dependent personality.

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Hello and welcome to We Need To Talk with Kris Godinez podcast. I’m your host Kris Godinez, licensed professional counselor. I help people get out of, and stay out of, toxic relationships. This podcast is for informational and educational purposes only the views and opinions stated herein are mine and mine alone. They do not represent the ACA, the APA, or any other therapist for that matter.

I want to thank my sponsor betterhelp.com. They are an online therapy company. Whether you are in the US or international. They will set you up with a qualified licensed therapist. PhD level or Master’s level. If you are interested in more information, go to betterhelp.com/krisgodinez.

Oh, okay. So, as you may notice, the background is a little different. So, John and I are doing our first attempt at Snowbirding, so we’re going to see how it goes this summer traveling with Okay, I’m going to switch that around where the puppies can you see the puppies, there’s the puppies. So, there’s Lucky and there’s Moana. So, we’re, we’re traveling with the puppies. So that is very exciting, very nerve-wracking. They’re actually really good travelers. I’ve been very, very fortunate and lucky with these dogs, literally. So anyway, that is that we’re up in Boise right now visiting the kids. And then, we are going to head over to Portland for the meet-and-greet. So, there are still tickets available. Andy, please leave that in. There are still tickets available on krisgodinez.com. So go to krisgodinez.com and get your tickets for the Portland meet-and-greet, which will be Sunday, July 2, between two and four. The location will be given to you once your ticket is purchased. So, there is that.

Hello, everybody.

So current event for today. All I can say is, WTF, Russia? Seriously, what is going on? John. So last night when we got into the hotel, John and I turned on the news, and John’s like, oh, there’s a coup, and I’m like, Oh, this could be bad or good? I don’t know. But all I can say is Oh, hi guys. Why are you all trying to come into the camera view? Hello. My co-host Lucky, my other co-host.  Moana. Anyway, so John and I were both… John is sitting there laughing. Both John and I were both like what is going on? Because we started talking about it. So, the Wagner group is a mercenary group. They’re paid mercenaries, meaning somebody pays them to do what they do. So, for them to turn on Putin is kind of like, well, who’s paying them what’s going on? And then to do like a failed coup kind of kind of go in but not really go in. So, I’m not quite sure I understand what exactly that is all about. And then they said, Oh, well, we brokered a peace deal, and the guy is going to Belarus to live. So, to this point, what has happened in Russia is anyone who is opposed to Putin, anyone, you know, political rivals, generals, you know, diplomats, whatever, anybody who said anything bad about Putin, this guy had said a lot of bad things about Putin, call him like granddaddy, and, you know, basically saying he was old and frail and didn’t know what he was doing. Left out crazy, but yes. But anyway, so everyone who has opposed him has ended up dead, and it’s always been by suicide, and I put that in bunny ears because it’s like, oh, had six stab wounds. 23 bullet holes fell out of hermetically sealed window… was suicide. That’s seriously, that’s what’s been happening.

So, I’m kind of like, how was A. How was this guy still alive? B. What is the deal was sending him to Belarus? See, even if it was staged? What does that serve for Putin? Cuz all it does is make him look bad and weak. I don’t like Putin. I think he’s a megalomaniac. I think he’s insane. Um, that’s just my personal opinion. That is not a diagnosis or a professional opinion. Yeah. Anyway, um, so there’s that. So that is my current event for the day because I’m trying to figure out what the heck is going on. It’s like. This doesn’t… none of this makes sense. And it stinks to high hell because it’s like an attempted coup that didn’t go all the way through. Most people don’t start a coup unless they are assured of winning it. What does that sound like? Right? So, they usually don’t start something unless they’re assured of winning it. And then for it to be backed off and now this guy is living in Belarus when everyone else who’s ever done anything even remotely, not even to the extent that he did verbally about Putin, was killed. I’m just… something’s off. Something is way, way, way off. And I’m suspicious because Putin has been rattling his saber at the Ukraine, rattling a saber at the United States going, Oh, you guys are sending drones, and I’m like, your own guys are like turning against you. So anyway, that is my WTF current event for the day. Anyway, as Yeah, it was a little it was a little nerve-wracking John and I were like, well, what’s going to happen and you know, nothing yet. So anyway, there’s that.  Okay, I just It stinks something something we’re not getting the whole story. I don’t know what’s going on. But it just it stinks. So anyway, there’s that.

Okay, so today we are talking about Dependent Personality Disorder. Hold on a second, I want to get to my other phone where I had loaded. Okay. So, the question was, why are some people incredibly dependent, you know, beyond codependency? So, like, just, you know, can’t make a decision, have to ask everybody’s opinion, doubts themselves to the core, needs to be with somebody all the time. So, like they get out of a relationship, boom, they immediately get into another relationship. So Dependent Personality Disorder, this is from the Mayo Clinic, excessive dependence on others and feeling the need to be taken care of, submissive or clingy behaviors towards others, fear of having to provide self-care, or fend for yourself if left alone, lack of self-confidence, requiring excessive advice and reassurance from others to make even small decisions. Difficulty starting or doing new, doing projects on your own due to lack of self-confidence. Difficulty disagreeing with others and fearing disapproval, tolerance of poor or abusive treatment, even when other options are available. An urgent need to start a new relationship when a close one has ended. So yeah, I think we’re going to have to move it looks like we’re going to have a little league team in here pretty soon. We got some time. Okay. Um, so anyway, so that is, that’s what Dependent Personality Disorder is.

So, what causes it? So, I know a lot of survivors of abuse have got that codependency. And that dependence, you know, clinging, meaning don’t want to be alone. So basically, what causes that is trauma in childhood. So usually, when you have an abusive parent, or you have a parent that absolutely refuses to allow you to make decisions. So, like, they take over everything. Remember how we talked about how narcissistic parents take over every decision, the child is never allowed to make a decision. Never allowed to make their own choice. Or if they do, they get made wrong. They get put down. They get told they’re bad and wrong and stupid. And this, that, and the other thing. So, it boils down to the person that has Dependent Personality Disorder usually ends up being codependent. They usually come from some history of having been in an abusive situation where you’re not either not allowed to make decisions or the decisions that you made were made fun of. So, you’re afraid of making a decision? Because if you make the wrong one, what if? So, it’s in with the anxiety disorders. It’s really in with the anxiety disorders. So, it is born of a fear. Please go away be stuck landing on my phone. So, it is, it is born of a fear of making the wrong decision. It is born of the fear of being made wrong, perfectionism, etc., etc., etc. So, it’s also connected directly to self-esteem and the bee is back.

Kris Godinez  09:12

And it’s gone now. I love nature. I’m actually I do I just don’t like these. I do like these. I just don’t like these things stinging. So anyway, um, it’s born of the fear of making the wrong choice. And so dependent people are incredibly clingy. They have this basic assumption that they cannot, not that they, you know, won’t so much, but that they literally cannot take care of themselves. Like I can’t do it. Now. I know the question that’s coming is that oh my gosh, my elderly narcissist does that. Okay, yes, narcissists do play the victim, narcissists do play the, you know, oh, I’m helpless. You have to do it for me. You have to think for me. You have done everything for me. The motivation is different. When a narcissist does something like that, it’s a power and control issue. When somebody who’s dependent personality disorder does that, it’s because they truly believe that they cannot do the right thing. Like they’re incompetent. That’s literally their basic assumption is that they cannot do anything right. They’re incompetent. And they’re making the wrong choice. So, they ask everybody around them. Well, what do you think about this? And should I do this? Or what do you think about that so they come off as very clingy. They come off as very not knowing what they’re doing, constantly needing reassurance. Some of these traits are in with narcissism. But it’s different in that the motivation is different. So, we’ve got all of these things going on, we’ve got this fear of making the wrong choice. We’ve got perhaps a history of abuse in our, in our past, we’ve got this perfectionism. Oh, my gosh, I’ve got to make the right choice. It’s got to be the right thing. I got to make sure it’s the right choice. I’m going to ask everybody in their dog what, what they think and what I should do. And this that new thing, or, and we’ve got this, oh, my god, I can’t be alone. I can’t be alone. I can’t be alone. I can’t. I can’t, I’ve got to have, I’ve got to have a partner, I’ve got to have it well, so let’s talk about why a lot of people that come out of abuse do that. It is self-esteem. Okay.

So, people who love themselves, let me say this, again, people who love themselves enjoy, actually enjoy their own company. Seriously. Seriously, they don’t need a relationship, want a relationship? Sure. Need a relationship? No. So people that are struggling with self-esteem, generally, are the ones that are like, I’ve got to have a girlfriend, I’ve got to have a boyfriend, I’ve got to be in a relationship. Are you sure you want him chewing on that stick, John? Okay. Um, so you know, I’ve got it, I’ve got to be in a relationship, I’ve got to be, you know, that type of thing. So, they’re afraid of being alone. They don’t like what they think. They don’t. They need the distraction of what’s going on up here. And generally, when we’ve been raised by abusive parents is our internal dialogue is nasty. I mean, it is nasty. It’s not nice. The internal critic is like, on steroids, and just vicious and cruel and mean. And so, a lot of people look for an external validation in order to make themselves feel better and a distraction so that they’re not having to deal with all the shame that gets shoved into our space. And that goes for people that are dependent. People who are dependent often have a lot of shame. And they have a lot of fear and a lot of distrust and a lot of…. Do you see where I’m going with that? So, it’s really not um, what are you doing? It’s really a matter of working on your self-esteem, work on your self-esteem for so many reasons.

So, dependent personality disordered people have a hard time believing that they can make the right decision and that they are competent, and that they know what they’re doing. So, when you work on your self-esteem, confidence is one of the things to work on. Certainty.  Judge not yourself. That’s the other thing is that we are so mean to ourselves, be certain that you know what you’re doing, and mirror work is going to play into this. So, when we are dependent, when we are constantly asking other people’s opinion and constantly second guessing ourselves and not able to be alone, that is the time to be alone. And that is the time to work on your self-esteem. And to do the mirror work. The Self-Esteem Workbook by Glenn Schiraldi is perfect. Mirror work. When you’re doing the mirror work, what you’re going to do is you’re going to be Hi. Good to see you. Have a great day. You know what? You do know what you’re doing. It’s okay for you to make decisions, right or wrong. How do we learn? Sometimes we learn by making mistakes. Mistakes can be corrected. Okay. But when we’re with an abuser, oh my god, we better be perfect. Oh my god, we better have the right answer. Oh my god, we better… do you see where I’m going with that. So, we quickly learned that it’s not okay to be wrong. Because for the narcissist, it’s not okay. For them to be wrong. Does this sound familiar? So yeah, narcissists can’t stand it again, interfering in a child’s natural development. Children learn from falling down. They learn from mistakes. That’s how we all learn, but a narcissist interferes with them and shames them for falling down or shames them for making a mistake. And then the kids quickly learns, Oh, I better not make another mistake. I better not. I should, you know. And then the thoughts up here start getting nastier and nastier and nastier. And then the desire to not be alone gets stronger and stronger and stronger, so that there is a distraction so that you’re not dealing with all of this.

So Dependent Personality Disorder really sets us up for codependency. It sets us up to be low self-esteem. Absolutely. It is driven by low self-esteem. And it makes us what’s the word I’m looking for? It really does take our power away because we hand our power off to other people going well, what do you think? What do you think? What do you think will tell me what I should do? Tell me what I should do. You know that kind of thing. Co-dependent people come off as very clingy. And it’s again; it’s not because of like, say, for example, borderlines can be very clingy. But this is because they want somebody to love them. borderlines wants somebody to love them. But it’s not like a manipulative thing. It’s more of a I need reassurance thing if that makes any sort of sense. So anyway, that guy’s that is. Hi, hi Lucky. Are you? Thank you.

Kris Godinez  16:26

That is what I know about codependent personality disorder. So, it is not one of the cluster B’s; I think it’s one of the cluster C’s. So, it is in with the avoidant personality disorder, Dependent Personality Disorder, and all of that good stuff. So yeah, so really, the way to work on getting rid of avoidant or avoidant Dependent Personality Disorder is to work on your self-esteem. First of all, get with a good trauma therapist because a lot of these personality disorders, except for narcissism, are rooted and antisocial are rooted in abuse, they’re rooted in traumas. Something happened. So, somebody abused or made wrong or put down or controlled or manipulated to the point where the child no longer felt capable, or able to make a decision or confident making a decision. So, get with a good trauma therapist. Now somebody had asked me on modalities for this, I would say EMDR CBT. And usually, EMDR, in conjunction with CBT, would be the best because now you’ve got the talk therapy going plus the EMDR. I would also suggest for lots of work. I would also suggest EFT, that’s the Emotional Freedom Technique. That’s the tapping. So, but do you’re going to have to confront the childhood stuff. Yeah, not just trauma-informed? Absolutely. 110%, you do not want a therapist that’s trauma-informed, you need a therapist that knows they’re a hole from a hole in the ground. They need to know trauma inside and out, you know, and also with an EMDR therapist, and with any modality, please, please, please interview your therapist before you go in to see them in look at the reviews. Because here’s the thing, a lot of dicey, not really ethical therapists will say, Oh, I know EMDR. And it turns out they had a weekend seminar in it. No, you don’t know EMDR, it would need to be a long-term program where you’ve really worked on that’s your focus. So also, that you want to watch out for therapists that have multiple modalities now, do I do eclectic when I need to? You bet I know enough about the eclectic stuff. So, like, say, for example, I had this one client that was absolutely having an existential crisis. And CBT was not working. So we went into existentialism, and that worked for him. And so that’s what I did with him. But that’s not my forte.

That’s not what I’m super, super, super good at what I’m super, super, super good at is CBT. So, you don’t want somebody who’s got like, Oh, I do EFT and EMDR and CBT. And does that the other thing and bla bla bla bla bla, no, you know, it’s good to have knowledge of all of those. But what’s your focus? What is your what is the one you’re really good at? So, make sure that they’re not just that they don’t just have a certificate that they actually that’s their main training. And that goes for basically any modality, so DBT, same thing. So, all right, where was I? Saying something with trauma therapy. So, it’s going to be a challenge, working through the trauma, because part of all of the pretzels that people with Dependent Personality Disorder put themselves through is to avoid dealing with the thoughts that are mean and nasty and vicious. So, the other thing you’re going to want to do is get CPTSD From Surviving to Thriving by Pete Walker, why I know I keep harping on this, but here’s the reason why you’re going to want to put back onto the abuser, all the shame, all the blame all the anger, all the guilt, all the, you can’t do it, etc., etc., etc. And I’m not kidding you. It really does help in the healing process. So, what you’re going to do is you’re going to write a letter to your abuser or to your family of origin or who or teacher, professor, I don’t know, whoever told you, you couldn’t do it. Whoever said, Oh, you’re, you don’t know what you’re doing. You can’t do this, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. So, what you’re gonna do is you’re gonna write them a letter, and you’re basically gonna go dear whoever, here’s the truth, I do know what I’m doing. Thanks for playing go pound sand, etc., etc., etc. And you’re gonna take your power back, and you’re going to tell them you don’t believe them. I don’t believe you anymore. You lied. You lied to me. You lied to me about who I am. You lied to me about what I can do. And guess what? I now trust my gut, I know what I am doing. I know who I am. And you don’t get to tell me who I am. You just don’t. So, you’re going to do that. You’re going to tell them to go pound sand with both barrels. And then you’re going to take it out to the barbecue, or you’re going to bring it into your therapist, whatever you want to do. So, you could take it to your therapist, and you could read it out loud and have the therapist help you go through it. Or you can take it out to the barbecue; you can read it out loud once and then burn it and let it go. You know what I’m saying? So there that is. So that will help with the, the dependency and it’s taking your power back. That’s really important.

So, the other thing, too, is, and that’s why I’m saying CPTSD From Surviving to Thriving is so important because it helps you work on all of that stuff. And I know that people are always like, I don’t want to write a letter, I don’t want to think about it, I don’t want to deal with it. Well, here’s the deal, you’re going to deal with it consciously. Which is painful, yeah, to be sure. Or you’re going to end up dealing with it unconsciously. Which is even more painful because you’re acting out. And you’re doing behaviors that you don’t understand. And you’re going to be self-sabotaging. And you’re going to be hurting yourself and the people who love you. So, it’s best to do it consciously. It’s best to take your power back consciously and just be like, Nope, this is what I’m going to do. This is how I’m gonna work on myself, etc., etc., etc. So anyway, those are the two things that I can think of to help with the Dependent Personality Disorder. Doing the mirror work is hugely important. Hi, good to see you. Have a great day. You know what, it’s okay for you to make decisions, baby steps, because I can guarantee you that as soon as you say it’s okay for me to make decisions, that little one inside of you is going to have a fit. The little one inside of you is just suddenly going to go oh my god, oh my God, oh, my God, oh, my god, I can’t do this. I can’t do this. I can’t do this.

You know, yeah, you can, you can do this. So, you basically are going to challenge those mistaken thoughts and those mistaken beliefs. And you’re going to give yourself permission to make decisions. Give yourself permission to not ask 20 million people if you’re doing the right thing. So that is hugely important. So, it’s a multipronged? What’s the word I’m looking for? It’s a multi-pronged approach. It’s like, you’ve got to work on the thoughts and the belief, you got to work on the emotions. You’ve got to work on the inner child, inner child workbook by Katherine Taylor. How old were you? And this is important. When your caregiver started shaming you for whatever decisions you made, how old were you? Because that’s how old you are as an adult. So, the inner child running the show, when you find yourself being clingy, when you find yourself not being able to make a decision, when you’re terrified of making a decision when you’re looking for comfort, when you’re choosing to not be by yourself and basically jumping right back into another relationship. That’s how old you are. So that little one, instead of being punished and made wrong, really needs to be loved, and talk to and comforted and told that it’s okay. And guess what, they don’t need a relationship. They need a relationship with themselves and to start working on self-love, self-approval, self-validation, self-acknowledgment. I see you; I hear you. I believe you. And you know what you’re doing, and it’s okay for you to make a decision. It’s okay for you to be alone for a little while, a little while. So, if you’ll notice, when people who are abused get out of a relationship, they want to dive right back into another relationship because the inner child is the one running the show. It’s being dependent, that saying, This alone is going to last forever, that’s really young, that’s a really young age to be thinking at. Does that make sense? Because little one’s little ones don’t have the concept of time. Time to them is like forever, right? As you get older, you know, your concept of time changes, but to a little one, it’s like, oh, it’s gonna be forever, it’s gonna be forever.

Kris Godinez  25:20

And so, then they grasp on to whoever this happens to be around them. And usually, unfortunately, it’s usually another abuser. Why? Because their picker is broken, and they haven’t done the work, you got to do the work. If you’ve got Dependent Personality Disorder, avoidant personality disorder, borderline personality disorder, histrionic personality disorder, you got to do the work. You got to do the work, that is the only thing that is gonna get you from point A to point Z, where you want to be. So that is super important. Okay, what else can I tell you guys about Dependent Personality Disorder, they’re kind of difficult to be around because they are so clingy and in need of validation all the time. Which sounds like narcissism with the needing validation all the time. But it’s different. Again, the motivation is completely different. The narcissist is looking for an ego hit. The person with Dependent Personality Disorder is simply looking to be validated. Period. That’s it. There’s no other intent there. So, again, it’s all in what is the intent. What is the intent? What is what is the intention of this? So? Okay, I think that’s it.

Kris Godinez  26:42

Shall we hit the questions, John? Okay. Okay.

I’m a new mom, less than a week old, less than a week old. I’m really confused how my mother treated me so poorly. I’m really angry and the trauma is hitting like, it’s brand new. What do I do? Okay. So, you’re really confused about why your mom treated you so poorly. You’re really angry. And you’re you need to know what to do. All right. So, when we have kids, it triggers us from when we were kids, and it brings up all of the trauma from that point in time, I strongly suggest that you get a good trauma therapist. So, when our caregiver treats us poorly, it’s confusing. It is because we’re constantly told by society, we’re constantly told by, you know, friends and family, oh, but they’re your mother. Oh, well, but no, they’ll come through, oh, well, no, they’ll take care of you. And then they don’t. And so, it’s that cognitive dissonance. It’s kind of like, well, they’re supposed to be loving and kind and caring, and they weren’t, and they continue to not be. So, what the heck? So, it’s bringing up all of the trauma you went through as a kid every single time a client of mine has their child go hit an age that where they were abused, and boy, it triggers them like nobody’s business. So, it’s a really good idea to get with a good trauma therapist, journal, write it out. So, it’s going to be a write-and-burn. If your mom is still in your life and is still abusive, take a look at going no contact. Being angry again, you’re going through all sorts of hormones, too. And something to watch out for is postpartum. So, and that is something to keep an eye on. So, it’s a week, you know, the hormones are up and down, your emotions are going to be up and down. That’s kind of normal. But if it’s specific to your mom wasn’t nice to you. There was abuse going on, and you’re getting triggered, then yeah, you want to seek out a trauma therapist to work on that; not trauma-informed trauma knows what they’re doing therapist, so yeah, for sure. Okay.

Kris Godinez  28:56

Does a narcissist make herself dependent on others on purpose for her own advantage, and then later is truly dependent as they forget how to do life by themselves? Yes, it is absolutely 100% on purpose 110%, And they don’t forget how to do it for themselves. They don’t they know what to do. This is all a game. This is a game. They deserve an Academy Award-winning statue because it’s all a game. So yes, they are absolutely. It’s a power and control issue. So, when a narcissist does the dependent stuff, it’s the learned helplessness, okay? And they sometimes pass that on to their kids, and sometimes people with personality Dependent Personality Disorder also have learned helplessness. The good news here is if it’s learned, it can be unlearned, and it can be replaced with healthier behavior. So learned helplessness is I can’t, you’ll have to think for me. I didn’t know when I’m bull-tinky they know exactly what to do. They know how to do all this stuff. They do. They absolutely do. They get off on the powerplay of making people do it for them. They do, and then as they get older as they turn into collapsed narcissists. Like I said, they’re the ones in the nursing homes, snapping their fingers at the staff and demanding that they service them and, you know, pay attention to them and this than the other because I can’t do it myself. But yeah, you could. And, in fact, the more stuff you do for yourself as you age, the better off you’re going to be. But narcissists, you know what’s funny, narcissists never do that. What they do is they will sit on that couch, they will sit in that reclining chair, or whatever it is, and they will literally start rotting. And they’ll do whatever, so yeah, it’s absolutely they want people to wait on them hand and foot. My grandmother on my mother’s side was an absolute narcissist. Are you kidding me? And she was perfectly capable of taking care of herself. So happy hi babies look at you are pretty. So, she absolutely was capable of taking care of herself. She chose not to. And, you know, and it her body started. Deteriorating because she wasn’t exercising. She wasn’t walking. She wasn’t taking care of herself. She wasn’t doing anything intellectual. She wasn’t, you know, stimulating her mind. She wasn’t. She just wanted to be felt sorry for. Oops, got a leaf on you. Hold on, buddy. Let me get that leaf off. There we go. So, um, thank you. So yeah, so yeah, they absolutely they absolutely do, but do they know how to take care of them? Yeah. If the rubber met the road, right? I think that’s the right term. Sometimes I say these terms. I’m like, did I say the right one? Or did I mix two together? Anyway, um, if it really came down to it brass tacks, if it came down to brass tacks, they would know what to do to take care of themselves. They’re. They’re acting. Absolutely. Okay. Next question.

Kris Godinez  32:03

Do narcissists lie about their experiences and past? Like, they might say that they were abused in order to justify their behavior. Oh, god, yes. And do they even know their own behavior? Okay, narcissists absolutely lie about their past, how many times have we heard about, especially politicians lying about military service, pretending to be heroes, etc., etc., etc? Yeah, they absolutely lie about their past. So, they will lie about being abused in order to get you to open up. That’s something to watch out for. So generally, healthy people don’t talk about abuse in the first date. narcissists, on the other hand, are, you know, oh, well, you know, I was abused as a kid. And, and this that the other hoping that you’re going to open up and tell them about your abuse so that they can just store that stuff away, and then use it at a later date. So that is what they do. What was the other part of that question? Yes, they lie. Yes, they believe it. Do they even know their own behavior? On some level. Yes. But you have to understand the pathology going on, especially with a dark triad. Okay. Which is psychopath, narcissist, Machiavellian. The pathology there is they are so delusional that they truly, truly believe their own lives. You can watch it. We talked about this, you know, kind of cross over their face when they’re confronted with the truth. So yeah, you want to they, on some level, they know they’re lying. But they’re convincing themselves. And that’s why they repeat their lies so often, because the more you repeat something, the more your subconscious mind is going to believe it. And the more your flying monkeys are going to believe it too. So, there’s a purpose for everything they do. Absolutely. 110% Do they know their lying? Yeah, on some level, 110% You can watch it. You can see them kind of be like, Yeah, can I get away with this? Yeah, yeah. Can you know that kind of thing? So yeah, absolutely. They do they do now? On some level next.

Kris Godinez  34:22

How do you deal with people that want to bring up bad things that happen? Oh, you tell them. I’m not interested. This is okay. This is where no comes into play. No. Is your friend. No is a powerful word. No is a protection word. It is a word of boundary. It is a wall of No, you know, and no is a complete sentence. So, when you tell somebody no, you offer them no explanation. No, I’m not interested in talking about that. No, I’m not going to tell you about that. No, this is not on the table for discussion. Thank you. So, something I do when somebody who is particularly heinous, you know, ask me something that they really have no right to, and I’m not interested in sharing. And I’m not interested in giving them an explanation because that’s what abusers want you to do; they want to get you on the ropes so that you give them an explanation so that they make you feel less than that’s what that whole needing an explanation is. So, when somebody does that to me, and I don’t really like them, or care about them, or give a damn if they’re never gonna see them again, and they’re evil, then I will say something like, well, thank you for asking.

Kris Godinez  35:35

And that’s it. I never say another word. And they either get really uncomfortable and a little bit, but it no is a complete sentence. We’re not talking about this period. And if they continue, you walk away. So, it’s boundaries, its boundaries, The Disease to Please Harriet Braiker, great for co-dependency stuff. Boundaries, you want to be able to say no and not feel guilty about it. So, abusers will try to make you feel guilty for saying no, never, ever on this or any other planet; feel guilty for saying no. It is your right. You have the right to say no, no, I don’t want to talk about that. No, I’m not going to do that. No, I’m not going to gossip. No, I’m not going to be your flying monkey. Do you see where I’m going with that? So yeah, no is a complete sentence. All right. Next question.

I apologize all the time to literally everything.

Kris Godinez  36:28

How do I stop doing that. Okay, Self-Esteem Workbook. So, when John and I first started dating, I would run into mannequins and apologize to the mannequin for running into them. Seriously, show me somebody who has survived abuse from a family of origin. I will show you somebody who over-apologizes. And the reason is, is because even when we weren’t in the wrong, we had to say I’m sorry to our abuser. I can’t tell you the number of times my mom made me apologize to my dad. If I could throw a middle finger right now, I totally would. Because I had nothing to apologize for. I had an emotion you didn’t like it? Guess what? Too bad. So, but he was like, you know, knew you can’t be mad at me. That’s what abusers do. Good. Parents know that their kids sometimes get angry with them. Absolutely. Bad. Parents view it as a defying authority. You’re being, what’s the word? I’m looking for. obstinate, You’re being stubborn. You’re defying me. You’re this. You’re that instead of, oh, you’re a little kid having big emotions. Little kids have big emotions, and they’re not always going to be happy, happy, joy, joy. They’re just not. So um, yeah, abusers absolutely will not allow their kids to have emotions. And they will absolutely try to control them. And what was the question? I’m sorry, I lost it again. Apologize. Apologizing. So, you’re apologizing constantly for having an emotion for being a regular kid. For you know, you’re always apologizing for everything for existing God. I mean, that. Yeah, abusers make their kids feel like they need to apologize for their existence, you know? So, like what my dad did is, he always made us responsible for him not retiring. Oh, it’s your fault. I can’t retire. It’s your fault that this is happening. It’s your fault. I’m unhappy. And it took me until I was in my teens to realize, no, you’re the one who’s making all these choices. You’re the one who is miserable. You’re the one who nobody likes. Gosh. Who’s the problem here? None of your kids must be you. You see where I’m going with that. So yeah, we do end up apologizing, apologizing, apologizing.

So, work on self-esteem, the Self-Esteem Workbook Glenn Shiraldi. Get your self-esteem up to where it needs to be. You do not need to apologize for existing. You don’t. You don’t need to apologize for existing, and so many of us who came out of abusive families of origin feel that need to apologize all the time. You don’t you don’t need to apologize for existing. Mirror work. Hi, good to see you. Have a great day. I give you permission to exist. I permission you I give you permission to be I give you permission to be happy. I give you permission to have emotions. I give you permission, period. Do you see where I’m going with that? So, work on the Self-Esteem Workbook by Glenn Schiraldi and work on the mirror work. You have a right to have your own emotions. Notice what you’re apologizing for. Who are you apologizing to? What is driving it? What’s the thought? So, for me, it was when I bumped into the mannequin, and I said I’m sorry, I went, What the frick is that? You know, and then it’s also good to have friends pointed out, it’s like, Hey, you’re apologizing again, you don’t need to. So that kind of helps to validate that, hey, I don’t need to apologize for the only time you need to apologize is if you have harmed somebody, and you need to make amends, that’s really the only time you need to apologize. You know, it’s other than that, no. So, there’s that.

Okay. I’m not sure if this is a question or not somebody put, did you heal your attachment style from childhood? If so, how did you move to more secure?

Kris Godinez  40:23

Okay, so moving to more secure? This is a question. So, did I heal my attachment style from childhood? Yes. How did I move to more secure a, I went to therapy. Seriously, I went to therapy, I went to Ruth Hornaday in Chico, when I was a teenager, I went to Fabian Smith up in Portland when I was an adult. I continued my therapy on in Phoenix. And I worked on the self-esteem, and I did mirror work. And I wrote and burned letters like nobody’s business. So, and you start surrounding yourself with healthier people, the healthier the people you surround yourself with, the ones that have the secure attachment, the more their behavior rubs off on you. So, it really is a truth that you must be careful who you allow in your life. Because if you’ve got people around you that are all abusers, or low self-esteem, and they don’t like themselves, and they’re always apologizing for themselves, and they’re always harming themselves, and they’re always, you know, drama, and this and the other thing, it’s going to be very difficult for you to heal. So, you want to surround yourself with people who’ve got a good attachment, who liked themselves, who are also dedicated to working on self-esteem, who are also dedicated on improving themselves bettering themselves, etc., etc.

So that is how you heal that attachment is you work on your own self-esteem, and you surround yourself with friends. And if you have family who have got good self-esteem, absolutely. And that helps with the security. So, security is not just being with somebody. It’s being with yourself. And it’s recognizing that those of us who were abused by toxic family members really truly got abandoned. We truly, truly were abandoned in every way, shape, and form. You know, it’s like either through the abuse itself, through the neglect itself, or through the other parent enabling the abuser. Like for example, when my mom insisted that my mom insisting that I apologize to my dad for having a natural emotion for being mad at him. Because he was abusive. Go figure. So, yeah, so it’s really important to work on self-esteem. Okay, that’s it. Okay, kiddos, we’re going to call it good for today. So, you guys have a great week. I will be doing a show next week. There are still tickets available on krisgodinez.com for the July 2 meet-and-greet in Portland. I don’t know what that show is that I’m doing on that Sunday. I’m going to have to go look, so I will also do the questions on Wednesday so, and then I’ll let you know what the show is. All right, I will talk to you guys later.

Thank you so much for listening to this podcast. You can always listen live on YouTube every week Sunday at noon, Arizona Mountain Standard Time. And if you want to find out more or listen to other episodes, you can go to Krisgodinez.com and if you have a chance, subscribe to this show on whatever podcast app you use and let other people know about. I want to thank my sponsor betterhelp.com. They are an online therapy company. Whether you are in the US or international. They will set you up with a qualified licensed therapist. PhD level or Master’s level. If you are interested in more information, go to betterhelp.com/krisgodinez.

You’ve been listening to the podcast version of We Need To Talk with Kris Godinez.

The post 06-25-2023 Dependent Personality appeared first on Kris Godinez.

When a breakup with an abuser happens, have you ever wondered why they suddenly go on a rampage trying to discredit their former target of abuse? What does an abuser get out of such egregious behavior? Why do people believe them? What is a flying monkey anyway? These and many more questions will be answered in this week’s episode!

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Hello and welcome to We Need To Talk with Kris Godinez podcast. I’m your host Kris Godinez, licensed professional counselor. I help people get out of, and stay out of, toxic relationships. This podcast is for informational and educational purposes only the views and opinions stated herein are mine and mine alone. They do not represent the ACA, the APA, or any other therapist for that matter.

I want to thank my sponsor betterhelp.com. They are an online therapy company. Whether you are in the US or international. They will set you up with a qualified licensed therapist. PhD level or Master’s level. If you are interested in more information, go to betterhelp.com/krisgodinez.

Hello, today is Father’s Day. So that’s the current event I wanted to talk about. I completely forgot it was Father’s Day because, I guess you know, it’s kind of one of those. It means nothing to me because my dad was abusive. So, for those of you who had good dads, good on you. Have a great day, go enjoy yourselves. For those of us who had sperm donors that were abusive. Here’s the deal today sucks. It just let’s just call it what it is. It sucks. Because we’re reminded through you know, stupid commercials or you know, going out to dinner or whatever, that we didn’t have a good dad. So basically, your goal should you Your mission, should you choose to accept it, take super good care of yourself. It’s okay to acknowledge that your sperm donor was abusive. It is. Now if you are the acts of a sperm donor, that’s abusive obviously you’re not going to say that in front of the kids, the kids will figure it out on their own. But for those of us that had a parent that was abusive, the dad that was abusive, you know, it’s perfectly okay to write and burn. I can’t tell you the number of fathers days I did that where it was just like dear asshat and then just laying into him and just being like, you know, sorry you weren’t you weren’t a dad you know if you want it to be thought of well and written about kindly. How about you not being an abusive POS?

So anyway, there that it so basically what I’m saying is, is that today is hard for a lot of us. I’ve gotten to the point, though, where it doesn’t even kind of register, you know, it’s kind of like to me it’s just another day, but yeah, so you know, right and burn if it’s bothering you, right and burn. Self-Care, self-care like a boss. Take super good care of yourself. Take your power back. Seriously, because I know for my family, it was oh, we need to keep this secret that dad is crazy. Well, everyone in town knew he was nuts. In my book, what’s wrong with your dad? I talk about it even know where it is. It’s here somewhere. I talk about how a woman came up to me at spruce drugs in Gridley, California, and was like, What’s wrong with your dad? I’m like, Oh, sweetheart, do you have about four hours? So, I mean, it’s okay to acknowledge it. It’s okay to be like; This person was abusive. This this parent was not a good parent. This person was abusive. I endured whatever and, and because it’s an and world, I’m taking my power back. I am going to take care of myself today. I’m going to do mirror work. I am going to work on self-esteem. I am going to work on boundaries. And you know what? It’s okay for me to acknowledge out loud that Dad was abusive. And I think that’s important. Because we get a lot of that. You know, you can’t first of all, you can’t say anything about the dead. Oh, oh contraire. Okay, for me when somebody says that to me, I look him dead in the eyes. And I say I dare him. I dare his ass hind end to show up and say something to me because he will get an ear full. I’m not afraid of him anymore.

So yeah, it’s we’ve got this weird, you know, you can’t see anything ill of the dead. Yeah, you can. Yeah, you can absolutely 100% And if they’re stupid enough to come back and try to haunt me damn, I dare him, you know what I’m saying? Um, and then the other thing we get is Oh, Honor thy mother and father go pound sand. I’m sorry. It’s a two-way street. The very next line says parents do not bring your children to anger. So, you know if some if somebody pulls that they’re a flying monkey or they’ve got issues of their own that should be like a blaring huge glaring red flag. Okay. So um, yeah, so there’s that. Um, so anyway, so because it is Father’s Day. That’s the that is the current event. Do take good care of yourself. Do acknowledge the abuse. Do you acknowledge yourself validate yourself, you survived you’re listening, you survived Good job, you know, and write and burn, get it out of your head, get it onto paper, get to the point where when Father’s Day happens, it’s not even a blip on your radar until you’re like, oh, okay, you know. So that’s where I want you guys to get. And basically, it’s acknowledging it, it’s getting it out in the open. That is the big thing.

Abuse and shame and all the crap that our Father gave us, if they were abusive, is all it thrives in the dark. So, bring it to the light, bring it to the light, get it out. Be honest, be open with yourself. Do not obviously if you share children with a narcissist do not tell the kids Oh, he’s an asshat. And this that and the other thing they’ll figure it out. Do be honest. And you point out behaviors. That’s what you do you point out behaviors. Anyway. That’s what I wanted to talk about. Anyway. So that is the current event for today.

So hi, how are you guys doing? today? We are talking about why they smear why smear what is what did they get out of that? What is up with that? Oh, so much they. So

Kris Godinez  06:15

Narcissist, you’ve got to understand when you’re dealing with somebody who is narcissistic personality disorder, okay. And they are not just a trader, too. They are like full-blown, match all the criteria, etc., etc. Generally, what you see happening is that all of the different personality disorders start overlapping, okay? So, they will be very dramatic. They can be very, what’s the word I’m looking for vindictive, like nobody’s business. And the biggest mistake I see people making when they go to divorce or leave or get out of one of these relationships is that I will start to warn them I will say you absolutely need to read Splitting by Bill Eddie and Randy Krieger. And you absolutely need to read the No-Nonsense Guide to Divorce by Laurie Hillis. So, you understand the judicial system. So, you know how this whole thing works. It’s not immediate it. So, I encourage them to do that. And then I warn them about what I have seen in the past what I have seen abusers do to their target of abuse. And the words that come out of their mouth really terrify me, they are like, Oh, they would never do that. They Oh, no, they would never do that. And I’m sitting there like pulling my hair outgoing. Take the blinders off. There’s a reason you’re leaving him. He did X, Y and Z. She did XY and Z to you what in the hell tarnation makes you think that they’re not going to do beyond XY and Z? You know?

So, um, it’s a defense mechanism. I think I think it’s we don’t want to believe that somebody could be that heinous. They are that heinous they are. And I think the other thing that we do is we make the mistake of thinking that because we wouldn’t do something like that, that they wouldn’t do something like polar opposite, we wouldn’t do something like that they absolutely would do something like that. That’s why they project. So, this whole projection thing that goes along with the smearing, is them assuming that you’re going to act the way that they would act. And unfortunately, it’s the reverse, you’re assuming that they’re going to act the way you would act. And you cannot do that you’ve literally got to put yourself into their shoes and go how is this asshat going to act? What how is this going to serve their ego? Why? Because there is no there there? I cannot stress that enough. There is absolutely no there there. There it is all ego there is nothing but ego. That is why they cannot change. That is why they will not change. That is why they’ll they’re manipulative. It’s all about ego defense. Me, me me I, I, I. More. My genitals. Seriously, that’s what it’s all about.

The smear campaign gets going because they’re behaving based on Well, that’s what I will do. That’s what I would do. So, they’re going to do that. So, I’m going to beat him to the punch and then they start and they’re crazy. And if they’re a dark triad if they’re crazy enough they’ll be the ones that end up getting a restraining order because they’re crazy. So, um so that’s why they do the smear campaign is because there’s no there’s nothing up here. Nothing but ego. Like seriously, they cannot relate to another person. They literally cannot put themselves into somebody else’s shoes. You and I can put ourselves in somebody else’s shoes and go oh, what that must feel like holy crap, and feel it and have empathy. There is none of that there, and any that they pretended to have It was just exactly that it was a pretense. It was a, an act. It was an illusion.

Okay. So, their whole smear campaign thing is based off of welll this is what I would do, they must be going to do this. So, I’m going to beat him to the punch. And then they go about doing the things that they would do because they’re heinous. They don’t understand that not everybody thinks or behaves the way they do. And when somebody thinks differently than they do or behaves differently than they do, it upsets their little applecart. Let me tell you because they’re very threatened by that.

Remember, we talked about how threatened the abusive parent, the toxic parent is, by the talented kid. Because they don’t want them to succeed. They don’t want them to do well. They don’t want them to outshine them. So, it’s, it’s kind of the same thing. If a spouse is not behaving the way that they would, oh, my gosh, it threatens them so badly. Anyway, the smear campaign is all ego based. Okay. That’s why they’re doing it. There’s there’s so much going on. They’re sadistic. Okay, this is what they would do. This is what they enjoy. Not what you would enjoy. I mean, normal, healthy people do not enjoy drama number one, unless it’s on the screen. Okay. So, um, but they are, they need drama to live seriously. They need drama The way the rest of us need oxygen. So, it’s a lot of drama. And it’s a popularity contest. It’s so when they start the smear campaign, it’s this power and control, and Ooh, can I get their family to abandon them? Can I get their support system to abandon them? So, there’s that element of power and control, isolation, and sadism. And they will lie. You know, they’ll say they’ll accuse since they are projecting, they will accuse the spouse, the one that’s divorcing them, male or female, doesn’t matter of the very thing that they’re doing. So, if they were the cheater, if they were the, you know, stole money, if they lied, and did XYZ, they’ll flip it around and say that the ex is the one that’s doing all of that, or did all of that, etc., etc., etc. And it’s again, its projection because it’s like, well, I would do that. So, they must have. Yeah, they really do think like that, guys. They really, really, truly do. And when I hear apologists go, oh, but they’re sick, and oh, they can’t change. No, they could, they refuse, they refuse. They’ll go to therapy until the therapist starts going, Okay, and what’s your part in this? And then they’re just like, nope, not having it. I’m perfect. There’s nothing wrong with me. I’ve never made a mistake in my life. My father actually said that. He actually his favorite quote was, I’ve never been wrong, only temporarily mistake and now realize this is when we were out in the middle of the forest. And our station wagon was high centered on a rock in the middle of a creek and Jesus Christ. Anyway, the point being, is that they are never wrong in their heads. Healthy, normal people are able, and most of us probably sit there and go, geez, I wish I could have done that better. Yeah, kind of screwed that one up, huh? Yeah. narcissists, don’t they, won’t they absolutely.…Their ego is driving the show. And it’s dangerous. It’s dangerous because egos are out of control. So that is what is driving the smear campaign.

So, there were a couple of really good articles that I pulled up from. What did I do? I just had my glasses there. They’re from Psychology Today. And this one is okay. Now I’m going to read that one later. What is the narcissist smear campaign? What is it tactics, and how to deal with it? And this is on choosing therapy.com. I thought this one was really good. So, I’m going to read this Who’s a by, written by Katie Gillis, and she’s an LCSW. And it was reviewed by Raji Abul Hossen. And he’s a medical doctor. So anyway, I thought this one was really good because it really covered the whole thing.

So, a narcissistic smear campaign is used to discredit another person by hijacking the narrative of the relationship after it is ended. A narcissist will spread lies and create embellishments about their victim, their target of abuse, in order to destroy the individual’s reputation. This is a common behavior for those with narcissistic personality disorder when they realize that they have lost control over the person. What is a narcissistic smear campaign? Narcissistic smear campaign is a narcissistic manipulation tactic used to harm a person’s reputation and isolate them from their support network. While this method is most commonly used by those with narcissistic personality disorder, smear campaigns are not that different from typical efforts to slander an individual, such as that between politicians and an election, however, the big difference is one conducted by a narcissist will be incredibly vindictive and persistent, they won’t stop. It’s like a dog with a bone. Often this is what a narcissist does at the end of the relationship. Elements of a smear campaign is vengeful, and there’s almost a perceived injury such as a threat to their pride that causes the narcissist to engage in the smear campaign. Well, yeah, because they’re all about power control. And when a target of abuse leaves, their ego can’t handle it. You’re leaving? How dare you? How I leave you, you don’t leave me that seriously the way they think. But they won’t leave; that’s I wish they would all just go to Mars, no oxygen, that would be so nice. Anyway, I’m sorry. I have no sympathy for them. They’re abusive, they’re hurtful. They’ve harmed people. They’ve killed people. They’ve killed dogs, they killed cats.

Kris Godinez  16:00

They’ve killed you know, I just,I’m not sorry. And I’m not going to be sorry. I’m not sorry. I really wish they were gone. Um, it is done overtly. And it can be also done covertly. I want to be very clear. Their purpose, their behavior, is often excessive smear campaigns are much more than the occasional talking behind someone’s back. These are persistent and consistent acts to harm another person’s reputation. It is done purposefully. It is done purposefully. They know what they’re doing. Don’t kid yourself. a narcissist knows what they’re doing. Their actions are not done by mistake, despite what they may say to others about just being concerned. I just wanted to warn you because I’m so concerned about so and so’s behavior. They’re acting crazy. Oh, God, does that one sound familiar, guys? Holy crap. All right. Um, it is persistent. Even when faced with backlash, such as someone not believing them or getting a restraining order against them, their behaviors persist. It contains narcissistic projection, which we talked about.

Many with NPD traits project their bad qualities on to others. If they lie, steal they, and steal, they accused the target of doing the same thing. Its calculated narcissists know who they can and cannot manipulate in their smear campaign. No person is off limits, but they usually have an idea of who will believe what lies.

Although caveat, I will say two things. They can be sneaky about it; they can be less overt. They can be very much the oh, Lord of the Rings, Worm tongue. That can be like worm tongue. You know, it’s like this dripping poison. Just, you know, just little comments, little comments. And here’s the thing you guys have to remember. The smear campaign has generally started months before you’re ready to leave. They know on some level that you’re out. They know, on some level, they do. And they will start the smear campaign before you’ve actually left. So, there is that I wanted to point that out.

Um, why narcissists use the smear campaign? Well, there are many reasons why narcissists use a smear campaign, and they can often vary depending on the nature of the relationship with the victim. Usually, they revolve around a need for revenge, a goal to discredit the target, and the narcissist’s own lack of compassion and empathy. They do it to protect their image. They’re afraid of being seen as less than they do it to maintain control. It may be a way to remain in control of a situation. If they feel they’re losing power over a person, this can cause a narcissist to go full force into a smear campaign in order to try to convince others to their side. So, it’s a popularity contest. That’s what I started to say. It’s, it’s, it’s kind of like when the divorce happens, or when the split happens. They literally are like, well, you’re either with me or against me. How about I’m not with you, and I don’t give a Frick what you do, buddy. Um, yeah, it’s they’re very much you got to choose, you got to take sides, you got to choose. And something I very much want to point out is, is that you cannot have mutual friends. You cannot. And it’s going to talk about this in this article a little bit. If you have mutual friends, you run the risk of them being flying monkeys. You also run the risk of them reporting, which is a flying monkey back to the abuser and telling them where you are, what you’re doing, who you’re seeing, where you’re working, etc., etc., etc. It’s dangerous. Do not have mutual friends. If you have somebody who goes, I’m Switzerland. How nice for you. Bye. We’re done. No, thank you. You know, because you cannot risk having one of the Switzerland types say something to the other person. Okay?

A lot of times when they start the smear campaign, if they are really unhinged, they’re dangerous. They really are. They will stalk they will go to extreme lengths to try to get you fired. They’ll try to do things to harm your relationship with your family. They’ll try to do things to make sure that you are thrown out of your apartment. I mean, it’s crazy cray cray we have entered cray-cray land. Hold on. Okay. All right.

They want to appear to be the victim. Many people with narcissistic traits believe they are doing what they need to do and aren’t behaving inappropriately. Often, such as in the case of ending of a relationship or a friendship, or an employer got to be clear about that. They are the ones being victimized. a smear campaign is used to further this false narrative that they have been wronged. And it’s also used to get revenge. When the person with NPD traits feels wronged. a smear campaign can be used to get revenge on the person for any perceived offense. Whether they do this by making a victim look bad to their boss, or their family members’ court system, or their social circle circles. narcissists create a sense of doubt about the individual as a part of their efforts for revenge. So, part of it is their narrative is that you’re crazy. Let’s just be clear. Their narrative is that you’re crazy. And you’re the problem, and you’re the reason and bla bla bla bla bla, the biggest mistake I see people making, and we’re going to get into this a little more when I talk about the five ways to survive this, but I just I just want to just drill this into your guys’ head. The biggest mistake I see people make when they’re dealing with somebody who is targeting them and smearing them and this that and the other thing is that the target of abuse starts trying to defend themselves. Stop, stop trying to defend yourself. Listen to me now; believe me later, people who are willing to believe the worst of you absolutely do not deserve the best of you. Let me say that again. People who are willing to believe the worst of you absolutely do not deserve the best of you. You cut them off. You owe them no explanation, period, period. And if they’re claiming to be your family, they should know who you are. Hmm, you hear what I’m saying? So be exceedingly cautious around people who either demand an explanation or side with the abuser, or want to remain mutual friends. No way you can’t afford that. You cannot afford that.

So when they get you on the ropes, okay, when they get you explaining yourself, so let’s loop this back to codependency, I want people to like me, I need to explain myself. I can’t. I don’t want Oh, they can’t think this of me. Ba, ba. Well, you cannot control what other people think. Let’s be clear. You cannot control what other people think. You have to know who you are. And no matter what the abuser has said and no matter who believes it, radio silence because what they’re doing is they’re poking the bear, poking the bear, poking the bear, poke the bear, poking the bear, poking the bear, poking the bear waiting for you to explode so that they can sit back and go Ah, see ya told you she was nuts. Told you he was crazy. Yeah, ah see, I’m right. Don’t play their game. The best way to win is to not play, and this is a game just like everything else they do. So, I just want to do bring that uphold on just a second to God. I need a haircut or something I don’t know. Anyway. Um, To get revenge, okay, we talked about that, too, sense of doubt.

To accomplish a goal or a victory. Because everything for an abuser is a win, it has to be a win, it cannot be a lose, it cannot be a draw has to be a win for them. Not all smear campaigns happen at the end of romantic relationships. Some occur in workplaces, especially if one is a boss or a coworker with narcissistic traits. For example, office smear campaigns achieve the goal of making the narcissist look good and the coworkers look bad. Okay. Examples of smear campaigns families, they target their own family is not okay, so targeting their own families not off limit when a narcissist is wrong. A narcissistic parent might use the smear campaign against an estranged child or the family scapegoat in order to distract others from the family dysfunction or discredit any allegations of of trauma or abuse. Romantic relationships, probably the most recognizable smear campaign, is the one that occurs against the narcissist’s ex-partner. This is often done as an act of revenge as the narcissist feels injured by this person ending the relationship Mmm, they’ll create lies in court. They’ll try to turn others in the family and circle of friends against them.

Kris Godinez  25:07

It’s much more than a breakup drama or high-conflict divorce as it is commonly labeled and often excuse it cannot be excused any more guys. Family court systems have to understand this is systematic. This is psychotic. Because healthy normal people don’t have time for a smear campaign. That’s a load of crap. And judges that fall for it really need to be absolutely taken off the bench. They really do because they should know better. I’m sorry. You’ve been in this business for how long you’ve seen how many divorces. Hello? You know, it just… don’t get me started. Friendships. Sometimes a narcissist may use a smear campaign against a friend in order to discredit and isolate them. A narcissistic friend will go out of their way to hurt the reputation of a friend who they feel has shamed them in some way. While many men are not familiar with this tactic and brushed it off as normal drama. a smear campaign is a severe form of bullying. It is not normal drama. Let me be clear, healthy, normal people don’t have drama, period. And I’ll tell you what, if somebody tries to start drama in my space, nope, I walk away, I have no problem shutting the door and going peace out. I’m not interested. So, there is that.

Work relationships. A narcissistic coworker may use a smear campaign against a colleague or office mate to elevate their position or reputation within the workplace. Similarly, a narcissistic boss could spread rumors about an employee to prevent them from succeeding, or about an ex-employee to prevent them from succeeding in their new role, or with the goal of making them look bad to other staff members or upper management because they are threatened.

It is very common to religious and spiritual cults. It is very common for cults to use smear campaigns against someone who they feel is putting the faith at risk by speaking out against them. They may use behavior modification on current members brainwashing in order to create a mutual and shared sense of doubt and disdain against the person who has left the cult shunning. shunning. So basically, it’s shunning. So, they’re not allowed to contact that person, that person if they are contacted, they will shame them try to bring them back into the fold. You know, you’re going to hell, you’re on the wrong path, blah, blah, blah, you know, that whole thing?

Okay so that is why they do that. This is why they smear is it’s all power and control. It’s all about manipulation. It’s all about a win that whole thing. So, let’s quickly, and yes, I will get to the questions. Let’s quickly talk about how to cope with all that. Yay, Team! Okay!

Tips for dealing with a narcissistic smear campaign that’s still in the choosing therapy.com One do not feed into their manipulation. As difficult as it may seem, staying calm and collected when dealing with a narcissist is essential. Sometimes if someone refuses to react, this can stop the smear campaign in its tracks. At the very least, it will usually prevent it from getting worse. fighting back against the smear campaign can trigger narcissistic rage, which will only increase the narcissist’s desire to maintain their vision vengeful efforts, so basically, it’s kind of a Pick Your Battles kind of thing.

So, narcissists are very easily injured narcissistic injury. And as I said, explaining to them or to the flying monkeys why you’re not what they said only plays into their game. So, you do not want to do that. It’s kind of like gray rock. You want to do gray rock. You don’t need to explain yourself. So, when a narcissist starts accusing you of stuff, especially if it’s in like text, or our family wizard, or whatever, do not respond. You are only legally responsible for responding to what is directly related to the divorce or directly related to the kids. That’s it. So, if they go on this novel of you did this, and you did that, and you’re a horrible person, do not respond to any of it. Don’t, and I know that little kid inside of you is going to be like, but, but, but… you got to be like no Little one, we’re going to walk away, hold my hand, we’re walking away, and you walk away, or have somebody else read the email and pick out the parts that you need to respond to. That’s another good way to deal with that.

Okay, don’t try to persuade others. This can be the one of the most frustrating things for victims of narcissistic smear campaigns unfortunately, trying to persuade someone that the information they’re being fed is false can have the opposite effect of making you look like the vindictive one. Those who believe in narcissists lies are not your true friends. Did I just say that? Yes, I did. Okay, pick your battles when dealing with a narcissist. smear campaign Pick Your Battles. If the narcissist is making claims about your children, family, or employment, those are important enough to address everything else, such as lies about you having an addiction or some other nonsense. Simply ignore it. Eventually, their lies will catch up with them and their vindictive behaviors will shine through. And that is very true.

So, I had a stalker at one point, that was very angry at me because their favorite target of abuse got away from them. And they tried to take me before the board, and I had to go before the board and defend myself and you bet your sweet bippy, I did. And as soon as the board was out, I went, and I got a restraining order against them. So, and then when the restraining order was up, they tried to do it again. And I simply came on air, and I said, You do this again, and it will be reinstated. So, you better back off. So, you’ve got to be ballsy. You cannot be afraid of them anymore. You can’t, and especially when they’re going after your livelihood, your family, your children, you know, if they’re doing things that are harmful to the kids, absolutely. You cannot be afraid, and I know this is hard because of the frickin court system. But yeah, okay, hold on. Let’s get back to, and then we’ll get to the questions, I promise.

Stay true to yourself. Staying true to yourself during this time period is crucial. a narcissist is doing everything they can to get you to react in order to justify their claims of you being crazy, bipolar, selfish, do not give them the satisfaction of reacting to their claims. Remember your worth trauma therapist, work the self-esteem workbook boundaries like a boss The Disease to Please by Harriet Braiker, The Inner Child Workbook, Lucia Cappacchione, or Catherine Taylor. Basically, you need to really this is not the time to slack off on therapy, guys; either going to see a therapist or working the workbooks, you’ve got to because you’ve got to constantly remember who you are because they’re going to keep trying to tell you who you are, you’re not any of the things that they’re saying. Mirror work, do the mirror work. Hi, good to see you. Have a great day. You know what, you are a great person, and none of the things that your ex is saying is true. And I love you and then walk out seriously. All right, um, model good behavior, whether it be remaining positive as a positive example to your children or just choosing to avoid stepping in the narcissist to the narcissist level, conducting yourself professionally and respectfully at all times is necessary. If you bash the person, others will question if they what they are hearing is true. So basically, you don’t want to say anything that you do not want to be repeated in court, basically. And this is hard because, again, our natural instinct is to go but, but, but you know, and that’s the inner child and to defend ourselves and to say, Well, they did this and they did that and nobody cares, people. Nobody cares. What is going to matter is you rising above not responding, not responding, because if they’re sending all of these crazy, crazy grams, though, you know, our family wizard and texts and things like that, and you’re simply responding to what is having to do with the kids. That’s going to really, hopefully, if you have a good judge, that’s going to show the judge you’re not responding, you’re not playing, you’re interested in the kid’s welfare, etc. So do not get down to their level. seek support from others. Stay in contact with loved ones provides you with much-needed support and guidance. However, cease contact with any mutual friends or colleagues who are acting as flying monkeys’ narcissistic enablers. Focus your energy on staying close to those who truly support you. When you learn about nasty things being said about you, you will need someone to lean on. Friends and family who are not part of the narcissist’s attempts at triangulation are the best resources. Limit unnecessary communication. We just talked about that consider therapy. We just talked about that. Okay, in my experience working with survivors of dysfunctional toxic relationships, a smear campaign is very real is a very real and very traumatic event for the target. I advise the advice I give to my clients often corresponds with many of the suggestions listed in this article.

Kris Godinez  34:18

My advice to everyone is to pay attention when someone seems angry or out for revenge, taking talking about their painful experience is one thing bashing another cruelly is unacceptable. While not all smear campaigns are as obvious, be mindful of how someone conducts themselves in regard to another person can help prevent the spread of cruel misinformation. So, what they’re talking about is you know, when somebody comes to you and starts gossiping, basically, so that that is that is what they do. This is gossip, they’re spreading gossip.

So, the next article is five steps to surviving a narcissistic smear campaign do not engage. Pick your battles. Know your Truth continue to conduct yourself professionally. We talked about that. You ask yourself, Is this communication or reply necessary a nasty text about how ugly you are? Ignore it. A text about childcare? Yeah, that warrants a reply. Construct an emotionless surprise, I’m sorry, reply, take the emotion out of it. Absolutely. Facts and figures. So, you’ve got to be Mr. Spock when you’re dealing with these types because if you give them nothing, they’ve got nothing to come back at you with. They’ll have to get more and more outlandish with whatever they’re doing. So lastly, make the reply brief, one or two sentences at the most. I also recommend waiting about four hours before replying unless it’s childcare or court-ordered, okay, like that. If its court ordered that you have to respond immediately, okay, fine. Other than that, given a chance to reflect your emotions and construct a professional reply. Decrease the common links we talked about that okay.

So basically, in essence, they are incredibly immature; they are incredibly tit for tat, tallionic, you know, you do this, an eye for an eye. I’m going to get you. I’m going to show you. I’m the one in power. I, I, I,  did you notice that? Um, so the smear campaign feels personal, but you have to understand is completely about them. Because they’re talking about themselves. So, and they’re wanting revenge, and they’re wanting power, and they’re wanting control, and they want to see, you know, it’s a popularity contest, who can they get to leave you basically is what they’re doing. So, okay, let’s dive into the questions shall we?

Why are smears so successful? Because we don’t ever teach people about narcissism and abuse? We don’t? How many of you guys knew about this stuff before you went through it? I’ll wait. They don’t talk about it in high school. They certainly don’t. And they should because abuse usually starts there. We don’t teach it in the colleges. When I was going through my master’s degree. I asked about personality disorders because I knew my dad had a personality disorder. And the answer was, oh, well, they’re going to get rid of those. Because remember, there was a huge fight between half of the APA and the other half of the APA. The APA wanted to get rid of half of the APA wanted to get rid of personality disorders, the other half clearly didn’t. And thankfully, won. And I’ll give you three reasons why because the half that wanted to get rid of them were probably disordered themselves. So, they were like, Oh, well, you know, we can’t talk about it. And oh, well, you know, it’s a choice. And, you know, we don’t want to make them wrong. And I’m like. I will make them wrong. As long as the day is long. I will, if they’re harming people if they’re hurting people, if they’re killing kids, guy in Ohio, don’t get me started. If there, you know, killing animals and using that as an intimidation. Yeah, I will make them wrong. As long as the day goes on. You bet. You don’t like it. Don’t watch my channel. That’s my attitude. Sorry. And I’m not sorry. So, there it is. Oh, I’m on a tear today, aren’t I. Oh, anyway. Um, so that is why people are not onto it. They haven’t been taught. It’s not really been. It’s just now starting to hit the mainstream. And unfortunately, there is these apologists out there, like I said, who were like, Oh, poor narcissist. I’m like, No, not when you’ve seen what I’ve seen, personally and professionally. Back off, you know what I’m saying. So, we need more education. We need more education. It needs to be talked about, it needs to be out in the open, people need to be sharing their experiences, people need to get this is not just a one-off. This is not I’m sorry. I have close to 30,000 followers, and Shahida Arabi has got close to I don’t know, 40,000 followers or more. Same thing with Kim Saeed and then, you know, other speakers that speak out about this, this is not a one-off. It needs to be educated. It needs to be shared, it needs to be talked about. it needs to be discussed. It needs to be brought out into the open, and it needs to be people need to be aware of what to do when one of these jack wagons start trying to you know, harm you hurt you abuse, you discard, you devalue you, you know, smear, you stalk you, etc., etc., etc. So, yeah, it’s not discussed enough in depth. And I think people need to understand that if somebody comes to you and starts smearing somebody or gossiping, okay, let’s call it gossiping because that’s kind of what it is. Starts gossiping and going, oh, did you know that so and so said such and such, you need to stop that cold seriously. When somebody comes to me and tries to start something, and it doesn’t happen very often because clearly, they know how I’m going to respond. But if somebody comes to me into trying to start something. I will stop them and be like get them on the phone. You know what, I’ve got my phone. Where’s my phone? Let you know. Let me just get them on the phone for you right now. Let’s just see if that actually happened. They stop it. They Oh no, and they start backpedaling. So basically, you want to you want to nip gossip in the bud. You do because it’s especially now if it’s happy gossip like so and so got a promotion. That’s great. That’s fabulous. I love it. That’s fabulous. But if it’s a negative gossip, if they’re if they’re casting aspersions, you nip it in the bud, you know what, I’m really not interested in hearing this. But why? Because it’s not coming from the source. And then you walk off. You don’t have to participate. You don’t have to play it.

So why do so many people believe this because they were not privy to it and never see through them? Okay, flying monkeys are one of two things people who believe the abuser are one of two things. They are either just pathetically uneducated, ignorant, do not understand abuse, do not understand how charming some of these abusers can be, and how dangerous they are. I and or they’re a narcissist themselves, and they’re siding with the aggressor, which is an inner child thing to do. So, there’s a lot there’s multi-levels going on here.

Um, what can we do in response if it’s a part of a community we want to belong to? But this narc smeared me? Well, here’s the thing, if you rise above and you just be you, people will figure it out. Seriously. When I had that crazy person go to my board, I was like, Okay, bring it, you know, all I can do is be me. All I can do is speak the truth. And hopefully, I’ll end up okay. And I did so, and I was I worried about my community. Yeah, a little bit. But I also knew the people who know me knew that she was cuckoo for Cocoa Puffs. And yeah, so anyway, the point being is you be you. And you do not allow the intimidation because this is intimidation. This is bullying. This is bullying on frickin steroids. So, you do not allow the intimidation to stop you. And like I said, people who are willing to believe the worst of you do not deserve the best of you. So, you just go and be you.

Um, when a narc smears their target, do they eventually believe the lies they’ve told? Absolutely. That not eventually, immediately, immediately. I mean, they will. You can watch them tell a lie. I can’t even begin to describe it’s like those micro-expressions. And you can kind of see them doing somersaults in their head, going, no, this is true. No, yeah, this is true. Like, immediately, like, it’s not even eventually, I’m going to believe it. No, immediately they believe it immediately. Because it’s their lie. And they’re God in their universe. You know what I’m saying? Um, is it like, they think something about their target, and they make it the truth? Absolutely. Absolutely. And that’s a hard one for people to wrap their heads around. And I think that’s in part why people are like, Oh, they would never do that. Because this is absolutely so mind-blowing. It is. It’s like, yeah, they absolutely lie and believe 100% what they’ve just lied about, seriously. And, and they twist the truth, and they twist reality to fit their narrative. 100% So if their narrative is you’re a bad person, you’re a bad parent, you’re this, you’re that you’re The other thing, they will convince themselves 110% That that is true. And every lie they say is going to try to fit that narrative to get as many people to believe that as possible so that they surround themselves with a bunch of Yes, men, or Yes, women that tell them, oh yeah, you’re right. Oh, yeah, what you’re thinking is true. That’s what they do. That’s what they do. That’s what cult leaders do.

Kris Godinez  44:18

Okay, if the narcs lies are found out by the flying monkeys, will they abandon the narc? It depends. So sometimes they do, and sometimes they don’t know. When they do abandon the narc is generally because they were ignorant and uneducated and did not understand the true nature of abuse did not understand the true nature of a dark triad or a narcissist. You know, and that’s the other thing that bothers me. It’s like, well, I don’t think that necessarily we should be doing a full course of psychology in high school. I think it would be a really good idea to talk about these things. There should be a psychology class in high school. There really should be some sort of psychology, at least going through the diagnoses and kind of hitting on what they are, what their traits are and what it looks like and this that and the other thing, and then people can decide from there whether they want to go into psychology or not. Plus, the fact that would give them a really good base to know what to watch out for. So, um, I’m sorry, I forgot your question. Um, did he eventually believe the lies? No, I think I talked about that.

Okay. Oh, well, they abandoned lark, the narc. If they are educated, they will. If so, what happens to the narc when everyone’s gone? And what does the narc try to… wait? What does what did the narc try to achieve with this? So, narcissists cannot ever conceive of losing. It’s not in their wheelhouse. They can’t realize. So, a good stratatitian will look at all angles, okay? And they’ll be like, you know, oh, this is a Kobayashi Maru. I’m not going to I’m not going to win. There’s no way to win this. Right. Kobayashi Maru was in Star Trek. Go look it up. Anyway. Um, you know, in a healthy person would be like, Okay, it’s a no-win situation. All right, well, then I will do what I can to mitigate, I will do what I can to protect, I will do what I can. Do you see where I’m going with that. Whereas a narcissist never considers any situation a Kobayashi Maru. It’s always like, I’m going to win at all costs, and usually at all cost means the kids, the ex, the friends, the family, the whatever, they don’t care, you’ve got to understand when you’re dealing with a narcissistic abuser, they truly zero clucks given, you know what I’m saying? scorched earth policy, they would rather absolutely burn everything to the ground and be left there starving than to admit they were wrong. Or admit that they were lying or whatever, so okay.

Okay, what happens to the narc when everyone is gone? Okay, so what that is, is a collapsed narcissist, a collapsed narcissist. So, a collapsed narcissist is one who’s lost. And it can, it depends, it really truly depends on how crazy they are and how psychopathic they are. Because usually what will happen is if everyone abandons them, and they get hit with, like, say, a restraining order, it’ll devastate them, because at least temporarily, because they realize that they’ve lost, you know, they realize that they don’t have their cheering section anymore. They don’t have, and the law is not on their side. And this that and the other thing, if they are really truly crazy, though, if they’re really more psychopathic than they are narcissistic, they can be dangerous, they absolutely can be dangerous. So, And either way, you can never let your guard down. So generally, generally, one of two things will happen if they’re truly dangerous, they’ll intensify the harassment, and they’ll intensify the crazy, which means you need to be careful, get a restraining order, you know, make sure that you have friends and family who are checking on you that kind of thing. Or they will be a collapsed narcissist. And they will fall into a deep depression for at least a little while. Not very long, but long enough so that you get some breathing room. And they’re less likely to try it again if they realize that it’s going to not benefit them. So, remember narcissists, just not dark triads, but just straight-out narcissists. it’s all about the win for them. And if it doesn’t give them what they want. They generally don’t try it again. If they’re psychopathic, like my Stalker was, they tried it again. Until they realized, oh, shoot, the same thing is going to happen. So, you know what I’m saying? So, you just got to be careful either way.

So, what happens to the narc when everybody is gone? And what did the narc try to achieve with this? I’m not sure I understand that last part of the question. Basically, what narcs want to achieve is they want everybody on their side, like literally everybody. And when they’re found out when people start, you know, when blinders come off, and they’re like, oh, oh, okay, you know, that wasn’t their goal. Their goal was to manipulate and control, so if you could clarify that last part of the question, I would really appreciate it. Or you can IM me after the show. Okay.

I am part of a smear campaign started by my mom. I tell my relatives about how hurtful it is. They told me they love My mom, that she is bored and lonely. Oh, good God, no. So, here’s the deal. Stop telling your relatives. It’s not going to do any good. It’s not going to do any good, especially when you get the response like that. They’re apologists. I’m sick of apologists. I’m sorry. I’ll tell you what, if somebody, anybody, had listened, I wouldn’t have gone through as much as I went through with my dad. They all made excuses for him. Oh, you know, he’s stressed out. Oh, you know, he’s older. Oh, he’s from a different generation. Oh, you know, baba, baba, baba. And I’m like, Are you kidding me? You know, Oh, you got to love your father. Oh, you’ve got to love your no, you don’t you absolutely do not its… love does not hurt. Love is not hurtful if it hurts. It ain’t love, period. So um, okay, I can’t get them to see my pain. They’re not going to. Why do relatives defend the person starting the smear campaign? Because they’re either narcissists themselves or they do not understand the true nature of narcissistic abuse. And anyone who is siding with an abuser needs to be X out of your life. Absolutely. 110% you do not owe your abuser or the relatives anything. In fact, the more you try to explain, the crazier you’re going to look. So, get with a good therapist. Get into trauma therapy, work the workbooks Self-Esteem Workbook by Glenn Schiraldi, The Disease to Please by Harriet Braiker, The Inner Child Workbook, Lucia Cappacchione or Catherine Taylor.  Work on those and stop trying to explain things to your relatives you’re looking for support from a dry well. Oftentimes family members do not want to take a look at it. Because then they have to look at their behavior. And they have to look at the family system. And they don’t want to admit that the family is cuckoo for Cocoa Puffs. And that was a large part of what was going on with my family is that when I was you know, telling my mom what my dad was doing, you know, he was molesting me. She was like making excuses and you know, all of this stuff, and I’m just like, What the frick is going on here? Well, her family was screwed up. Her mom was a narcissist. She had been molested. So, I mean, it explains it, does not excuse it. And it’s probably because the family members have got something in their particular situation that they don’t want to deal with. So, go stop going to a well, that’s dry. That’s why I got into therapy in the first place. So, I had somebody that I could talk to Ruth Hornaday and Chico was awesome. She’s probably not even around anymore. But, you know, it was like somebody who believed me and somebody who would listen and validate, you know, the relatives, they’ve got an agenda. They’ve got an agenda, anybody defending an abuser? You know, if somebody comes up and says, Hey, my abuser is doing XY and Z, and they go, Oh, they’re just bored. Oh, they’re just lonely. Oh, it’s okay. Ah, they’re as bad as the abuser Oh, get away, get away, get away, get away, get away, stop going to a well, that’s dry. It’s not only dry but also poisoned and salted. Stop going to a well; that’s not going to give you the water you need. The water you need is unconditional support. Unconditional Love. Probably a trauma therapist, or a support group would probably be the way to go. So, there is that.

Is a narcissistic, the wait is a narcissist smear campaign and a boarder smear campaign the same or different? Because both do it depending on how severe the BPD Yeah, no, they’re very similar. So, remember, you’ve got to remember borderline personality disorder is called borderline because it borders on psychotic thinking.

Kris Godinez  53:54

And it has traits of all the major personality disorders and borders on all the personality disorders. And one of those personality disorders is narcissism. So yeah, the smear campaign from them is very similar. It’s very revenge motivated. the more severe the BPD, the more revenge tit for tat tallionic. The thinking is, so it is very, very, very similar. So yeah, absolutely. And basically, you deal with it the same way you do not engage. You give them nothing. You take good care of yourself; you just rise above, and you cut out anybody who’s a mutual friend because they’re going to just be a flying monkey. So anyway, there is that.

All right, my love’s so that is it for today. I hope that was helpful. Next week, we are going to be talking about Dependent Personality Disorder. What is dependent personality disorder that happens to a lot of people with codependency, so we’re going to talk about that, and you know how to start working on that and all that sort of good stuff. So, you guys go have a great week, take good care of yourselves Drink plenty of water. It’s going to get really hot here in Phoenix. So, I will talk to you next week. Have a great week, guys talk to you later.

Thank you so much for listening to this podcast. You can always listen live on YouTube every week Sunday at noon, Arizona Mountain Standard Time. And if you want to find out more or listen to other episodes, you can go to Krisgodinez.com and if you have a chance, subscribe to this show on whatever podcast app you use and let other people know about. I want to thank my sponsor betterhelp.com. They are an online therapy company. Whether you are in the US or international. They will set you up with a qualified licensed therapist. PhD level or Master’s level. If you are interested in more information, go to betterhelp.com/krisgodinez.

You’ve been listening to the podcast version of We Need To Talk with Kris Godinez.

The post 06-18-2023 Why Smear? appeared first on Kris Godinez.

Have you ever had someone either pooh, poo, or dismiss or actively destroy your dreams?

Have you ever wondered what would possess someone to do such a heinous thing? What drives an abuser to stop their target of abuse from reaching their potential or from doing what they love?

Well, wonder no more! Kris will break down what the payoff is for abusers who crush dreams!

—

Hello and welcome to the We Need To Talk with Kris Godinez podcast. I’m your host Kris Godinez, licensed professional counselor. I help people get out of, and stay out of, toxic relationships. This podcast is for informational and educational purposes only the views and opinions stated herein are mine and mine alone. They do not represent the ACA, the APA or any other therapist for that matter.

I want to thank my sponsor betterhelp.com. They are an online therapy company. Whether you are in the US or international. They will set you up with a qualified licensed therapist. PhD level or Master’s level. If you are interested in more information, go to betterhelp.com/krisgodinez.

Okay, hi, everybody. So, I am back from my travels. If you want to see what Alaska was like the Alaska cruise that we took, you can go to: We Need To Have Fun with Kris Godinez, which is my other YouTube channel. And I posted up, you know, each little port that we went into and what that looked like. And that was a lot of fun. I highly recommend it. It was a trip of a lifetime. It really was. So, we got to see whales. We got to see seals. We got to see bald eagles, we got to tour all these cool little towns that very much reminded me of, like Jerome and Bisbee. And because they’re all the same time period, it’s all like, you know, 1800s gold rush, you know, that kind of thing. So, it was the history was phenomenal. The Park Service talks were great. I really enjoyed it. So anyway, let’s go on to the current events.

So, this current event that I noticed was on the AP, so in Boston and Massachusetts, apparently, child welfare workers and police knocked on Sarah Perkins and Joshua Sadie’s door. well past midnight one-weekend last summer, the parents were shocked to learn that the state of Massachusetts had come to take their two young sons. It was a harrowing scene that plays out daily across the country. What followed was emotional anguish, bureaucratic battle, and vindication for the parents. So apparently, the child had been taken in for a high fever. They did an x-ray they found an old, cracked ribs so they found a fractured rib that the couple had noticed after speaking with the boy’s grandmother; they learned the injury may have happened two weeks earlier as she moved removed this child from the car seat, she slipped in caught him with one arm I don’t know if I believe that or not. But that’s the story. Citing the fracture, the hospital officials reported the potential abuse to the Massachusetts Department of Children and Families, which as social workers, licensed professional counselors, psychiatrists, doctors, teachers, are all state-mandated reporters. This is chilling because what happens next.

A Few days later, they returned to the house with no paperwork at one o’clock in the morning after they’d already done a visit and said there was no abuse going on. They’d already come to the house had unannounced earlier in the week, looks through the house didn’t see any signs of abuse. They came back a few days later, one o’clock in the morning, no paperwork and took the child. And then they were in a battle. Well, now the couple is suing the state. And they’re suing the social workers. Now here’s where I have a problem with that. Does….what is the word I’m looking for? Does sometimes DCS take children away wrongfully? Yes, absolutely. 110% Does that put social workers doctors, nurses, teachers state mandated reporters in a really bad position? You bet your sweet bippy because in order to keep our license, we have to report if we don’t report a suspicion, like even just and this is, at least in Arizona the way it is here. It’s like if you even suspect that there’s something going on you file an FYI report. It’s just hey, FYI, this is what I think is happening. This is the address; these are the contacts this is I don’t know for sure. But I would like an investigation to happen just to make sure that the child is safe.

So, then they go out and they determine whether the child needs to be removed from the home or not. Not the social worker, not the counselor, not… you know, so that’s what Arizona does. So, and there has to be paperwork, there has to be paperwork. So, it apparently in Massachusetts there doesn’t. But this is a chilling case because they’re basically allowing the social workers, the doctors etc. to be sued in this lawsuit now, do they need to be well, no, because they did the right thing by reporting. I would rather err on the side of caution and make sure that child is safe. because, again, baby’s bones are really hard to break. So, because they’re, they’re green, they’re you know, and they’ll bend and that would take a great deal of force to crack a rib. So that’s why I’m kind of like in not so sure about this. So, um, anyway, it’s, it’s concerning to me because Do I like DCS? Hell no. Do I think that they keep changing their name because lipstick on a pig? You bet. Are they incompetent? A lot of times? You bet. Do I think they’re unnecessary evil? Yeah, unfortunately, there is. John, can we kind of chill out the dog toy? There? Maybe. Okay, take a deep breath. And center. Okay. So um, is it chilling? Yes. Because if they start putting, what’s the word I’m looking for? If they start telling us that we can be sued for reporting, who’s watching out for those kids that are being abused? Who’s going to be able to protect those kids? Who do need to be removed from the home situation? So, I’m keeping an eye on this case. It is very disturbing to me. Do I like DCS? No, do I think they’re a necessary evil? Yes, doesn’t need reform. You bet your sweet bippy. And though they shouldn’t be punishing the social workers, they should be going after the system. The court system Hello, court system has a common denominator. What’s the biggest f-up in this entire scenario? It’s the court system. Hello.

So, they should be going up to the court system that didn’t have the paperwork that didn’t, you know, the left hand didn’t know what the right hand was doing. left hand, right hand, you know what I’m saying? The other left anyway, you know what I mean? It’s like they didn’t know what they were doing left-hand right hand didn’t know what they were doing. Did not know what they were doing. And the child got taken away. necessary, unnecessary? I don’t know. I haven’t seen all the paperwork. But you know, I mean, there would have been enough there for me to say, Yeah, let’s have an investigation. Let’s make sure it’s clear. But they went, and they clear them. That’s I think we’re the what’s the word I’m looking for the sticky point comes in, is because they cleared them. And then four days later came back at one o’clock in the morning, busting down the door and taking the kid. So yeah, I mean, I understand that part. I don’t understand the suing the social worker part because they were just doing what we are state mandated to do and not only state-mandated guys, but we also have a code of ethics that we have to adhere to. Have to you know, and so it just court system needs to be reformed family court system, anything having to do with DCS, you betcha it needs to be reformed. So, if you are in Massachusetts, I strongly urge you to contact groups and start demanding reform because that needs to change. There needs to be paperwork. So, in Arizona, at least, there has to be a paper, there has to be a paper trail. And there has to be, here’s all the information. And here’s this and here’s that you don’t just bust down a door and take a kid without having, you know, paperwork saying this is why we’re doing it.

So, which is so weird, because you would think Arizona would be the Wild West, not Massachusetts, but other way around. Anyway, that is my current event, I’m going to be keeping an eye on that. I am concerned about that, because there’s enough state mandated, mandated reporters that don’t report now, because they don’t want to deal with the paperwork because they’re afraid of being sued. If this if they allow these social workers to get sued, I can guarantee you, the less ethical of us, in my profession, which please remove yourself from my profession, if you’re less ethical, ethical, that will stop reporting. So, in great example, I had a teacher in high school I told her point blank, I was being abused by my dad, she did nothing, you know, why? Didn’t want to fill out the paperwork? If I could throw a middle finger right now at that biatch I would. So yeah, didn’t want to fill out the paperwork was afraid of being sued. And there’s enough state-mandated reporters now that have decided that they don’t want to report because it’s too much work. That’s your frickin job. Don’t get me started. That’s part of my job. So, and I talk about that, and so you want to be a therapist. So yeah, it’s part of the job, you have to stay on the phone with the agencies, you know, the police, the DCS, the judges, the whatever, and make sure that those kids are safe, that’s your damn job. So, and if you’re not willing to do it, get out of my profession. So anyway, so I’m going to be keeping an eye on that particular current event. I’m in no matter what state you’re in. I think it needs to be advocated that the court system definitely needs to be changed. I don’t know how to get going. I would suggest start talking to representatives and get together with a group you know and start demanding change because this has got to change. DCS has got to change. All of the DCS is throughout the country there.

Kris Godinez  09:59

There’s the same problem. Almost no matter what state you’re in, so yeah, anyway, I just think it’s chilling. It’s chilling that they’re kind of saying, Oh, well, we can sue the social workers we can sue. Well, we’re state mandated. What do you expect us to do? Ignore it? Oh, you want us to ignore abuse? Oh, you want us to be okay with that kid dying two years later? Screw you. Yeah, just don’t get me started… too late. Okay, anyway, that happens to be that current event, and it caught my eye because I was like, what in tarnation? Are you thinking so? Anyway, there’s that okay.

So on to why do they crush our dreams? Okay. So disordered, anybody, parents, job people, bosses, friends, family, lovers, etc. If they are dark triad, if they are narcissistic, if they are abusive, they will go out of their way to crush your dreams. Anyone’s dreams doesn’t matter if they can piss on a campfire. They’re going to, so why? That was the question I got is like, Why? Why? Why do they like to crush people’s dreams? What do they get out of it? Oh, a lot. Oh, a lot. So, remember, when you’re dealing with an abusive person, okay? They are narcissistic, psychopath, Machiavellian. So, the rules don’t apply to them. That’s the psychopath part. And crazy control freaks. So, they are invested in hobbling the people around them. Remember, the abuser has to be… the narcissist has to be the smartest, the brightest, the best, the most beautiful, the most talented, the most everything. Nobody can be better than them. Nobody can succeed where they failed. Nobody. So, they will sabotage anyone who looks like that they are going to succeed where they failed. Or they are going to sabotage someone because, oh my gosh, they’re going to get whatever, you know, great job that they wanted. And they’re going to leave, and then I’ll have to find a new supply. That’s what they’re thinking. So, it’s all about me, me, me I, I, I. More. My genitals.

Seriously, that’s all they care about. They don’t care about the kid’s wants, needs, desires, passions. And in fact, if the child is particularly talented and particularly passionate about something, they will go out of their way because they are sadists, they are sadistic, they will go out of their way to sabotage to make sure that that kid loses interest doesn’t like it can’t do it, etc., etc., etc. Because they’re threatened. And they’re threatened, oh, a lot of different levels. So, there’s the control thing, if that person gets joy from doing this thing and recognition from doing this thing, remember the Narcissist views, everything is a pie. So, if they’re getting something… that’s less for them because they’re idiots, so they can’t stand it that the kid is getting recognition, joy, whatever. Because remember, the narcissist does not feel emotions the way we feel emotions. A healthy, normal parent. When they see that their kid is particularly good at something. They encourage it. They support them. They say yes, let’s go do this particular thing that you’re really interested in. I support you 100%. And you do it as long as you like it. Yes, you bet. What a narcissistic parent does is if it’s not something that they are personally interested in, they get angry because they expect everyone to be mini mes. They expect literally everyone around them to think the way that they do that is how disordered there. So, they can’t understand it because they’re not interested in it. So why in the world would anybody else be interested? I mean, seriously, Oh, God.Yeah, I just don’t get me started. So, it’s like the kid who has got a natural knack for baseball, and what is the parent do puts them into basketball? Why the hell would you do that? And the kid hates basketball. So, you know.

Kris Godinez  14:24

And they’re doing it on purpose. They’re doing it on purpose, because it’s not something they’re interested in. That’s one reason they do it. Or they see that the kid has got a talent, you know, is passionate about it loves it, and they’re jealous, and they’re angry, and they’re in competition. So, if this kid is doing well, excuse me. They don’t want them to do well. They don’t. The only time narcissists let their kids shine is if they can steal their thunder. If they can go, oh, yeah, look at how great they’re doing. It’s because of me. I cannot tell you the number of times. I have seen narcissistic parents do that the kid does some amazing thing. And the narcissist will literally stand up at the award ceremony and take credit for it. Wow. Oh, it’s just….It’s a good thing I’m not God because there’ll be a lot of dead people. narcissists, mostly, so no, they do like seriously. And one case where the narcissist stood up, ran across the stage, grabbed the awards certificate, and said I work too hard for this for you to mess this up and grounded away before the kid even got off the stage, and she yelled it so that everyone could hear it. What the actual F? Seriously!

So yeah, they do things like that. If they cannot take credit for it, they don’t want you succeeding in it. They don’t want you to do it. And if you do something amazing, they will be sure to tell everybody and their dog how it was all of them. Oh, they sacrificed. Oh, they put in the long hours. Oh, they did this. They did the…They, they, in reality, they did Jack diddly squat. So yeah. So, it’s got to all be about them. They are pathologically jealous, otherwise known as morbidly jealous morbid, meaning death to death. They’re just to death. That’s it’s not healthy. So, I pulled up some articles. And I’m hoping I can actually read them. Where are my glasses? Okay, we’ll give it a shot.

So, this one is on psychology today. And it says 13 ways narcissistic parents sabotage their children. This is by Julie Hall. This is on psychology today. Narcissistic parents compulsively undercut their children. Both intentionally and collaterally I think it is mostly intentional Oh, God, these glasses need to be clean, good lord. Adultifying or infantilizing the child, so remember one of the reasons that they crush your dreams. It is all about them, who’s going to take care of them. That’s what they’re thinking.

So, they either adultify a child like I’ve had cases where the kid was having to make sure that the parent was on their side so that they wouldn’t aspirate their vomit when they came home drunk. Which… abusive Yeah, that regard reported. You bet. I’m sorry, I’m just that still just ticks me off No, and about the whole Massachusetts thing anyway. Um, you know, makes them the adult makes them responsible for the adult’s wellbeing physically, mentally, emotionally, and otherwise uses them as their own counselor, tells them all their stuff, and expects the kid to find solutions adultifying them or infantilizing them where they tell them oh no, you can’t do that. Oh, no, you’re not. You’re not able to do that. You’re not smart enough to do that. I’ll tell you what, soon as I hear a frickin narcissist tell their kids’ kid is not smart enough to do that. That’s what I know. The kid is way smarter than the narcissist, and that the narcissist is threatened because they know that kid is eventually going to leave. And that’s what this is all about. They do not want their favorite punching bag to leave.

Okay, okay, reward compliance and punish descent. So, a lot of times, I’ll talk to kids that they’re the good kid. You know, they do their work they they are passionate about, they want it they want to leave, they wanted to have a future this, that, and the other thing, and yet the abuser will be rewarding the child that is most like them, usually the golden child, and finding excuses to punish the kid who’s actually healthy. And people wonder why I’m so passionate about this because this is how to how to screw up a kid in two easy steps. Both kids both kids so that the golden child gets screwed up because they never learn responsibility. And the good kid, the other kid, gets screwed up because they’re being told and punished that they’re wrong for being normal. They devalue their interests and strengths unless the children’s interests and strengths reflect the narcissist value or give them bragging rights like I just talked about. Narcissistic parents ignore or actively malign the kids’ passions. They pathologize normal emotional responses. I cannot tell you the number of times I have had clients sitting on my couch apologizing for being sad or apologizing for being angry or apologizing for having any emotion. So, the child has normal want or need, and the parent.

So, for example, the child will want to be fed. Wow, normal, okay, but a narcissistic parent will tell them how selfish they are, and you go make it yourself even though the kid is four or five years old. They will be angry when the child goes to them for comfort. They’ll be angry if the child is crying, they’ll be angry. If the child is angry, there’ll be angry if the child is happy because that’s pretty much the only emotion they allow is anger. Um, they they punish the child for having normal wants and needs. Food, shelter, clothing, compassion, companionship, those are all normal, but a narcissist will tell them that it’s pathological. And then that poor kid grows up not knowing up from down, so they normalized rage in shame. Profoundly traumatizing for children of narcissistic parents is living in an atmosphere of normalized rage and shame, which elicits long-term nervous system hyper activation, interferes with healthy development and sets the stage for both acute and chronic health problems, and adds to general trauma patterns.

That’s the reason why almost all of us coming out of an abusive relationship has got some sort of medical issue going on, usually, you know, like, sort of looking for autoimmune diseases and things like that, you bet. And we’ve been on for so long, it’s like our system doesn’t know how to relax. And when we do Relax, it’s kind of like we feel guilty for relaxing that was another issue that I’ve dealt with adult children of narcissists is that they go to take a vacation, and they’re just like, they’re okay for a little bit, but then they’re like, I should be cleaning, I should be doing this I should be, I should be, I should be, I should be… I need to or I’m going to get punished. That’s the thought they have. So, and it’s because narcissists cannot stand it when somebody has downtime. They cannot stand it when somebody is just relaxing, because it’s a normal state to be in. They can relax, it’s okay for them to relax, but God forbid their kids should. So, they’ll come up with stupid things like my dad used to do this whole thing about well, you need to go outside and pick up twigs. Ah, why? We don’t have a fireplace? Why do I need to go outside and pick up… he couldn’t stand and if I was reading and especially if I was reading something he didn’t like so, um, okay, play favorites and scapegoats we talked about that alienate the relationships.

So, the parents engage in ongoing comparison, triangulation smear campaigns to alienate their children’s relationships with the other parent, other siblings, extended family, and social circle. With adult children with adult children, narcissistic parents may then attempt to alienate their kids from their own children and spouse. Oh, my God, I have had narcissistic grandparents tried to sue for full custody. We beat them in court, thank god. Um, I’ve had narcissistic parents isolate their children so that they didn’t have a social group so that they didn’t know how to socialize. They are in competition with them. This is why they sabotage. This is why they crushed dreams. Because if they can’t have it, nobody else can. So, if the child comes home with a boyfriend or a girlfriend, that parent that narcissist will hit on that boyfriend or the girlfriend. It’s a competition. It is always a competition. It’s always a I have to be best. I have to be the most desirable. I have to be this I have to be, you know, and it’s always crazy. It’s always crazy. They adultify them. We talked about that. They infantilize them to keep them helpless so that they never leave. They bail them out of consequences. We talked about that with the golden child, or they usually abandon, usually, the child that’s healthy in their time of need. Well, you fight your own battles I’m not going to help you. You need to fight your own battles, as opposed to oh, hell no, you’re not going to push my kid around.  You know what I’m saying, which is what they should do, but they don’t. They don’t teach them life skills because we’re trying to make them dependent because they don’t want them to grow. They don’t want them to have confidence or independence, and allowing a child to explore their passions is the best way for that child to learn who they are, and what they like and what they don’t like, and what they want to do, and what they don’t want to do. That’s what being a kid is all about! It’s like, what is this all about? What is this thing called life all about? And you go and you explore, and a healthy parent will allow that! An unhealthy parent, you know, you’re going to grow up, and you’re going to do this, and you’re going to do that, and you, you, you, you, and it’s like they want them to be mini-mes, or they want them to fail, or they want them to stay with them for the rest of their lives. Crazy. They also manipulate financially. So, if the child does reach their potential and does start making money on their dreams, oh, I’ve seen these parents, and I use the term loosely, come back to the kid and blackmail the child. And what’s the word? I’m looking for? Emotional blackmail, it really is. And say, Well, you wouldn’t have gotten where you are if it weren’t for me. So, therefore, you owe me.

Kris Godinez  25:36

I cannot tell you the number of times I have seen that. And I always tell the client do give them nothing. Give them nothing, go no contact. You don’t owe them Jack diddly squat. You did this on your own. So, let’s talk about where you came from and where you are now and what you owe these Jack wagons. Zero, you owe them zero. They may have been an egg donor. They may have been a sperm donor, but they are in no way shape or form are actual parents. Oh, so there is that! They will do that though. They’ll come knocking at the door and want money once the child has done something they’re passionate about. And they’re good on make money at it. And oh, yeah. Oh, you betcha. So. 

And remember, they’re crushing your dreams, not because of you. But because of them. Because it’s an agenda for them. What is their agenda? What do they get out of it? What do they get out of crushing your dreams? So, their status? They enjoy watching you suffer number one. Number two, what’s their endgame? What’s their endgame? So, if they’re adultifying you it’s because you’re taking care of them. They don’t want you to go away. If they’re infantilizing you, it’s because you’re dependent on them. And then they don’t want you to go away. Those two are very similar. You know, if they’re sabotaging because they’re jealous, it’s the pathological morbid jealousy, and they don’t want you to be better than them. Or they’ll start competing with the kid. Oh my God, that’s the other thing I’ve seen is that the kid will say, I’m really interested in, say, Let’s like, let’s say playing the violin. So, the kid will go learn how to play the violin and be really good at it. And all of a sudden, the parent is like, oh, well, I’m gonna take lessons and be in competition with the kid. And I’ve seen that I’ve seen not necessarily with the violin, but I’ve seen them take over a passion that the child had and then compete with them. So, I’m better than you. They literally have said that. I’m just like, nobody cares, dude. It’s all about the kid. Now. Your time has come and gone. Goodbye. You know, I mean, or dudettes that. Dudettes do that, too. So, you know, it’s this weird competition thing. So, there is that? Okay, um, all right.

How are we doing on time? Oh, very close. I will get to the questions very soon. How emotionally immature parents sabotage their children. Core obliteration. So, they lie to them. They gaslight them. They tell them oh, no, you’re not good at that. Oh, no, you can’t do that. Oh, no, you’re not smart enough. Oh, no, you’re not pretty enough. Oh, no, you’re not tall enough Oh, no, you’re not handsome enough. They lie to the child about who the child really is. They will tell the child they’re ugly. They’ll tell the child they’re stupid. They’ll tell the child that they’re not bright. My dad did that one. He was totally you’re the cute one, not the smart one. And I’m just like… You must have been so threatened by me. So um, anyway, there is that, so they obliterate their core sense of self.

So, in order to start working on all of this sabotage that they have done, you want to get the self-esteem workbook by Glenn Schiraldi work that multiple times. It takes about three months to go through the first time. When you’re done, go back through, do it again. When you’re done, go back through, do it again, you’re going to get different answers every single time as you get stronger and stronger in your core strength and remembering who you really are, as opposed to what these jackwagons told you, you were. So yeah, they try to obliterate our core being our core sense of self. They try to get us to rely on external esteem as opposed to internal esteem, self-esteem. Because that’s what they’re doing. They rely on outside stuff. So, they don’t want us to be strong and ourselves. They disturb our process. Being a child and these developmental stages, children learn how to set boundaries, build a memory and language and even know how to form relationships. The behavior of emotionally immature parents interrupts these fundamental movements of development, both mentally and emotionally. They put up walls where their children need bridges, and they wind up with adult children who have major delays and flaws in the way they think, communicate, and bond with others. Oh, hell yeah. They take away hope it’s not surprising to know that they enjoy watching that child be depressed, anxious, or have emotional regulation problems because they enjoy watching the child suffer. They say that they’re doing it for your own good, but I’m just telling you this so that you’re not disappointed. I’m sorry. You know what? Life is a series of disappointments. That’s how we learn. It’s a series of failures. That’s how we learn. Do you ever watch a baby walk? They get up, they toddle a little bit, they fall on the floor, and then they get back up, and they toddle a little bit fall on the floor. If a narcissist had anything to do with that process, they would interfere with it. Oh, I just, oh, I’m doing this for your own good. I’m not going to let you walk. Ah, that’s how the kids learn balance, you stupid…. Do you see what I’m going with that?

Kris Godinez  30:47

So, they interfere with our process of learning to deal with disappointment or learning to deal with failure. Failure is not a bad thing! To a narcissist it is Holy mackerel! To a narcissist it is because it’s all about the win. They have to win. Everything has to be a win. Failure is not tolerated, blah, blah, blah. Well, that’s utter and total moo, because we learn from our failures. When something doesn’t go right, you analyze it; if you’re healthy, and you go, well, crap, that didn’t work. What could I have done differently? Oh, that’s what I’ll do next time. And you don’t make it mean anything about you. You don’t beat yourself up, you don’t put yourself down. Narcissists love to do that. If we make a mistake, man, they’ve got our nose in it like nonstop for years. So that’s again, that’s part of their sabotage, that’s part of their crushing our dreams. And they make us feel like we’re bad and wrong. If something doesn’t work out, if something doesn’t work out, you just kind of go, okay, well, let me try something different. And you try something different, you know, they create outcasts. We always feel like we’re an outcast. That is something that I talked about with one of my clients this last week, like we’re outside kind of peering in, like peers, social groups, and we’re kind of like going home, I’d love to be over there. I’m not quite sure how to do it. So, we feel like outcasts because they’ve interrupted our normal socialization, they isolate, they make sure their kids don’t have friends, they find fault with all of their friends, that kind of thing. So that’s another way to crush someone’s dreams is to interfere with their normal dating process, or their normal making friends process, because, you know, it’s a normal part of life. They have a warped reality. Okay, so there is that. Let me get to the questions here in just a minute, I promise.

When people don’t support your dreams, okay. So, this is when you say, Hey, I’ve been thinking of writing a book, and they go, Oh, well, you know, getting published is really hard. Listen to me now, believe me later. You do not want to share your dreams with an abuser, ever, ever, ever, not on this or any other planet. Because they will naysay, they will piss on your campfire. They enjoy it. So, you’ve got… this is part of the whole learning to not share with the abuser do not share with the abuser. If you take nothing else away from this whole talk. Do not share with the abuser. Do not share your most fervent dreams or passions or desires or wants or anything else. Because number one, they’re not going to get it, and number two, they’re going to be jealous. And number three, they’re going to try to figure out how to sabotage it. So do not share with them. The second somebody is a naysayer, you just kind of go Oh, thank you for your input, and then walk away and do not share anymore, and they will come at you and be like, Well, how’s that booklet? Well, how’s this going? How’s everything? Oh, how about them, Dodgers? That’s what you do you talk about the Dodgers or whatever sports team happens to be in your state Dodgers are not in Arizona, but they’re my team. So anyway, there it is. I’m going to tell that to the Diamondbacks.

So how to recognize a naysayer? This is usually how it unfolds. You dream up a plan that excites you to the core of your being and maybe an adventure, a new career path, an artistic pursuit or a crazy invention? to rival Velcro. Hopefully, it involves a plan to inspire, inspire you to, you know, go out and do. Your you’re going to want to share with family and friends, and the healthy ones will say go for it. The unhealthy ones will give you helpful advice along the lines of I know someone else who tried that, and it didn’t work out for them. I’m sorry and what? Your confidence will be attacked. Are you sure you’re qualified? Naysayers love to highlight the practicalities of your dream. Well, you can’t make any money doing that. My dad did that. But my dad absolutely did that when he demanded that I go to cosmetology school to become a cosmetologist instead of letting me go through my degree to figure out what I did want to do in life. You know, I mean, it’s I did get my degree, but I had to. Yeah. So um, or they’ll call upon normal people. as the basis for their argument pointing out how you’re destined for failure because you’re not acting like one of them. Normal people usually get a real job.

Kris Godinez  35:09

Oh my god. You know what? These people can go pound sand sideways with an unlubricated baseball bat, as far as I am concerned. So as soon as somebody starts naysaying you, you want to walk away, consider the source, and do not take it to heart. Now, I mean, obviously, I wanted to go into acting, okay, that’s getting my degree in theatre arts. So, I knew going in that acting was probably not going to be my end degree. So, my dad, of course, swooped in and was like, No, you need to be a cosmetologist, you’re not going to make a living, bla bla bla bla bla. Well, I did work in cosmetology for a few years, I hated it. I hated it.It wasn’t my thing. I’m not interested in fufu stuff I’m not interested in they’re not interested in makeup, obviously, you know, I’m not interested in the latest fashions or whatever. And so, I was like, No, I think my passion lies with psychology. But instead of being allowed to come to that conclusion, which I was sort of coming to that conclusion when I was in college anyway, but allowed to come to that conclusion, he interfered. So yeah, they do that, do not tell them, so when I went in to get my master’s degree, I told no one. I told my oldest sister, that was it. I told my oldest sister and that was it. I told nobody else I was getting my master’s degree because I didn’t want the naysay, and I didn’t want the interference. And I didn’t want you can’t do this. You’re the cute one, not the smart one, blah, blah, blah. So anyway, you got to learn not to tell them.

Okay, the psychology of an asshat. Most often naysayers have unfulfilled dreams of their own. They don’t live in inspired existence because they’re too busy living in fear or judgment. Maybe they made the mistake of listening to their own naysayers, or maybe they’re narcissists. Chances are, they are living in fear, fear of loss, fear of being alone, fear of change, fear of losing control, fear of being insignificant, fear of death, fear of injury, fear of being judged. Your wild ambitions threaten the naysayer. They want to keep you simple and predictable. And by pissing on your party hat, they’re hoping to keep you small and easy to manage. Your goal threatens to throw out the equilibrium of their universe. But the naysayer is out of luck, because the entire universe does not actually belong to them as much as they love to believe it does. So basically, you ignore them, you block them, you don’t tell them about you, your plans, or your dreams or whatever, and you severed ties with them. That’s ultimately what you’re going to have to do. And a lot of people resist that, because they’re like, but it’s my family. And I’m like, if you were not related to these people, would you have anything to do with them? And if the answer is no, act accordingly, so that is why they crush your dreams. They have an agenda. They absolutely do. And it’s like I said, it’s me, me, me, I, I, I. More. My genitals. Because they don’t want you to do better than them. Or they’re threatened by you, or they don’t want you to leave because you’re either taking care of them or you’re dependent on them, and it makes them feel important. So, the adultification/infantilization they’ve got an agenda and you want to take a look at what is this person’s endgame? Why are they pissing on my campfire? What is really going on here?

So, and with my dad’s end game is that he had been threatening to cut me off since I was 14. And so, his whole thing was, you know, I want you to get a job so I can cut you off so that your mother won’t come after me. Blah, blah, blah. So that was his end game, and I knew it. Money was his God. So that was his point. But he also was incredibly threatened by me and my older sister. And you know, you just got to kind of figure out what is their endgame. What do they get out of this? What’s the payoff? What’s going on here? And you’ve got to remember do not share your most intimate personal hopes, wants, needs, desires, dreams, passions with somebody who is going to piss on your campfire. If they piss on your campfire, they have shown you who they are. Walk the hell away, cut them the hell off. They are no bueno for you. So that is why they crush dreams. They’re sadistic, they enjoy it, or they’re getting something out of it otherwise, so hope that answers to the questions. Okay, let’s speaking of questions, let’s go to the questions. All right, let me make this little, bigger so I can maybe do this without the glasses. There we go.

How do I give my daughter advice when issues are coming up in her life without making her feel like everything is a negative reaction? I phrase positively but no teenager wants advice. Oh, you are not wrong on that one. Um, you know, it’s kind of like I don’t think any adult really likes advice either, especially if it’s unsolicited. So, what you could do is talk about your own experiences, you know, did something similar happen to you? How did you cope with it? What did you do? That’s kind of more helpful and more insightful than, well, let me tell you what you need to be doing. Because I mean, honestly, it’s not just teenagers that feel that way. Adults don’t like that, either. So, and I’m not saying you’re doing that, but I’m just saying one of the ways that I teach people to, you know, open the dialogue, because remember, it’s got to be a dialogue. It can’t just be a; I’m lecturing you because I’m older. And I know more. It’s got to be a dialogue. It’s like, wow, you know, when I was your age, this happened to me, and this is how I dealt with it. You know, do you have any questions? Get a dialogue going, get a back-and-forth going, you know? So, I would be very wary of giving advice as in, let me tell you, I would be more couching it in. From my experience. This is this is what happened to me. This is how I handled it. What do you know, what do you think about what the situation you’re in? open-ended questions, that’s what therapists do. And that’s what parents should do. So, a lot of us were raised by authoritarian instead of authoritative. And so authoritarian parents are like no open-ended questions, I will tell you how it is, this is the way it’s going to be bla bla bla bla. Now, I’m not saying that you’re not occasionally going to do that when it’s a serious, you know, oh, my God, they can be in danger or hurt themselves. But it’s like for, you know, getting a dialogue going, you know, I could never have a conversation with my dad, I could have a deeper conversation with my backdrop here that I would with my father because there was no there, there. So, you want to open a dialogue. You want to ask open-ended questions? Well, what do you think? You know, so this is going on in your life? What do you think, you know, let me tell you what I did when that I was in that situation, because a lot of us have gone through pretty much similar situations. So, open a dialog, you know, um, there are some great books on parenting teenagers, I would suggest getting them and looking them up and seeing the communication skills in there to help open up that dialogue and get that communication going. So, it’s so that they feel comfortable coming to you and going, Holy crap, this is going on. What do you think? See where I’m going with that? You want the trust; you want the trust? And actually, nobody likes getting unsolicited advice. So, what you want to do is you want to open up the open-ended questions, you know, tell me more what’s happening. How are you feeling? What, what do you want to do about this? Well, do you want to know what I think about this? You know, and they may say, No, you know, but at least give them that opportunity to be like, I Please mother, I’d rather do myself, right? Or, you know, yeah, Mom, I do or Dad, I do want to know how you handle the similar situation, you know, get that dialogue, and that mutual respect. That’s really, really important. Okay. There’s that one. Okay.

Do narcissists use their child’s dream? And try to make it their own? Oh, yes. Oh, my gosh, yes, they do. They.

Kris Godinez  43:15

And they do this because they have no sense of self. They don’t know who they are, let alone anybody else. So, when somebody has a dream, and it looks pretty good. They suddenly decide that that’s their dream. So, if you look at stage mothers, you know, Wil Wheaton. Wil Wheaton wrote a great book about how his mom wanted to be an actor but then took over his career, and he didn’t want to be acting. He wanted to do other things. But, you know, or there’s that other book. Oh, one of my clients is reading, and she really loves it. I’m glad I’m glad my mom’s Dead and this is by another actor in Hollywood. I can’t think of who it was. But that’s another good one. Because another stage where I took over that passion and turn it into a nightmare. You betcha they do that?  A narcissist mom I knew, this mom I knew pretended to her daughter’s dream of becoming a scientist was her own dream. And her daughter got it from her. Yeah. Because then she could sit there and say, Oh, well. That was my dream. And and she inherited it from me. So again, looping it back. It’s the weirdest. Oh my god, it’s the weirdest thing. Hang on. So, narcissists always have to loop back to them, conversations. Somebody’s success. You know, it’s kind of it kind of reminded me of like, when we were living in LA, it’s like a weather event would be happening across the country. And somehow, the broadcaster would always be like, what does that mean for Los Angeles? Like, nobody cares, which is a very narcissistic thing to do. So, they loop it back to them. So Even though it doesn’t have anything to do with them, they loop it back to them. So that’s what they’re doing. They have to feel important. They have to feel like it was their idea that they inspired it, that they’re inspiring. That’s their whole BS. Don’t get me started. Yes, that is a common thing to do. Or they’ll take it over and try to outdo the kid. I’ve seen that happen to so Yep, absolutely. Let me see. Oops, stop that computer. Um, yeah, they do that. Absolutely. Okay.

I always over I’m always overpacking, not just close with everything I could possibly need when out. I assume this is trauma related. Oh, my God. Yes. Oh, my God. Those of us who overpack, raise your hand. Yes, that me? Totally. You betcha. It’s only been in recent years that I’ve kind of stopped doing that. Yeah, because we’re afraid. So overpacking is like, oh my god, what if I don’t have it? What if? What if. What if. Living in a future has not happened? So yeah, I mean, it’s true. It is a trauma response because our abusers tend to live in lack and scarcity. At least mine did. Everything was, you know, lack and scarcity, plenty for them. lack and scarcity for the rest of us. So yeah, we have a tendency to overpack. Ask John.  It’s like we traveled somewhere in the past, I would not only have my GPS, but I would also have paper maps to back it up, just in case. You know, it’s, yeah, it’s a trauma response. You betcha. You betcha. But it can be overcome because it’s kind of like what I’ve gotten into the habit of doing is… Okay, is there a laundry that I can use? Yes. Okay, so now I only need to pack like three days’ worth of clothes. And out of that, three days’ worth of clothes. I only need one of each.

You know, so when I went to Alaska, the only thing I overpacked was the evening gown because they told us that there would be a formal night. And John and I both kind of looked at each other. And we did bring stuff for formal. We did dress up for his birthday. But you know, we looked at each other on the formal nine. We were both like, do you feel like dressing up? Now? Do you feel like dressing up now? Oh, thank God when we went to the buffet, so um, you know, it’s a matter of reassuring yourself. It’s like, where am I going? Yes, they have stores. If I don’t have it, I’ll buy it. It’s not going to kill me. You know what I’m saying? It’s like you don’t need to pack everything. So um, and I would talk to your therapist about that; that is definitely a trauma response. So, I would get CPTSD from surviving to thriving by Pete Walker. Self-esteem workbook by Glenn Schiraldi. All the anxiety get an anxiety workbook. What is this about? What are you afraid of? What’s the fear? What are you afraid of not having? And what really are you afraid of not having so we say it’s stuff but in reality, it’s something else safety, love, comfort? What is going on? What does this stuff mean? And that’s really important. Okay, let me get back to this.

I’m always prepared for chaos and disaster to strike at any time. Well, now there’s nothing wrong with that. I do tend to I had a for example, I had a sewing kit and my girlfriend’s wedding to fix all the dresses. That actually is a brilliant idea. So let me just say this, there is a difference between trauma packing and packing common sense. So, on the cruise, I wish I had brought a little sewing kit with me; I did not have one. So, my swimsuit strap decided to just snap, and I’m like, really? So, I went to the concierge, and I was like, please, please tell me you have a sewing kit. So, they did, and they brought it to me, and I fixed it. So yeah, when you’re doing something like, you know, a wedding or you know, something that you know, safety pins, safety pins are great. I take safety pins with me; usually, I didn’t on this trip. But usually, I take safety kids with me just in case something breaks or something happens. Um, but you don’t want to be packing up the kitchen sink and the entire house and bring it with you. But you do want to have like, you know, a first aid kit, a sewing kit. Those things are okay, that’s not being crazy. That’s kind of planning ahead and going okay. Yeah, I’ve had things go south. So, let’s take a little sewing kit. Let’s take a little, you know, first aid kit. That’s smart. That’s not That’s not a trauma that smart. But what I would do in the past is I would literally like, well, what if this happens and I need to have this? What if that happens that I need to have that but overpack, you know, just like trying to plan for every single possibility well, overplanning is a trauma response because we needed to be you know, well, if this happens, I’m going to do that. If that happens, I’m going to do that. So, we’re trying to stay safe so it’s a matter of staying safe. So, if you find yourself overpacking because you’re trying to stay safe, that’s when you talk to your therapist and get the anxiety workbook and all of that sort of good stuff. If you’re just doing things that are like Girl Scout kind of things like we need a sewing kit and we need first aid kit. Oh, I’m totally on board with that. I think that’s smart. So, yep, but it is a trauma response to overpack. You bet and over plan. You’ll be you’ll know that we overthink, we over plan. Good Lord, You betcha. It’s, I got to tell you the first time that John and I planned a trip, and I did not book a hotel. He was just like, what is wrong with you? And I’m like, I’m working on being spontaneous. And it’s true because we tend to plan things out. So, we stay safe. And now I’m much better about kind of rolling with it. I mean, this next trip that we’re going to take, I do have to plan things out because we’ve got the dogs with us. So, you know, that’s a little more comfortable with that. But you are mostly it’s like, if we’re just the two of us, and we’re taking a weekend. I’ll try not to over plan. So yeah, it is. It is a trauma response. You betcha.

Okay, what did you when you’ve gotten away from the narcissist, it’s still find yourself crushing your own dreams? Oh, self sabotage. Okay.

Kris Godinez  51:02

So, what we often do, and this is totally normal, is that we find ourselves acting like our abuser. I know it’s like, what? Yeah, so we crush our own dreams because they’ve instilled in us such fear of success that it’s not okay for us to be successful. So, when I wrote my first book, What’s Wrong with Your Dad? I wasn’t worried about it not being read. In fact, I would have been perfectly happy had nobody bought it because I know how to deal with failure. But I did not know how to deal with success. I didn’t because every time I was successful, it either got taken away from me. Or I was told that it was because of them. Or do you see where I’m going with that? So, I didn’t know how to deal with success. So, I was terrified when my books started selling and doing well. You know, when this started doing well, it was kind of like, what the how, how do I deal with success? Oh my god. So basically, it’s giving yourself permission, it’s okay for you to be successful. Mirror work like a boss. So self-sabotage has to do with we’ve incorporated because we’ve heard the brainwashing for so many years. We’ve incorporated that sabotage into our internal dialogue. That’s the inner critic. So, you want to start working on the inner critic. Thank you, inner critic, for trying to sabotage I hear you, I see you, and guess what? You have no power. You know why? Because I say so. Go pound sand by Do you see where I’m going with that? So, you’re going to work on the inner critic. You’re going to work on that part of you that wants to sabotage. You’re going to do the Inner Child Workbook by either Catherine Taylor or Lucia Cappacchione. You’re gonna work on when did you first notice them sabotaging you and when did you first notice you sabotaging you. So and mirror work? Hi. Good to see you. Have a great day. You know what? It is okay for you to be successful. It is okay for you to succeed. It is okay for you to do your passion. It is okay. It is okay. And then walk out. So that’s what I want you to work on. That’s going to help the most Self-Esteem Workbook Glenn Schiraldi. All great books. Do it. Do it, do it.

Um, let’s see what to do. When you find yourself convinced of your own reasons. Oh, when you find yourself convinced by your own reasons that your dreams cannot come true. Well, here’s the deal. You’ve got until that self-saboteur to shut up. And here’s the thing. So, you try them, and they don’t work. What’s the worst that can happen? They don’t work. Do something else, you know. So, it’s kind of like how to explain this is kind of like, again, that goes back to the abusers can’t stand anybody winning besides them.

Kris Godinez  53:57

They instilled this fear of failure in us, which is weird, because failure is how we learn. And so, if a dream doesn’t work out, it’s not the end of the world do something else. Investigate. This is what life is about. And this is especially with the growing up period is about that abusers interfere with. You try different things. That’s why kids in high school, try different things. In college, try different things. What do I like? What do I not like? What do I want to do for the rest of my life? What do I don’t want to do for the rest of my life? And it’s okay to experiment. It’s okay to try things out and see if you like them. So, if one thing doesn’t work out, you will, you know, it doesn’t work out because try it. You know, don’t go into it going, Oh, it’s going to fail. You want to go into going I’m going to see where this goes. And then, you know, it’s just like when I went to go learn how to surf. I’ve always wanted to learn how to surf. Always, always, always, always, always. What I’m doing in a desert is beyond me. But anyway, when I was in Maui a few years ago, I took a surfing lesson. And it was fantastic. I surfed. It was awesome. I loved it. I just love, love, love, love, love, love. If I could live in Hawaii, I would…. can’t afford it. Anyway. The point being is love surfing, tried it, loved it. What am I going to do next? I don’t know, maybe paddleboarding? I mean, I’ve done paddleboarding on like lakes and lagoons, but not the ocean with like, you know, waves. So you know that, maybe that’s next. So, you just try things, but you allow yourself the what’s the… luxury of failing? It’s like, okay, so it didn’t work. Now what now? What can I do? What else do I want to do? What else do I want to try? You know, what else? Am I passionate about it at least you will have done it. Does that make sense? Abusers try to stop us from even having the experience because they can’t understand unbridled joy. They can’t understand unbridled excitement. They can’t understand even unbridled fear; really, they don’t get it, especially if they’re a psychopath. You know, they don’t want us to have those normal emotions. So, allow yourself the normal emotion of trying something, and maybe it doesn’t work out, and it’s okay. It’s okay. The world is a big, beautiful place. There’s tons of things to do. And there’s tons of things to be passionate about. If one doesn’t work out, try something else. It’s okay. It’s okay. So that I think is the big thing is giving yourself permission. How are we doing on time? Okay. Mm hmm.

Kris Godinez  56:25

Okay, I think this one is going to be our last one. I used to be told, I am deformed and looked abnormal. I knew it wasn’t true. But why? Because they were sabotaging you. It’s just like abusers that tell their kids you know, you’re stupid, or you can’t do this, or you know, you’re the cute one, not the smart one, etc., etc., etc. Because they’re trying to hobble your core being, so Self-Esteem Workbook Glenn Schiraldi, I kid you not, get it work it. Because when a parent has tried to get to that core being and destroy who we are, and you know, oh, you’re deformed, you’re ugly. Or this, you’re abnormal. Baba, Baba. They’re giving us their issues. And they’re giving us lies. And they’re trying to hobble us so that we don’t go off and explore and find who we are. That’s how you… doing things you’re afraid of, like, you know, I was free to surfing. I got to tell you, because, you know, like, about this whole falling off the board thing? Where rash guard, you’re fine. You know, but it was nerve-wracking. But it was exhilarating. It was wonderful. And it gives you that little boost of confidence. It’s like, wow, I can do this. This is awesome. Or even Wow, I can’t do this. What else can I do? You know, I mean, it’s like, either way, be okay with it. But especially when they go after, like, you know, self-esteem things, looking in the mirror. That’s a self-esteem thing. They’re trying to keep you from talking to yourself in the mirror. They’re trying to keep you from knowing who you really are, and your own worth and your own beauty and your own normalcy. Okay, because they’re abnormal. So, they’re telling you that you’re abnormal, but they’re abnormal, normal parents don’t tell their kid that they’re abnormal. Does that make sense? So, work on the self-esteem workbook by Glenn Schiraldi get with a good trauma therapist EMDR would be really good with that one. I think CBT also would be really good with that when those two modalities and in conjunction I think would be good to help work on that. Do the Glenn Schiraldi book because he works specifically on building the core back up. So, when a narcissist has tried to rip that core away, you build it back up. Absolutely. Okay. Let me make sure there’s nothing else. That is, it. Okay, hold on half a tick. I want to go see what the heck I’m talking about next week, because I forgot to look it up. Because that is just what I do.

Kris Godinez  58:51

Okay. Next week is our relationship with food. So, we’re going to talk again, why so many of us have eating disorders after we come out of these abusive relationships. So why so many of us struggle with our weights, etc., etc., etc. So, we’re going to talk about our relationship with food and how to make that a little bit healthier. So there that is all right, my loves you guys go have a great week on Wednesday. I’m going to answer whatever questions I didn’t get to. And I will talk to you later. Bye.

Thank you so much for listening to this podcast. You can always listen live on YouTube every week Sunday at noon, Arizona Mountain Standard Time. And if you want to find out more or listen to other episodes, you can go to Krisgodinez.com and if you have a chance, subscribe to this show on whatever podcast app you use and let other people know about. I want to thank my sponsor betterhelp.com. They are an online therapy company. Whether you are in the US or international. They will set you up with a qualified licensed therapist. PhD level or Master’s level. If you are interested in more information, go to betterhelp.com/krisgodinez.

You’ve been listening to the podcast version of We Need To Talk with Kris Godinez.

The post 06-04-2023 Why They Crush Dreams appeared first on Kris Godinez.

When we have been unjustly accused of doing things we didn’t do, the desire to clear the air is strong. Now, if you were dealing with healthy people, clearing the air would be the right thing to do. You aren’t dealing with healthy people. Narcissists, Dark Triads, and the like LOVE to accuse the target of abuse of all sorts of things that THEY are themselves doing and then argue with or ignore the target of abuse when they try to defend themselves. It is a game where the rules are constantly changing and one in which you will never win!

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Hello and welcome to We Need To Talk with Kris Godinez podcast. I’m your host Kris Godinez, licensed professional counselor. I help people get out of, and stay out of, toxic relationships. This podcast is for informational and educational purposes only the views and opinions stated herein are mine and mine alone. They do not represent the ACA, the APA or any other therapist for that matter.

I want to thank my sponsor betterhelp.com. They are an online therapy company. Whether you are in the US or international. They will set you up with a qualified licensed therapist. PhD level or Master’s level. If you are interested in more information, go to betterhelp.com/krisgodinez.

Wow. Hi, everybody. Oh, my goodness. Hello from Spain. Oh, my goodness. Good to see you guys. So today, here’s the current event today is Mother’s Day. So, for those of you who had good moms, great, have a great day, that are good moms have a great day. If you have mothers that were abusive, neglectful, harmful, hurtful, etc. And you are no contact with them stay, no contact, do not let a Hallmark holiday make you get back in touch with somebody who’s abusive. So, and this goes for Father’s Day, too, coming up in June.

So, I this just want to remind people it’s like if you’re no contact with your mom, and you’re starting to feel guilty about her and any sort of weird stuff, and I talked about guilt on Wednesday. So, if you guys are suffering from guilt, that’s being given to you, shame that’s being given to you by an abuser, go check out the video I did on Wednesday. But if you’re having that, oh my gosh, it’s Mother’s Day, I should contact them even though they were abusive or even though they were neglectful. Here’s the question you ask yourself. If I were not related to this bozo, would I have anything to do with them? If the answer is no, act accordingly, have nothing to do with them stay no contact for your own comfort and your own safety. If you reconnect with an abusive parent, I can guarantee you it’s the inner child trying to do that is the inner child going, but in fact, we’re going to be talking a lot about the inner child today wanting something different. And if you’re going to a well that is dry, and it’s salted, and it’s poisoned, so don’t go to that. Well. Don’t do it. Don’t do it; it’s not going to work out well. So that is what I have to say about Mother’s Day. If you have a good mom, great. If you don’t, for the love of God and all its holy, do not contact them if you are no contact because it’s just not going to end well. So oh, there is has that is the current event for today.

So, we flew in last night from Honolulu. So, I’m very, very tired. So, I’m sorry, I may ramble a little bit today because I’ve got very little sleep. So anyway, okay. All right. So, today’s topic is oversharing. Anything you say can and absolutely will be used against you. Absolutely. 110% No, no even question about that. So, what can we do about oversharing? And why do we do it? So, there’s the thing that’s the question. So, here’s what’s going on. It’s our limbic system. Yay, limbic system. It’s our limbic system. So basically, what ends up happening is it’s our amygdala. So, our amygdala is our fight-flight, freeze or faun, right? The amygdala can’t tell the difference between past, present, future emotional, non-emotional, whatever. So, when we get triggered, in some way, shape, or form, an abuser comes at us, whether it’s a parent, or romantic partner, or an official, or anybody who’s abusive anybody. And our limbic system gets triggered, and we’re suddenly thrown into this emotional dysregulation. And we are operating from the level of a two-year-old, three-year-old, five-year-old, 10-year-old, whatever the inner child was at the time that we were unjustly accused. This is why it is so important to go back through and do inner child work. Hugely important to reraise that inner child so that when we get triggered, we’re able to recognize it and go, Oh, I feel like I’m about 10. Holy cow, I need to take a step back and take a deep breath and then respond as opposed to thrown into a tizzy. The limbic system is going crazy. Your amygdala is going Danger, danger, danger. Cortisol is flooding the body, and you’re starting to spew in an effort to knock get in trouble. That’s basically what’s happening. So, the limbic system is, is going crazy. And it’s reacting. It’s reacting. You don’t want to react; you want to act. So, getting yourself back to emotional regulation. And back to recognizing, oh my gosh, I’m oversharing. So, in the most common times that this happens is when the abuser is coming at us, right? They’re unjustly accusing us of something, who knows what, usually in a divorce case, usually in a custody case.

So basically, what it is, is you want to start re-raising your inner children. So that means doing the work. That means doing the mirror work addressing that inner child, hello inner child, I see you, I hear you, it’s okay. You don’t have to react; you can let the adult me deal with stuff. Little you gets to go play; I get to deal with this stuff. You know, doing the mirror work reinforcing that doing the guided imagery working Catherine Taylor’s Inner Child Workbook or Lucia Cappacchione Inner Child Workbook, doing guided imagery, taking yourself back through your childhood, standing behind your child, hands on to your child’s shoulders, and guiding them through all those nasty times that you’ve had to deal with. So that you’re the protector, you’re taking care of them, you’ve got them covered. So that’s really important.

Because otherwise, what ends up happening is somebody comes out as oh my gosh, we start people pleasing. We start people pleasing. And one of the ways we people pleased as a child was to try to explain, right, well, why did you do this? Or why are you doing that? And you did this? And you did that? No, I didn’t. But and that’s what gets us into trouble. Because then we start saying anything and everything, you know, trying to figure out what’s going to be the magic combination that’s going to make them stop. But here’s the deal. You’ve got to understand. abusers are dedicated to misunderstanding you let me say that again. abusers are dedicated to misunderstanding you. Even they know. They know the truth. They do. They don’t care. They don’t care. They will lie, lie, lie. Remember, we’ve talked about this and even though you’re speaking the truth, and you’re saying that you didn’t do this, or you know, that’s not fair or whatever, they don’t care. They literally do not care. You’ve got to understand you’re dealing with somebody who has no empathy, none. And they’re sadistic, and you are their chosen punching bag. So, nothing you say is going to make a difference. You would have a better and deeper conversation with my backdrop than you would with an abuser. They are dedicated to misunderstanding you. So, what can we do about this? So first of all, there’s a couple of books which of course, in my three hours of sleep I didn’t put out, um, one of them is the in the Divorce Guide; Laurie Hellas wrote a book on divorce. Brain gone; I’ll think of it. Anyway, that’s one of them. So, the book by Laurie Hellas just look up Lori Hellis it’ll pop up. Insider’s Guide to Divorce, I think is what it’s called. And it’s great because she goes through the whole justice system, so you understand what the courts are looking for. The other one is Splitting by Bill Eddy and Randy Krieger because you got to understand this is intentional on the part of the abuser, they poke, poke, poke, poke, poke, poke, poke and in an effort to either get you to do reactionary you know, screaming at them because you’re trying to make them stop. So, then they can film it and say, Oh, you’re the abuser, which they love to do. Listen to me now; believe me later, guys.

Kris Godinez  09:13

There is no depth, there is no end to their depravity, there is no low that they won’t go to, they’ll do anything. I had one recently that, in a medical emergency, when alone in the hospital room with the child, started screaming don’t hurt me. Don’t touch me. You’re hitting me blah, blah, blah. And of course, the other parent was across the room. Thank God the other parent had their phone on. So, but, and then this person tried to bring that bring that to the courts, and the courts threw it out, but it’s just their depravity is amazing. It just don’t put it past them. I have so many times had clients go Oh, no, they would never do that. Yeah, they would. If it would, if it will push their agenda, if it gets you in trouble with the law. If it will get you in trouble with the courts. They absolutely will. You cannot trust them as well. er’s you can spit seriously; you can trust them just about as far as you could spend a dead rat out of your mouth. That’s about as far as you can do it because you can’t trust them. They will do the most heinous things to try to get you in trouble. And to get you to over explain and to get you to say things that are going to be used against you in a court of law.

So, here’s the deal, every single time you have an interaction with an ex or with anybody that is abusive, you want to treat it as if it’s going to show up in court records. Seriously. So, there were some really good articles that I pulled up about oversharing. And how to stop because that seems to be the big problem. Because what I see happening is tit for tat, tit for tat, tit for tat, and then shooting back and thinking that somehow, it’s going to make a difference. And what’s going on is, is that inner child is the one that’s going but and trying to get them to hear you. They’re dedicated to not hearing you listen to me, now, believe me later, they’re never going to hear you. They’re never going to get that you’re a good person. Let me just, let me just be clear here. They’re never going to get it. Never, never. I mean, it’s like Jesus Christ himself could come down and say, Look, this person is a good person, and they would argue with them, no lie. So okay, so here’s the deal. You’ve got to stop arguing with them, you’ve got to stop playing their game, their game is to get you hooked into that inner child, so that you start oversharing, you’ve got to stop because there’ll be selective about what they share with the courts, especially if you’re not using our family wizard. There’ll be selective about, you know, what they videotape, etc., etc., etc. So don’t put yourself in those positions. So okay. So, here’s the one I wanted to show you. It’s called How to Set Boundaries and an Age of Oversharing. And this is on Psychology Today.

So, for regular, non-disordered family, spouses, friends, they suggest putting a columns so in the past, I’ve always told you right out your list of deal breakers, right? So those are your boundaries, deal breakers are your boundaries that you will not allow anyone else to cross boundaries are your boundaries. So, who you wouldn’t be comfortable sharing what with? So, in this one, it’s called How to Set Boundaries in an Age of Oversharing. It’s on Psychology Today. It’s by Andrea Brandt, PhD. And what she suggests doing is writing it out. So, in columns, who are you willing to share what with so the first column is significant other now that would be provided you had a sane, significant other. We’re going to go back through it. If it’s not a sane, significant other. Second one would be family. Now that would be provided if they were saying family, third friends, fourth, strangers or acquaintances, okay. Then you write down subjects that you’re uncomfortable discussing with these four categories. So now, here’s the deal, if you’re divorcing, a disordered narcissist, psychopath, dark triad, etc. There is going to be very little, you’re going to be willing to discuss with them so basically, if you have children with one of these Jack wagons, the only thing you’re going to discuss is need to know information about the child. That’s it. That is it. You are not going to respond to anything else. Even if they sit there and poke, poke, poke if they accuse you of XY and Z. No response Listen to me now, believe me later. No response is a response. Or you can simply say I’m not addressing that period. And then don’t address it and then let them go off because if you’re doing our family wizard, it’s going to show how crazy they are. So um, there is that so you stick to only things that are facts and figures, no emotion, no emotion, they want to get you riled up so that you’ll start so that they can go to the court and go look see how crazy they are. And this goes for male abusers, this goes for female abusers doesn’t matter. I’ve seen both of them do it. So, when you are doing any sort of communication, basically, you’re not discussing anything that isn’t relevant to either the divorce or the custody, and that is the biggest mistake we make.

Now let’s move on to toxic family. There’s going to be very little that you’re going to discuss with them to literally it if you choose to stay in contact with them. It needs to be surface stuff, only. Nothing that is serious. Nothing that is important to you why because they will sabotage it. guarantee it 110% and take it to the bank and earn interest on it. So, if you have got toxic family and you share something that’s important to you, they’re going to put it down, they’re going to tell you, you can’t do it, they’re going to make fun of you for wanting to do it, they’re going to do everything they can to keep you from doing it. So again, know your audience. And the key is getting that inner child to understand that toxic abuser, that toxic family is never going to be the well filled with healthy water that they need. Does that make sense? So, you’ve got to really work with that inner child to know that you cannot go to either one of those wells. Those wells are dry and salted and poisoned. Don’t go to them. You’re not going to get the approval, the validation, the encouragement, the support, the love that you deserve, not from those two idiots. You’re just not because they’re disordered and they’re evil. And they’re just dedicated to being sadistic and nasty and mean. And you’re their favorite punching bag, and how dare their favorite punching bag, go do something awesome. So that’s why you don’t go to your family and share things.

So, for example, when I went back and got my master’s degree, I didn’t tell anybody. I told my sister, and that was it. My oldest sister, that was it. That’s the only person I told. And then I waited until graduation. And then I told my mom, and then she came out for graduation. Because I did not want the naysaying. I didn’t want the nastiness I didn’t want you can’t do it. I didn’t want that. So, I just want to end it didn’t tell anybody except somebody who I knew was going to be supportive. And this is what you have to have really seriously a come to Jesus’ meeting with your inner child who really truly is supportive in your life. And the way you tell that is previous behavior. Seriously, so like my oldest sister, consistent, always supportive, always good advice, always helping me, always amazing. So, you know, I knew I could trust her. Everybody else in the family, not so much. So, you know what I’m saying. So, you really have to have a serious chat with that inner child and be like, Look, little one, this person, this person, and this person are not safe to talk to this person safe to talk to those people not safe to talk to.

So now we’re going to move into the friend category. So, are these people truly supportive? So, in this age of oversharing, like social media, oh, dear Lord, some of the things I’ve read on social media, I’m like, why are you telling everybody this? Nobody needs to know this, especially your ex-Hello. Um, but it’s like with friends. You know, not every friend is really a friend. Some of them are acquaintances, and we have to be okay with that. And I noticed the inner child has a really hard time with that, wants everybody to be the friend. Everybody’s my friend. Well, no, no, darlin, not everybody is your friend. Sometimes they pretend to be friends, and they’ve got a knife hidden behind their backs, just waiting to use it on you. So, when we come out of an abusive relationship, whether that is a romantic relationship or a familial relationship, our pickers are not really good. And so, the people that we’ve surrounded ourselves with, tend to mimic our family of origin.

So, you want to be very careful about your friends. They had better be true friends. In other words, not running back to the abuser, not flying monkeys. Not in competition with you. Not a covert narcissist, not a narcissist, not a psychopath. Are they really your friends? And again, behavior speaks louder than words. What is the behavior? Are they there for you when the chips are down? You know, are they there for you when you need somebody, you know, or are they busy? And oh, I can’t be bothered with this or blah, blah, blah. Does that make sense? So, this is how you kind of start separating things out who can you start trusting? Now, again, this all boils down to self-esteem. You have got to work on your self-esteem, trusting your own gut because that is where our picker lives is in our gut instinct. Okay? When we’ve been abused, either romantically or a family of origin or whatever, they tell us. Oh, no, your guts wrong. Oh, no, you don’t see that. Oh, no, this isn’t really happening gaslighting. Hello. And so, we then stop acknowledging we see the pink elephant taking a crap in the corner of the living room, but we still stop acknowledging it. Pretty soon, we don’t see it because we’ve been trained not to. So, you’ve got to allow yourself to start trusting your gut again. Okay, Self-Esteem Workbook by Glenn Schiraldi Disease to Please Harriet Breaker. The Inner Child Workbook, Lucia Cappacchione or Catherine Taylor, start doing guided imagery with your inner children. Allow them to acknowledge that they see the pink elephant taking a crap in the corner of the family living room. Do you see where I’m going with that? So that is what’s important is really working on listening to your gut trusting that gut instinct. If something feels off, it probably is. And you may be a little paranoid in the beginning, but I’ll tell you what, I’d rather have you be a little paranoid than a little too naive. Does that make sense? So, there is now. I see we’ve got some questions, I will get to them in about 10 minutes. Hang on.

So okay, setting boundaries. So, the other thing you have to do, too, is when you are on the Internet, okay. And this is where I see a lot of people making a mistake when they’re in a custody battle or a divorce. They don’t walk their stuff down; you have got to lock your stuff down. Why? Well, it’s not just the abuser, you have to be concerned about. It’s the flying monkey. Okay, so oversharing gets picked up by the flying monkeys. The flying monkeys run back to the abuser and tell the abuser or screenshot it and show the abuser. So basically, you do not want to say anything on the internet that you do not want to have ended up in court, serious as a heart attack. I know it’s really tempting that when you, you know, are in the middle of a divorce, and you want to show the other person that you’re living a great life… Well, you don’t want to do that. It’s none of their business. Nobody needs to know that it really doesn’t. Because what they’ll do is they’ll go to the court and say, See, they don’t need child support. See, they don’t need that. Look all the money they’re spending on it. It’s BS honestly. Because really, what it boils down to is how much you make not what you do with it. But you know, they’ll do that they’re How do I explain this?

Kris Godinez  21:37

The person who represents themselves in a court of law has a fool for a client. Oftentimes narcissists do that, because they’re so arrogant. They think they can do it on their own. Now, of course, sometimes the abuse targets can’t afford an attorney, and they have to represent themselves. That’s different. But what I’ve seen the abusers do is they will just then file motion after motion after motion after motion after motion after motion after motion after motion, based on things that they saw on the internet or things that were said in our family wizard, or whatever. And it that’s why I’m saying if you don’t want it to end up in court, don’t say it. You know, keep to facts and figures. Do not get drawn into their cesspool, I think that’s the best way to put it, of word salad and accusations and nastiness, because they want you to respond. They want you to react. They want to have something that they can take back to their attorney or to their judge, or whatever they’re doing, you know, or file some sort of frivolous motion. They’re idiots. They do this all the time. And it’s for two reasons. One, they think they’re smarter than everybody else. They don’t understand the law. Two. They want to bankrupt the other person. That’s why you want to say absolutely as little as possible.

So, stopping the oversharing again, you write it out. Who can you share with? Who can you share with if they’re toxic, you cannot share with them. And you’re going to have to remind your inner child now when I was healing from my crazy, toxic family, I had a dream towards the end of me seeing Fabian Smith in Portland, Oregon. Fabian was a godsend, thank God. And one of the dreams I had, I had a dream that all of my family members that were abusive were all forced to sit down; they were gagged. And they were, you know, tied to the chair, and they had to hear me. And in my dream, I told them everything. I was just like. You’re a jerk. You’re this, you’re that, you did that, you know, and it was great to get it off my chest. When I woke up from that dream. I was like, wow, that is my subconscious talking. Right? All the things I wanted to say, but I couldn’t. And I recognized I could never say it to them in person because they as they wouldn’t get it. And B they deny it and C they flip it around and make it all my fault. But it’s kind of like that’s kind of what you have to do with your inner child allow them the chance to speak it out to the abusers. So, you can either do a guided imagery with your inner children or let them say everything they wanted to say. And then remind them, Hey, little one, we can’t do that with whoever the abuser is. But we can certainly do it in guided imagery. And why this works is because our limbic system or amygdala cannot tell the difference between imagining it and doing it. That’s why if you sit and you think about being in a bank robbery, you’re standing in line, suddenly bank robbers come in, and they’re there. They got guns, and they’re going to hold the place hostage. Your hurdle start pounding, and you’ll start breathing fast because your amygdala can’t tell the difference between just imagining a bank robbery and actually being in a bank robbery. So, the beautiful thing is, you can start healing you’re inner child by imagining having conversations with all of these people and telling them exactly where to go pound sand, and reminding your inner child, you’re the adult, you get to protect them, it’s your job, you will protect them. They don’t need to do anything except the little kids. That’s it. You will keep them safe. And so, you work on that guided imagery.

So, I strongly suggest seriously strongly suggest, if you’re struggling with oversharing, I strongly suggest you start working on the inner child. That’s what doing it the inner child is the one that is going, but it’s not fair. But you’re not hearing me. They’re never going to hear you. It is always going to be unfair with them always. Which is why you give them nothing. That’s why gray rock is so great. It’s like, no response is a response. And if they have nothing to work with, they have to make stuff up. And eventually, people start figuring out that they’re making stuff out because you’re not responding. There’s no paper trail. There’s no internet trail. There’s no…do you see where I’m going on with that. So, and that’s why I tell people, it’s like stop talking to your spouse on the phone. If you’re in the middle of a high conflict, contentious divorce, high conflict custody issue, if you’re on the phone with them, and it’s not being recorded based on whatever state law you’re in. There, they can say that you said anything. So that’s why I’m saying everything has to be in writing. Get our family wizard insist on it. And if they refuse to use it, hold them in contempt of court. Because obviously, they’re hiding something. Duh. you know, seriously, it’s like they don’t think they don’t think they’re just kind of like, well, I’m just not going to use it. I’m not going to use it. I’ll do it this way. No, no, it’s court-ordered. Its court ordered. So, you want to get splitting and you want to get the book by Lori Hillis the Insider’s Guide. I think it’s the Insider’s Guide to divorce. I can’t think of what the title is. But it’s by Laurie Hellas, great book.

Okay, so how to set boundaries. All right. So then, the other thing to recognize, too, is that we get triggered, and it’s called trauma, dumping, trauma dumping. So, in other words, when you find yourself on a flow, and you’re just literally, and you just keep talking, what you want to do is you want to take a look when, how old were you? When you did that? How old are you feeling in that moment? It is your inner child. That’s a trauma dump. And that is something you want to get with a good trauma therapist and start working on how old were you when you started having to defend yourself. Now, if we were raised by family of origin that was abusive, we were defending ourselves all the damn time. Seriously. It’s like, you know, why are you breathing that way? And we had to explain why we were breathing that way.

So, the thing I want to encourage you to get into the habit of is you don’t owe anybody an explanation. I no shock. You don’t owe anybody. I don’t care who they are an explanation. You don’t, you do not know. Obviously, if you’re in a court of law, and somebody asks you something, yeah, you’re going to have to explain. But you really, really, really want to take a look at who’s asking and why. What’s their agenda? What’s their motivation? What are they looking for? If somebody’s, you know, digging, then they’re obviously trying to find things against you.

So, you really want to be careful with who you share things with. And on the Internet. If you’re going through a divorce, lock it down, get rid of the flying monkeys. Well, how come I can’t see your stuff anymore? Because I’m going through a divorce. That’s all you need to say. Well, but I’m not going to share. I understand. And that’s all you need to say. You don’t need to appease them. You do not need to appease them, you seriously do not need to appease them. So, alright, so setting boundaries.

All right, and then you are going to talk to people about your boundaries. If your father keeps prying into your romantic relationships or your financial situation or anything else. You simply say that is not up for discussion. How about them Dodgers, and if they keep doing it, you leave healthy normal, and we say this again, healthy, normal people. healthy normal people catch clues, and they respect the word no. if somebody’s uncomfortable discussing something, all a healthy normal person needs to hear is change of subject. That’s off-topic, okay. And then you don’t revisit it. People who have no boundaries will continue to merge over the boundaries. So, if after you’ve said this is not up for discussion, how about them Dodgers? And they do something like, ooh really touchy or weak? You get up, and you leave. You get up, and you leave! Because that is a boundary that they are obviously They not respecting. So that is super important. Okay, um, make changes on social media. You’ve got to change who you have on there. Do not let it be public Do not let your ex or any of his flying or her flying monkeys get on there. It’s dangerous. Yeah, especially if you’re in the middle of the divorce and the custody battle, you absolutely do not want to have anybody on there that has access to your personal stuff. Because you know, it’s going to go right back to them

Now switching gears a bit. During a divorce. What I see abusers do is they overshare to their kids, okay? They tell the kids way the hell too much.

Kris Godinez  30:47

So, if you are the spouse, of a person who’s oversharing, and the kid comes to you, and usually it’s about money, that’s or how horrible the other person is, you know, oh, I’m broke because of your dad, I’m broke because of your mom, I’m broke, you know, or, you know, they’re awful. They’re horrible. They had an affair, whatever. Whatever the kid comes to you with. You just say Honey, that’s not for you to worry about. Daddy or Mommy is upset and they’re saying things that are not true. And you leave it at that because that is the truth. You don’t go into anything else you don’t over-explain. And you be age specific. Remember, little ones like zero to six do not have the cognitive ability to cope with the emotional fallout of a divorce. So, for example, in this article, let me see who did this one. Mom and Dad, Mom, and Dad and TMI. Are you an oversharer? by Peggy Drexler, PhD, children are keeping terrible secrets. Oh, children are keeping are terrible at keeping secrets. Yes. So, one of the examples in here was that one of the kids would hear the parents say, Well, I’m never going to marry again and done it at it. And the kid was young, six, and they couldn’t quite figure out why. And so somehow being married became very awful in their mind, because the parent kept saying how horrible it was. Well, just because the parent had a horrible marriage doesn’t mean the kid’s going to have a horrible marriage. My mom used to do that all the time. My mom was like, oh, you know, you should never get married. It’s horrible. It’s awful. It’s terrible. It’s on. And I have been married for almost 30 years. And we love each other. And we had a lot of fun together, obviously. So, you know, it’s, it’s, it’s disordered thinking to do that. So, if you hear the child saying something about never marrying again, you say, You know what, that’s mommy or daddy’s experience that’s not yours, you get to have a great marriage if you won’t want. Leave it at that. So, you’ve got to be very careful what you say and how much you say to kids about the divorce. So, when a kid asks, Why are you getting divorce, keep it simple. You know, mommy and daddy just grew apart, we cannot agree on anything we were not meant to be. That’s it. That’s all you need to say. You do not need to go into depth, you do not depend on how old they are. Now, if they’re teenagers, they’re probably quite aware of what’s going on in the in the marriage, they’re not stupid. Kids know, when something’s off, I knew when something was off when I was a little kid, you know, you could probably say like, well, you know, Daddy’s got an anger issue, or Mommy’s got an anger issue. And I just don’t want to be around that, you know, which is the truth.

So, and then as they get older, age appropriate, you give them more information, but you don’t overload them, because their little brains aren’t able to cope with that, they’re not able to process that through anyway. So that was Mom and Dad and TMI, and that was on Psychology Today.

Okay, attachment in the search for the inner child, if the intensity of your emotions and reactions are out of sync or way stronger than what the situation calls for, you may need to do some inner child work. That’s not you may need to, you do need to because that’s what’s who’s running the show. So here are the things that we need to start telling ourselves, I can feel happiness and purpose simultaneously with deep sorrow. And why do I say that? So, we stop running from feeling sad. And that is something that our inner child does is that a lot of times, especially when I work with clients that had not only abuse but a substance issue. I don’t want to feel. I don’t want to feel. I don’t want to feel that I don’t want to feel. I don’t want to I don’t want to know what it needs, only be happy, only happy. Well, if life were only happy. I don’t think we’d be here on planet Earth.

So, all of the emotions are good guys. All of the emotions are good. They may not be comfortable, but they’re good. They’re all okay. It’s what we do with them that makes them helpful or hurtful. So, it’s okay to feel joy and sadness. You can. We have a depth and a breadth to us. We can feel both simultaneously. In fact, Buddha speaks about, you know, enlightenment is being able to acknowledge all of your emotions and yet still feel that deep sense kind of sadness or that deep sorrow. So, it’s kind of acknowledging all things kind of thing. And allowing, allowing. I can be the author of my life, as opposed to living out a sad, lonely story assigned to me in childhood. So, a lot of disordered parents, I don’t know if you guys ever saw the movie Like Water for Chocolate. It’s an old one, really good. So, in that movie, the mom it basically generational trauma is what it’s about. The youngest and every family was assigned a role to take care of the mom. And she never was supposed to have a life. Never supposed to get married, never supposed to love, never supposed to whatever. And it was all about her breaking out. And of course, at a tragic ending, you know, Academy Award winner. Anyway, the point being is Like Water for Chocolate, good movie, bring Kleenex. So, it’s assignment. And my mom used to tell me this all the time. She’s like, Oh, you’re a loner. You’re a loner. And I’m like, like hell I am. I’m social, like nobody’s business, your cruise director, people, you know what I’m saying? And she kept telling me, You’re a loner, you’re a loner, you’re a loner, and it didn’t know. I’m not I like people. I do. She did’nt. But she also had a lot of abuse. And I understand why she did that.

But again, parents need to be careful that they’re not shoving their issues onto the kids. My mom had issues with people because she was abused when she married an abuser. Two of them actually, um, you know, and so you don’t want to project onto your children your own issues. Does that make sense? So just because your family has said it will and again with me, you know, my dad told me I was the cute one, not the smart one. So, I was kind of like, funny. I’m the only one that owns my own business. Oh, thank you very much. Um, you know, it’s like, just because they have predicted your doom, you’ve got to understand they’re talking about themselves. They are talking about it when somebody predicts your doom. When somebody say you’re a loner, or you’re the cute one, not this smart one, well, they’re talking about themselves. They’re talking about themselves. They’re not talking about you. They don’t even know who the hell you are. They don’t know who the hell they are. Let alone you, you know what I’m saying. So, you’ve got to be able to as an adult, talk to that inner child and go hey, little one. When mom and dad said this, they were talking about themselves, they were not talking about you, you can be the author of your own destiny. You are you are the captain of this ship. You are El Capitan; you can do whatever you want. I just suddenly got a Q when I said that. You can do whatever you want. You can decide where you’re going and who you’re with and what you’re up to. You don’t you’re not doomed to follow their weirdness. Okay. Okay, and I swear I’m going to get to questions in just a second. My emotions were experiences that I had control over, not some unalterable truth. My emotions were experiences that I had control over not some unalterable truth. Now, here’s the thing. Feelings are not facts. And we often confuse that. So, it’s okay to have feelings, but they’re not necessarily facts.

So again, inner child work, work with that child. It’s okay to have feelings. It doesn’t mean it’s unalterable. Just because you’re sad about this does not mean you’re going to be sad forever means you’re having a moment of sadness in time. Things change, hairstyles change, weather changes. So, do emotions, go with it. So that’s the important thing. So, this is called this article is Attachment in the Search for the Inner Child by Hal Shorey, PhD on Psychology Today. Okay, let’s get to the questions. All right.

Do narcissists themselves overshare only when they are trying to establish the illusion of intimacy. So let me be clear about this. So, they will share things in an effort to get you to open up, but it’s different than oversharing that we do. So oversharing that we do is kind of like a stream-of-consciousness panicked. You know, this that the other thing you know, don’t know how you know, and just this frantic kind of oversharing talking, talking, talking, and trying to figure out what they want, you know, this that the other thing they overshare to get us to open up in the love bombing phase especially so they’ll, they’ll offer a nugget of personal information, hoping that you’re going to turn around and do that. Now the other way that they overshare is they’re so arrogant. They will basically tell you what they are going to do. So, you know, they will say things like, you know, Oh, you shouldn’t love me, I’ll leave you. They weren’t lying.

Kris Godinez  40:09

So, and we don’t believe them, of course, because, you know, we’re thinking that they’re normal people and they are not. And so, you know, they say things like that or, you know, I’ll only hurt you, you know, that kind of thing, and we don’t believe them. And we need to believe that when somebody I very much pay attention to what people say, and when somebody says, Oh, well, I may be a narcissist, you know, maybe in their buddy, you know what I’m saying? It’s like, No, you’re, you’re helping them with that. Yeah. So, you know, it’s, listen, you’ve got to listen, you got to listen to what they say. And you’ve got to believe them. Because they, they do slip they do. And it’s almost like this game of, are they going to catch me? And I think it’s a little bit of a no. It’s not a little bit. It’s a lot of bit of arrogance. You know, it’s like, if I tell them the truth with this, are they going to believe me, you know, and nine times out of 10, we don’t because we’ve been groomed by family origin, not to, and we’ve been groomed by society, you know, oh, well, you know, they’re just self-deprecating. You know, there’s just, you know, they’re, they know, they couldn’t be that bad. No, you’ve got to be like, that’s a red flag. So yeah, there’s now. Hold on, let me get back to the rest of that question. I experienced narcissists sharing so many things that could cause them trouble. Yeah, they do. Because they don’t think they’re going to get caught. It’s like they want to get caught. Yep. And to show off what they’ve done. 110%. So, again, one of my favorite shows on I think its ID is Signs of a Psychopath. And almost all of them brag. That’s how they get caught is that they slipped to somebody bragging about the murder that they committed, or the crime that they committed, or whatever. And they truly feel it’s that antisocial thing. They feel they’re above the law, that they’re never going to get caught that nobody’s going to turn them in. They’ve got this weird magic thinking, but it’s different than the magic thinking that other people have their magic thinking is along the lines of, I’m invincible. I’m never going to get caught. I’m above the law. I’m smarter than everybody else, you know, a hubris like nobody’s business. Yeah, they do that. And it’s kind of a. It’s kind of a How long can I get away with it? Kind of thing? It really is. Yeah. And I do think they want to get caught. I do, I think, or they want to see how long they can go without getting caught. You know what I’m saying? So, how many people they can pull the wool over? Yeah, absolutely. All right.

Hi, Kris, about to go on a church weekend retreat. I like to go into deep conversations, but I am working on the oversharing. So, I just do surface-level convos kind of boring to me. Well, here’s the deal. Again, if you don’t know these people, would you go to a total stranger and start baring your soul? You shouldn’t. Because you don’t know if that total stranger is a covert narcissist, an antisocial A, you don’t know who they are. So, you want to stick to things that where you get to kind of know each other. And you know, you can talk about life, the universe, and basically everything. But be careful of what you share personally until you feel out whether or not they’re safe. And that takes time. That’s not going to happen over a weekend retreat. It’s going to be more of a you know, let’s see if I like them. Let’s see if we have a lot in common. You know, and you can talk about, you know, things, hobbies. What do you guys have in common? What do you say you’re going to… so religion obviously is important. Talk about that, you know, talk about what do you like to do for hobbies? What do you like to do for fun? Where do you like to travel? I love talking about that. It’s like then I get new places to go to, I’m like, Oh, you liked this loser? Oh, let’s go try that. So, you know, it’s like in. Never underestimate the power of chit-chat. Chit Chat can tell you who a person is. Don’t consider it boring. You know, chitchat is important. Chit Chat is kind of like getting to know the person what is their basic attitude? What is there, you know outlook on life? Are they, you know, pretty much go with the flow? Are they always trying to control things, or, you know, how a person responds to chit-chat is really important. Are they always having to be the center of attention? Are they always turning the conversation back to them? Those are all red flags and things to look out for so chitchat is important. So don’t go diving too deep until you know who they are and what their agenda is. So that’s my recommendation for that. And don’t allow your brain to tell you that it’s boring. It’s no conversation is boring. I mean, it tells me volumes about people. I mean, it’s so interesting to sit in an airport and listen to the conversations going around. And you can know a lot about people just by hearing the conversations, you know. So, anyway, alright, um alright.

My ex-emails me pretending that it is about our kids but then launches into how horrible I am. What do I do? You ignore it? You absolutely ignore it; you know if there’s something so here’s the thing. Suzanna Quintana, I love her. She is a life coach. And she helps people figure out how to whittle down the emails. So, if you’re interested in getting together with Suzanna Quintana, Suzannaquintana.com, she helps people read the emails, find that one line that’s about kids, respond to that, and ignore the rest, you are seriously going to have to become a Zen master. By the time you are done with this, you’re going to be a doctorate in psychology, and you’re going to be a Zen master.

So, no matter what nastiness is thrown at you, yes, they will say oh, it’s about the kid. And then it’ll be a novel. It’s like they all do the same thing. I swear to God, it’s like there’s a friggin handbook out there for how to be a jerk. How to be a narcissistic jerk and three easy steps. So yeah, they all do the same thing. They all you know, say it’s about the kid. And then it’s a diatribe about how horrible you are and all your wrongs, all this and all that. What you’re going to have to do skim through it, look at it like an attorney. And you’re also going to have your law degree. Look at it like an attorney what needs to be responded to? Well, none of this this is all hearsay. None of that that’s all just accusations that I don’t need to respond to you. Oh, look, buried in the middle one line about the kid that is the one line you respond to the rest of it. What you can do is you can write it out and burn it do not respond, do not respond, do not respond, do not respond. Do not respond. Listen to me. Now, believe me later. You do not want this going into a court of law. But what you do want is their diatribe. Do you see where I’m going with that? You want their crazy in there. You don’t want your crazy in there. Does that make sense? Because they make us crazy? They do? They do? Absolutely. And that inner child wants to respond to just be like, You’re wrong. You’re wrong, you’re wrong. Well, they know they’re wrong. And they’re hoping that that inner child is going to respond. Do not respond. Do not do not. I know you want to respond so what you can do is on a separate piece of paper, so you’re not tempted to send it. Write them a go pound sand letter, dear X. You’re a jackass. You’re wrong. None of this is true.

Kris Godinez  47:38

Bleep the bleep at a bleeping bleep you bleeping bleep Do you see where I’m going without? At the very end, take your power back, you know, Mother clucker, I’m not going to respond to you. I’m just going to let you sit there and stew wondering if I’m going to respond because I’m not going to y’all are going to have to wait till doomsday. You see where I’m going with that? Take your power back. There is power in not responding. We think there’s not it’s so weird. In our in our society. It’s kind of like, Oh, but I have to fight back. Oh contraire. They’re sitting there stewing because you’re not responding. So, the best way to piss them right the bleep off. Don’t respond. narcissist. You got to understand guys, narcissists are cuckoo for Cocoa Puffs, like technical term, they would rather have a negative response to something they’ve said the no response at all. No response at all drives them crazy. Let it. Because then their nastiness is going to ramp up. And if you’ve got our family wizard, it’s going to be clear in our family wizard who the problem is. That’s why you do not want to engage. That’s why you do not want to tit for tat because it doesn’t make a difference there. They are dedicated to misunderstanding you. Let me say that again. You are their punching bag. They are vomiting all of their nastiness onto you. Okay, they’re not going to stop. It doesn’t stop. It doesn’t. When the kid turns 18. It’ll stop until there’s a wedding or a birth or a funeral or some reason that y’all have to get back together again. So just be prepared. This is who they are. They’re showing you who they are. Believe them the first time responding is not going to do any good. It didn’t do any good when you were married to them what the hell makes you think it’s going to do any good now? Don’t respond. No response is the best way to hurt a narcissist seriously because they think their God and they think that they are, you know, deserving. I demand a response. No, you can demand it until the cows come home, mutherclucker. It isn’t going to happen. See where I’m going with that? Don’t give them a response. Write it out and burn it write out whatever you’d like to say to them and burn it. Do not send it.

The other day I had a client, dear God, who sent the letter I told them not to. And they sent it. And of course, it gave the abuser all the ammo they needed to isolate the person from the family. And I was like I told you not to do it. Why did you do it? Well, I didn’t believe you. Okay, how old were you when you didn’t believe me? Because it’s kind of my job. You know, kind of know what I’m talking about, what’s going on. So, we had to work through the whole inner child thing. And the inner child was the one that was like, but, and the inner child really threw a wrench in that relationship by giving the abuser all the ammo. So that’s what you don’t want to do. That’s what they’re going to do anything you say, can and will be used against you. Absolutely. That’s why you say nothing. That’s why you say absolutely nothing because then they got nothing. If you don’t respond, and you’re, you’re responding to whatever the child’s needs are, you know, yes, no, keep it short. Keep it brief, no explanation, just address whatever the issue is yes or no, you know, and if they decide to send another book, great, let ‘em, but you don’t respond to that book unless it has to do with the kid. And you keep it facts and figures only. So that when the, Our Family Wizard goes before the judge, the judge can see you’re responding in an appropriate manner and they are the ones that are being abusive. That’s what you want to do. So, if you feel like you absolutely need to respond, take it out onto a piece of paper, write it out longhand, tell them to go pound sand, tell them whatever. But also, at the very end, take your power back. It’s like you’re going to wait till the cows come home, mutherclucker. I am not responding. You can just sit and stew on that. Have fun. Bye. Bye. Now guess who has the power? Me! Not you!

Kris Godinez  51:48

Me! Not you. That’s what that’s you got to find the humor. You got to find the humor because, remember, narcissists have no sense of humor and take your power back where you can. So that’s really important. Do not respond. Okay.

What does it mean when a man says to you that all men cheat…it says he’s a cheater, so narcissists basically call themselves out. And they will say things like, oh, men cheat, or Everyone lies. Now remember, we talked about that when I talked about the whole, you know if their lips are moving their lying. So basically, what it is, is they cannot conceive. They cannot conceive of people doing things differently than they do. Because in their minds, everyone is exactly like them. And anyone who isn’t exactly like them is the enemy. So, remember that everyone has to be exactly like them. So, because they do something, they say everybody does it. Oh, well, everybody cheats. Everybody lies. No mother clucker. They don’t. And there’s been studies that prove that. So yeah, they’re basically calling their thirst, saying who they are. They are telling you who they are. And they are telling you either what they are doing or what they very will soon be doing. So, I would go get tested, and I would leave. Absolutely. 110%.

I refuse to call my mother for Mother’s Day. Yes, absolutely. That’s okay. I believe no contact is best. But I feel pressure on the holiday to reach out. Yes. Okay, guys, here’s the deal. I hate Father’s Day because I had a really horrible relationship with my dad because he was abusive. Mother’s day, my mom is dead. So um, here’s the deal, and she had issues. God bless her. Um, here’s the deal, you are under no obligation to call them if they were abusive. If they were nasty if they were harmful, hurtful. Here’s the question I asked everybody, if you were not related to them, would you have anything to deal with them? If the answer is no, you act accordingly. Do not have anything to do with them. You’re under no obligation. And what I really hate is when flying monkeys or family friends, you know, get a hold of you, and go like, Oh, well, but, it’s your parents. I don’t care if they were abusive. They have no I have no space in my life for them. Thank you. So, you stay no contact; you don’t feel pressure. Please, do not feel pressured. You do not have to contact them. You don’t if they were abusive, they were neglectful. You know, and here’s the other question. I often ask people it’s like, you know, when they start feeling guilty, like around these holidays, I go, Okay, well, here’s the question. Is your life better without them? Oh, yeah. It’s a lot better without them. There’s your answer. If it’s better without them, keep them out. You don’t need them in. Just because they’re your parent. It doesn’t mean anything. It does their parent in name only. Seriously, think about it. her real mom for real debt is supportive and loving and kind, and there and fun and, you know, offers boundaries and teaches you about life and all that sort of good stuff. Those people are sperm and egg donors. That’s about it. Because there was no emotion. There was no support. There was no love. There was no help. There was no, you know, like, my dad’s hue and cry was, you know, as soon as you’re 18, I’m kicking you out, and I’m doing this, I’m doing that. And did you know he was a horrible person. He really was. And of course, he tried to do that before it turned 18. But, um, you know, they’re not parents. They don’t teach kids how to survive. In the world. They don’t, and they groom us to be abused by other abusers. So yeah, you owe them diddly squat. So, do you don’t feel guilty. Now? Here’s the deal. And I talked about this on Wednesday, shame and guilt. Okay. Guilt is different than shame. Guilt is when we’ve done something we know we shouldn’t have done it, you know, like, we hurt somebody’s feelings. And we know we did. And so, we need to make amends. And then we go do it. Okay. Shame is where somebody else comes in and says you need to feel guilty about this. prefer that shame, guilt, his internal shame is external. So, if you’re feeling shame about not calling your mom, you need to tell those people to go pound sand seriously. It’s like, you know, if anybody ever starts, you know, saying something that oh, well, you shouldn’t talk bad about you, your dad, he’s dead and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. I’m like, a dare the bitch. I dare that ghost to come into this room. Because I will give him a piece of my mind. And let me tell you why. And then they’re like, Oh, okay.

So, you know, you don’t owe society or family friends, or flying monkeys or anybody else. An explanation as to why you’re not in contact with them. Although I do I point blank, my dad was an abusive a-hole. Sorry, not going to talk to him. Well, he’s dead. But even if he did come back, oh, well, no, I might give him a piece of my mind. But, you know, it’s it the weird things our society has. It’s like, no if somebody’s abusive, they’re abusive. You do not have to have them in your life. I don’t care what day it is. Does that make sense? Okay, hold on. Let’s see. There was wait a minute, I’m going to answer one more because I think there was another question.

Um, have you ever experienced a flying monkey have them going nuts like wearing winter clothing in summer? You know, that would be schizo, is it effective? Or typal Ah, do I have my book? No, I don’t have any of my books, Lord, that schizotypal or schizoaffective is where they were, and I can’t remember which one it is. And we’ll have to look it up. So, I will readdress that one on Wednesday. John, if we can make sure to have that one on Wednesday, that would be good. It’s one of those two, and they were inappropriate clothing. So, like, yeah, summer clothes in the winter, winter clothes in the summer. Very odd thoughts, thoughts of reference, you know, kind of third person kind of thing. So, I will go more into that on Wednesday. Okay, kids. So, here’s the deal. I am not going to be on air for the next two Sundays because I am taking John on his birthday trip because last year, we did Disneyland that was a disaster because Bob asshat was in charge Chapek And so, I told him I’d make it up to him. So, I am taking him on a cruise. We’re going to Alaska, if you’re interested in doing the meet and greet your last day to buy tickets is on Thursday. So, I will be in Vancouver, BC I will let you know where we are. When you buy the tickets and for Portland, I have not decided on the venue yet. So that’s what you don’t have a thing saying where we’re going to be but I’m going to be in Portland, July 2. So, if you would like to come see me in Portland, or if you’d like to come see me in Vancouver, BC. Please do buy those tickets for Vancouver BC before Thursday because of the cutoff time.

All right, so anyway, there’s that, um, so if you have any questions, go ahead and put them in the comments below. Or you can IM me on Facebook. If you have topics that you would like to see me talk about. Please do let me know. And that’s it. So, you guys have a good couple of weeks takes really good care of yourselves. And I will talk to you not next weekend, not the weekend after but the weekend after that, which will be first weekend in June. So, there’s that alright guys, I will talk to you later. Be good yourself. Bye.

Thank you so much for listening to this podcast. You can always listen live on YouTube every week Sunday at noon, Arizona Mountain Standard Time. And if you want to find out more or listen to other episodes, you can go to Krisgodinez.com and if you have a chance, subscribe to this show on whatever podcast app you use and let other people know about. I want to thank my sponsor betterhelp.com. They are an online therapy company. Whether you are in the US or international. They will set you up with a qualified licensed therapist. PhD level or Master’s level. If you are interested in more information, go to betterhelp.com/krisgodinez.

You’ve been listening to the podcast version of We Need To Talk with Kris Godinez.

The post 05-14-2023 Anything You Say WILL Be Used Against You! appeared first on Kris Godinez.

Kris Godinez  00:02

Hello and welcome to We Need To Talk with Kris Godinez podcast. I’m your host Kris Godinez, licensed professional counselor. I help people get out of, and stay out of, toxic relationships. This podcast is for informational and educational purposes only the views and opinions stated herein are mine and mine alone. They do not represent the ACA, the APA or any other therapist for that matter.

I want to thank my sponsor betterhelp.com. They are an online therapy company. Whether you are in the US or international. They will set you up with a qualified licensed therapist. PhD level or Master’s level. If you are interested in more information, go to betterhelp.com/krisgodinez.

Kris Godinez  00:27

All right. So, announcements. Alright, so Suzanna and I have decided to hold off on touring again. Thank you COVID. So, we’re kind of trying to figure that all out. However, we are still plotting and planning to do a seminar at some point it is either going to be in Scottsdale or in Palm Springs. I’ve got a massage therapist, Diane, who was on the show who’s very, very interested in doing the seminar as well. We’ve got other people that are interested in doing the seminar. Oh, hello, India. My goodness. So um, hopefully I’m hoping we’ll see how the winter goes. And if in the spring, it’s looking better. And if that antiviral pill makes a difference. That would be great. Then we’re going to look at doing a seminar probably a Friday night, Saturday morning or Saturday day would be all the seminars. And then thank you Benny. Um, then Sunday we would do the goodbye breakfast and all that sort of good stuff and I don’t like those seminars where you can’t actually sit and talk to people so I’m very much like if you went on the cruise with me and John you know, we did breakfast with you guys. We hung out we had lunch we you know, because I like talking to people and I like hearing what’s going on. So that’s kind of my way of doing a seminar. It’s like, hey, let’s you know, no host lunch, breakfast, whatever, we’ll go talk and we’ll do the seminars and hang out and answer all your questions. So, at some point, it is going to happen and it’s going to be more than just me and Suzanna. I think it’s gonna be me, Susanna, Diane Brown, who’s a massage therapist. I’m trying to get Marsha Diane who is also a therapist. She’s very spiritual to do that. So, we’ll, we’ll see how that goes.

All right, speaking of Suzanna, You’re Still That Girl Suzanna Quintana at Suzannaquintana.com. She’s my girl because she’s awesome. So, this is a great book for recovering from a narcissistic abusive relationship. There is Shahida’s book, which I just I love her, Shahida Arabi The Highly Sensitive Person’s Guide to Dealing with Toxic People. I love this book because she has all sorts of suggestions for journaling and things to do to work, you know, cognitively work out the abuse. So, this is a great book. If you are going through a divorce, you need to get Splitting by Bill Edie and Randy Krieger. Because this will tell you, I’m running out of room Good Lord, I’m just gonna put this on the floor. Hang on.

Kris Godinez  03:22

This will tell you everything that your abusive ex is going to pull during the legal process. So, this is a great book if you’re thinking of divorcing or if you’re in the middle of a divorce, or if you’re in denial, and you’re going no, they would never do X, Y and Z. Yeah, they will, they will do X, Y and Z, I know they’re gonna do X, Y and Z, these guys know they’re going to do X, Y and Z you need to know they’re going to do X, Y and Z. So, this is a great book. If you are interested in my books, You Can Lead a Horse to Water But You Can’t Make ‘em Cha-Cha why some people get into abusive relationships and stay and other people get out and then my first book What’s Wrong with Your Dad… got about four hours. So, this is about my journey and kind of like why I became a therapist. So right there also to let you know I just got my headshots done for the new book which is called So You Want To Be A Therapist. So that’s coming out soon I just got the headshots done for that I’m going to be doing the audio for it in November. So, the hardcopy book is probably going to be coming out sometime this month and the audio book will be coming out sometime in November, December that’s the evil plan and I’m working on the fourth book which is more along the lines of You Can Lead a Horse to Water But You Can’t Make ‘Em Cha, Cha. But this time it’s about you know finding yourself coming out of the abusive relationship and finding yourself so there is that!

Okay, so let’s dive into this. So, a lot of the times I get questions about well what’s the difference between dependent personality disorder versus being codependent Well, there’s a lot there’s, there’s, there’s a lot! So let’s go Read the DSM Let’s read what this is so dependent personality disorder and this is a cluster C okay? So, narcissism and borderline are cluster B’s, dependent personality disorder is a cluster C. So, pervasive and excessive need to be taken care of that leads to submissiveness and clinging behavior and fears of separation kind of sounds like borderline in a lot of ways beginning by early adulthood and present in a variety of contexts indicated by five or more of the following but it’s different than borderline so I just want to be very clear about that. The borderline remember, borderline personality disorder when it starts sliding down the spectrum has got traits of all the major personality disorders so they can be dependent they can be terrified of making a decision because they’re afraid of being abandoned. So um, number one has difficulty making decisions without an excessive amount of advice and reassurance from others so in other words, you know a healthy normal person can walk into a store try on a pair of pants and go “Yeah, those are the ones!” or “Oh no! That makes…Lord what is happening to my butt!” You know seriously so they can make a decision not a problem it’s like Yes, I’m gonna buy these pants are good or God no. With somebody with dependent personality disorder, they need to get everybody’s opinion the sales clerk’s opinion, their friend’s, opinion, their parent’s opinion their… they can’t just walk in and just be confident in their choice of Okay, done, you know, etc. This is what I want or no, this is not what I want, etc. So they have to have an excessive amount of advice and reassurance that they’re making the right choice. Why? Because people with dependent personality disorder were probably raised by Narcissus they were probably raised by an abuser and abusers are notorious for rubbing our noses in things that we got wrong.

So, this is where avoidant personality disorder also comes in. And dependent personality disorder also comes in because if you were raised by somebody that’s constantly rubbing your nose in what you did wrong, you’re going to learn to either A. Not make a choice at all and avoid it. Or, you’re going to ask for everybody’s opinion on it to make sure you did the right choice so that you don’t get into trouble. So, there is that Okay, number two needs others to assume responsibility for most major areas of his or her own life. So, they abdicate they just abdicate I can’t do this I’m a victim I can’t! I don’t have the ability I… you know, I’m not strong enough I’m not smart enough. I don’t you know, whatever. So, they abdicate they abdicate being parents, they abdicate responsibility they don’t get a job they don’t you know, it’s kind of along those lines that really bad 1930s kind of romance thing where usually the woman says I can’t think any more you have to think for both of us. What no! With a side of no and an extra helping of no and oh my God, no! So yeah, they abdicate they abdicate responsibility for most major areas of their life. Three has difficulty expressing disagreement with others now this is sounding a little bit like codependency now remember codependency is not in the DSM five it’s not it should be it’s not but it’s it’s not in there but it exists You and I have seen it we have it we see it you know we’ve had to work on it with the Disease to Please by Harriet Braiker. So, this has a little bit of the codependency and it has difficulty expressing disagreement with others because fear of loss of support or approval.

Kris Godinez  08:49

Okay, now this does not include fear of retribution because that’s what happens in abusive relationships there’s a fear of making you know waves because you know, the abuser is going to beat you harm you hurt you put you down, you know, throw you around, etc, etc, etc. So that’s a little different.

Four has difficulty initiating projects or doing things on his or her own because of a lack of self confidence in judgment or abilities, rather than a lack of motivation or energy. So oftentimes, when I work with survivors of abuse, they will be terrified of doing things on their own going out to dinner by themselves, you know, making a choice at a restaurant by themselves Why? Because the abusers oftentimes order for their targets of abuse and it gets to the point where they literally don’t know what they want. You know, they couldn’t tell you what they like what they don’t… like they’ve, they’ve abdicated so much to the abuser that they no longer know themselves. So yeah, they, they fear going and doing things by themselves. “Well, I’ll look silly. People will look at me. I can’t go to The gym by myself people will look at me!” Yeah, you can go to the gym by yourself because nobody cares trust me on that one! So one thing I did recommend to a client that was terrified of going out and, and either working out or going to a restaurant or things like that go to someplace where you are not you know in a huge room go to like you know one of those walk up stands you know a truck okay? Nobody’s going to notice that you’re by yourself there’s a lot of people out there by themselves a lot of business people go and eat at the food trucks etc. etc. etc. or if you’re terrified of working out and you’re afraid of people looking at you do an exercise where people are not looking at you. Yoga. Nobody’s looking at you, trust me on that one. You’re we’re too busy trying not to kill ourselves putting ourselves into downward dog especially if you’re my age. So, you know or Pilates. Pilates you’re usually on your back looking up at the ceiling and you’re not paying attention to what other people are doing you know so do things that you can do that this doesn’t start going ‘Oh my God! Oh my God! Oh my God! What if? What if? What if?” The truth of the matter is, is most people are so wrapped up in their own heads and their own lives, they’re not paying attention to other people, they really aren’t. I know for me when I’m doing Pilates, I’m so focused on not doing anything to harm myself that I’m not paying attention to what other people are doing I’m paying attention to you know, lifting the muscles and making sure I’m using my core and you know things like that so yeah, it’s a good idea to do something that’s going to be not… because if you go to one of those gyms, I know I’m going off on a tangent bear with me. If you go to one of those gems where it’s a meat market Yeah, they are looking at each other. Yeah, they are wearing full makeup while they’re working out on the treadmill that happened in LA all the time and I’m always sitting there going girl you’re not here for the workout Are you You’re here for a different kind of workout. Hmm. So yeah, you don’t want to, you don’t want to go to a gym like that, go to a gym where people are so focused on working out that they’re not paying attention other people don’t go to one of the meat market ones. No, no, that’s yucky. No, no.

Okay, um, number four has difficulty initiating projects. Oh, I said that one. Okay, number five, goes to excessive lengths to obtain nurturance and support from others to the point of volunteering to do things that are unpleasant. That does sound like a little bit like codependent so codependency we go over and above in order to get approval from whoever that we’re okay. Okay, so here’s some like the contrast and comparison there’s a little bit of codependency in this a lot not so. Um, okay, feels helpless or uncomfortable when alone we talked about that because of exaggerated fears of being unable to care for him or herself or being afraid of being made fun of because what narcissists do what do abusive parents do, they make fun of their kids. Ask me how much I like those parents. Yeah. I don’t like them at all. So yeah, they do that and then that causes people to be afraid of being made fun of urgently seeks another relationship as a source of care and support when a close relationship ends

Kris Godinez  13:14

So that does happen to survivors of abuse, they get out of one relationship and without working on themselves they dive right back into another one because they cannot stand the idea of being alone with themselves because these thoughts are no bueno. So, this does sound a little bit like borderline as well, which is interesting. And you know narcissists do the same thing. They can’t stand not having a supply their reasoning is they need supply. Borderlines reasoning is they can’t stand being alone because they need that support because the thoughts are so mean to them. And dependent it’s the same thing they’re afraid of being alone. What’s, what are the thoughts? What are the thoughts?

Number eight is unrealistically preoccupied with fears of being left to take care of him or herself. Okay, so that’s dependent personality disorder. Now let’s talk about codependent Now if you notice, it all starts kind of you know, sounding like oh, well this sounds like borderline this sounds like narcissism this sounds like codependent, etc, etc, etc. With both borderline and narcissism. When they slide down towards the malignant end of the spectrum, it’s no longer just traits of okay? They are actively harming other people. They’re enjoying it. They’re, you know, dark triad for the Narcissists. They’re getting down to that Witch and Queen area for the borderlines, all of the personality disorders literally start over lapping and they have traits of all of them. So, it is interesting that you see similarities between those So okay, where do I want to go next? Okay, I want to….. I need to turn down the sound because it Just buzzed in my ear.

Okay um I want to go to codependency because I talked about dependent personality disorder excessive dependence on others needing to be taken care of submissive or clingy fear of having to provide self-care, lack of self-confidence, difficulty starting or doing projects, difficulty disagreeing with others, fearing disapproval, tolerance of poor or abusive treatment. When the other, when other options are available. urgent need to start a new relationship when one has ended. Okay. All right.

So, let’s go to codependent doo, doo doo. Okay, so again, I found some really cool articles. So, one is on and this is a couple of years old. This is on elephant journal and it’s called let me find the title of it. Harley Quinn and ending the stigma we have about abuse targets they say victims I like the word target. So, let’s talk about Harlequin. Harlequin is honestly one of the best examples of codependency I’ve ever seen in popular literature. Because Harlequin was a obviously character comic book character, marvelously done by Margot Robbie, she’s just amazing. If you have not seen the newest Suicide Squad, I highly recommend it. It is violent, but she’s just, she blows my mind. Anyway, she’s a great actress. Anyway, Harlequin in the comics was a psychiatrist, and she was treating the Joker at the Arkham Asylum thing. And he started getting in her head. And he started love bombing. And he started you know, telling her how great she was and how fabulous she was. And but then as soon as he knew he got her the devalue and the discard happened. And at the end of one of the arcs of the I think it was the television that the Huh, what am I trying to say the animated television show? At the end of one of the arcs of the animated television show she outdoes the Joker she’s actually smarter than he is she’s actually better guess being a villain. And she was able to pull off this this crime, you know, to kill Batman, and she was better at it than he was and you in a healthy relationship. If your partner out does you you cheer for them. You’re like, go you you’re fabulous in that relationship, because he’s obviously a psychopath, antisocial psychopath. Dark triad. Everything bad, is the Joker. When she does that  he becomes enraged and screams at her and tells her how stupid she was that she ruined it all and it was all her fault. And then he throws her out of a window. And the sad thing of it is, is that at the end of that episode, there was Harlequin and a bloodied mess on the floor on the ground, and she’s sobbing and she says I didn’t get the joke. It’s my fault. I didn’t get the joke. That’s heart breaking. And then she goes about becoming less than you know, she’s

she’s the joke now she’s she’s stupid, you know, and she allows the Joker to be the smart, brilliant mastermind, whatever.

Kris Godinez  18:26

So, it’s, it’s a codependent relationship in that she’s constantly trying to make him okay. She’s constantly trying to make sure he’s taken care of she’s constantly trying to make sure that his wants his needs, his desires, his plans, his brilliance, his you know, whatever, is all taken care of. And later on in the series, he once she’s in the hospital, he then starts sending her flowers. After he did the devalue in the discard, so he did the Hoover. So, it’s the, it’s the abuse clock all over again. So, it blew up with her, actually showing him that he wasn’t the smart one. He wasn’t the greatest thing ever that she actually had as much or more smarts than he did. Then he devalued and discarded her threw her out of a window she took all the blame. Ooooh, does this sound familiar? Current recent events you know, Gabby Pettit perhaps you know she took all the blame put it on her goes into the hospital is maybe thinking about maybe leaving him maybe you know who knows that thought might have crossed your mind. And then he starts love bombing again, sending her flowers lots and lots of flowers, lots and lots of flowers. So, the love bomb started all over again. So that is a great example of codependency and she stays, she stays with him. And it’s not because she’s, you know, a bad person or anything else like that. It’s because something in her past has informed her that this as normal This is love and that is not love! So love isn’t painful. Let me…. please get this and please share these videos with as many people as you can because if you know somebody who’s in a relationship like that they need to get Love does not hurt. Love does not hurt ever, ever! If it hurts, it is not love. It’s abuse. It’s dysfunctional. It’s toxic, it is not love. Okay, so somehow somewhere in her mind this was okay somehow somewhere she childhood stuff I don’t know. But in her mind even though she was a brilliant psychiatrist she fell for the psychopath and she became literally a different person Harley Quinn so um yeah, it’s, it’s has to do with self-esteem. People who love themselves don’t put up with that kind of abuse. And once somebody has harmed them, you know, you give them the opportunity to make amends. But if they don’t, if they’re not honest and truthful, then yeah, you’re done.

So, let’s talk about the six hallmarks of codependency Okay. Um, all right, and this is on psychology today. This is called the six hallmarks of codependency they have an excessive we have an excessive and unhealthy tendency to rescue and take responsibility for other people. And this is the biggest mistake we make when we are involved with an abuser. So just like Harlequin, oh, it’s all my fault. Just like Gabby Pettit. Oh, it’s all me, you know, we have a tendency to do that, instead of going, No, this is their stuff, this is them, we have a tendency to take on the responsibility for the emotions, for the behaviors for the actions for the whatever for their happiness. I can’t tell you the number of times I have seen adult children sit on my couch, well, no more because I’m doing everything through video now but you know, get in front of me and tell me that it was their job to care for and make sure mom was happy or dad was happy, or that the siblings were happy or that you know, they had to care take the siblings. So, codependency generally comes from different from dependent personality disorder. Codependence generally can make decisions. But the problem of it is, that every decision they make is based on how it’s going to help somebody else and not how they’re going to take care of themselves. So, we become codependent, when we have a family or a family member that is absentee, neglectful abusive, alcoholic drug addict and we end up having to care take them or we end up having to care take them, be parentifide and take care of the younger siblings. So that is where we get this codependent feeling of, I have to take care of other people, I have to do things for other people, I can’t do anything for myself. And if somebody does something for somebody who’s codependent, they immediately want to turn around and do that for them. So, it’s like they can’t just accept the gift of whatever’s being given. You know, it’s like, oh, no, no, no, no, I need to do this for you, too. Oh, no, no, no, I need to do this. No, you need to accept it and just enjoy it seriously. So that is where codependency comes from is from be parentifide, and having to care, take the parent care, take the other kids care, take other family members, etc, etc, etc. We are trying to save ourselves by saving the family. I know.

Okay, number two, derive a sense of purpose and boost the self-esteem through extreme sacrifice to satisfy the needs of others. So, we do that. So how many times has the abuser

Kris Godinez  23:56

walked in and taken something that was ours and we just let them do it? You know, because they wanted it? Oh, well, they must need it more than I do. Or they must want it more than I do. So, what I’ve seen in cases of abuse in an in a romantic relationship is the spouse the, the codependent spouse will get a bonus or an inheritance or something and the abuser will swoop in and go I want that and the codependent spouse goes okay, and hands it over. Or if the codependent spouse buys themselves something nice the abuser swoops in. How dare you and then they feel guilty. Hello, fear, obligation, guilt, fear, obligation, guilt, the fog, and then they turn around and either give that to the abuser or they go buy the abuser, something similar. Okay? Because narcissists are like two year olds, if you have something they want it too, or better. So, the codependent instead of drawing a boundary and going No, this is my inheritance that I got from my mother or my father or no, this is the bonus that I got. I’ve been working for I’ve been saving up for this thing for myself you know drawing a boundary instead of being able to do that they give in and they give the abuser whatever they want because they’re terrified of the abuser being vindictive retribution etc. etc. etc. So, there is that!

Hold on let’s go back. Okay, number three choose to enter and stay in lengthy high-cost caretaking and rescuing relationships despite the cost to themselves or to others. So they’ll get involved with somebody and I’ve heard this 100,000 million times and it kills me every single time I hear it well but they deserve love too. Well yes, technically everybody on the face of the planet deserves love. Love is the highest power. However, if they are a covert narcissist, okay, covert narcissists are the ones that do the whole covert narcissist and hermits borderlines are the ones that do the martyr… I do all of this for you, you never do anything for me victim, victim, victim, victim, victim, you know, you don’t treat me well blah, blah, blah, and when in fact the codependent is treating them like a king or queen so they stay in these relationships trying to get this approval from this person that’s never… listen to me now, believe me later. Never going to approve and it always the bar gets raised you know you do 100,000 million things for them they’ll want 100,000 million and one. You know, so they get involved in these relationships thinking it’s just around the corner so that intermittent positive reward, that addiction aspect to it “Well but, you know they were they were nice to me once so you know I can feel it they’re going to be nice again it’s going to change.” It’s just like a gambling addict you sitting at the slots going “Oh it’s gonna come any minute! You know “The jackpot is gonna be here any minute! It’s gonna be here any minute!” And never comes up. So that is what good lord Mystique! That is what we do as, as codependence is that we keep hoping or waiting for, for the jackpot, for the payoff, but it never comes because they’re always dangling that carrot in our, in our face, okay.

Let’s go back to the other hallmarks, okay? regularly try to engineer the change of troubled, addicted or under functioning people whose problems are far bigger than their abilities to fix them. So, codependency the term codependency really came out of, it really came out of addiction. And it was to describe the enablers who were helping the alcoholics, drug addicts, etc. But they really weren’t helping, and they were killing themselves trying to help them. So, for example, they will oftentimes in addiction, you know, send them to rehab, after rehab, after rehab, after rehab, after rehab, and they just don’t stop. Why Why aren’t you stopping? Well, I can’t have them fail.

Kris Godinez  28:10

You can in fact, you need to in addiction you have to and if somebody is unwilling to pick up the mantle and go help themselves, you literally cannot help them, you literally can only help people who are willing to help themselves you cannot… listen to me now believe me later. You cannot help the unwilling. Let me say that again. You cannot help the unwilling. If they’re getting a payoff from being a victim, or from being a bully, they’re not going to change, they’re not and what I hear, and the heartbreaking thing I hear from parents of addicted children is “Oh my God! I can’t let them be homeless! Oh my God! I can’t let them fail! No, you have to. You have to. That’s the only way some people get better. Some people’s rock bottom is death, it is. Other people’s rock bottom is they get a DUI, “Oh my God, that’s enough I’m done!” Or other people’s rock bottom is losing family and friends. Some people never get it, it’s a matter of thirds. So, like a third of people go into recovery and they get it and they stay clean and sober. Another, I have yet to meet those people…. Another third of people you know, get into recovery, relapse, relapse, relapse, relapse, relapse and finally get clean and sober and another third just never, never get it and they just keep failing and keep going down the hole. You cannot help people that don’t want to help themselves. You can only help the willing and it’s the same thing in therapy and I tell new therapists this all the time is never work harder than your client your client is got to want to get better and if they really want to get better, they’re going to do the work and I talked about that in the book, So You Want To Be A Therapist, because a lot of people you know it’s like but, but, but no, I know you want everybody to be okay. I want everybody to be okay. Wouldn’t that be great? Wouldn’t it be great if everybody was okay because then I could retire and own a b&b on a beach somewhere Victorian haunted, that would be so cool. Anyway, good haunting, not scary, haunting, little old lady that makes bread anyway, the point being is that people, you can’t help somebody that doesn’t want to change.

Narcissists don’t want to change, they don’t, they tell you they do. But the only time a narcissist ever goes to therapy is if they’ve been forced to by the courts, they are being forced to by family, or they are being forced to by the spouse and they won’t stick with it, they go for like, three times. And as soon as the therapist goes ah, what’s your part in this, they go screw you and they’re out of there. So Alright, hold on, we’re running out of time.

Ah, okay, um, okay, have a pattern of engaging and well intentioned, but ultimately unproductive, unhealthy, helping behaviors such as enabling, and what ends up happening. And this is the sad part is the person you’re trying to help ends up resenting the living crap out of you, you will lose them in the end, you will, because they didn’t really want to change in the first place, they didn’t really want to get help in the first place. They see that you see that they’re not healthy, functioning, whatever, they start getting really resentful, and you will lose them in the end.

So, one thing I said I wanted to talk about before we dive into the questions because we are going to get to the questions but I wanted to talk about this first. Um, one thing I wanted to talk about was when to codependents get together. So initially, when two codependents get together, it’s kind of like I don’t know if you remember the Jungle Book, the old one, the, the cartoon one. And the vultures are all sitting on the tree. What do you want to do? I dunno. What do you want to do? I don’t know, what do you want to do? It’s kind of back and forth forever because everybody’s afraid to make a decision because they don’t want to piss off the other people. So that kind of happens in the beginning, but as the relationship goes on, and one member of the codependent team starts making themselves small in order to make the other person happy and always giving up to their… well, where do you want to go to dinner? You know, and never being able to allowed to make where they’re going to go to dinner, what they’re going to do or whatever, the resentment starts building, the resentment starts building and eventually it starts bubbling and then that’s when people end up on my couch. So usually at a point when it’s too late, so and this is the thing that kills me it’s like codependents have this and we all do it because Hello recovering Hello, you know, um, we have this desire to people please which is why I’m saying Harriet Braiker The Disease To Please read it. Melanie Beatty Codependent No More. Sherry Thank you. Melanie Beatty Codependent No More, Beyond Codependent No More. PM Melody has a book on codependency. We want to people please we want to make them happy we want to you know we want everything to be smooth and great and wonderful and awesome.

Kris Godinez  33:12

But then they don’t return the favor or or it just becomes this like analysis paralysis. I don’t know! What do you want to do? I don’t know, what do you want to do? The resentment starts building if we start going oh no, that’s okay. Yeah, no, that’s fine. A German food is fine when really you wanted Indian food you know that’s the time to speak up. But those little things start building and building and building and building and that’s when the resentment starts and that’s what kills a relationship so two codependents together is no bueno as well so you know in the beginning it’s all let me please you, let me please you, let me please you, let me please you, I don’t know what do you want to do? What do you want to do? But then eventually it’s like oh, no, that’s okay. Oh no, that’s okay. Oh no, no, I really don’t want that Oh no, no, I really don’t want that either. Oh, no, da, da, da, da, da and you start giving up little aspects of yourself and then eventually you get really angry because the resentment has built up so much because you haven’t spoken up for yourself you haven’t said no, this is what I want. You know, we can do this one week and we can do this the other week or you know, whatever. So, boundaries, boundaries, Disease to Please Harriet Braiker, Self-Esteem Workbook, Glen Schiraldi. That is the cure for codependency because people who love themselves stand up for themselves. Dependent personality disorder. Those are the professional victims; they never make a decision. They can’t decide for themselves, they need an exorbitant amount of reassurance. So again, therapy and it’s probably because of trauma. Guarantee it probably came about because of trauma that caused them to second guess themselves to the point where they are now stuck. So there that is Alright, let’s dive into the questions.

Okay. Isn’t this kind of dependency and codependency connected to the lack of self-differentiation? Yes. So, when we are with an abuser Literally, by the time we’re done with that abusive relationship, whether it is a parenting relationship, or whether it is a romantic relationship, or even a boss relationship, we lose who we are, we no longer know who we are, and our boundaries become so blurred, that we don’t know where we begin and end and where that romantic relationship begins and ends, or where that familial relationship begins and ends. So that’s why it’s really, really important self-esteem, boundaries, deal breakers, these are all ways to differentiate yourself, to have a clear boundary from who you are versus who they are, you know, so that you know what your wants and needs are. So very often I have people sitting on my couch after the end of an abusive relationship. Where’s My Water? There it is. Thank you. Okay. Sorry, oh. And they will tell me, I don’t know who I am anymore. I don’t know what I want anymore. I don’t remember what makes me happy. Because they lived for so many. days, weeks, months, years, some cases decades, trying to make this person who will never be healthy, who will never be happy, who will never approve, to be healthy, happy to approve. And so, they’ve lost who they are. It’s like, I don’t know who I am. And I couldn’t even tell you what I like to eat. That literally happens. So yes, differentiation. It’s like beginnings and endings, where you begin and end, where they begin and end. Boundaries, boundaries, super important self-esteem, super important. Basically, everything literally boils down to self-esteem. Work on your self esteem work on the mirror, “Hi! Good to see you! Have a great day! You know what? I give you permission to say no!” And then listen to what the internal critic does. If the internal critic pops up and starts screaming at you, demeaning you, that’s what you need to work on. Thank you for your input. Shut the Bleep up. Why? Because I say so! I am the boss of this. This is not the boss of me. I get to say no. Why? Because I say so. I am the boss. And you reaffirm that and you do that as many times as you need to. So, boundary drawing, self-esteem is huge. Go back to finding out what you like to do. What did you used to like to do before you got involved with the abuser? Or when you were a kid and you were in the crazy family? What was it that you used to like to do? What did you used to enjoy doing that they didn’t touch that they couldn’t get ahold of, or maybe they did get a hold of it, but you used to like to do it before they got a hold of it. Go back to doing that. So, this is why I tell people it’s never too late to have a happy childhood. Go fly kites.

Kris Godinez  37:53

Oh my god, I love flying kites. When we lived in Oregon, we went to the beach, we went to Cannon Beach all the time. And I would fly kites there and it just made me so ridiculously happy. Because that’s what little kids like doing. So, get back to the things that make you happy. Get back to doing the things that bring you joy. Try coloring, coloring books, oh my gosh, one of my girlfriends had two little kids. And so there was a you know, cocktail party, etc, etc. I went off with the little kids and we sat there we drawed. Oh, good grammar Kris. We drew in the comic book or the coloring book. And it was so much fun. And it was so relaxing. There’s a reason why there’s a whole bunch of adult coloring books out because it’s relaxing. It’s fun. You know, so do that. Do things that bring you joy. Do you like miniature golf? Go do miniature golf. Do you like bowling, go do bowling. What are your favorite foods go explore what you want, what you enjoy. Experiment with going out to dinner by yourself. Tell this voice to shut the Bleep up and to go pound sand when it’s like oh my god, people are looking at me blah, blah, blah. No, they’re not. I’m gonna have the salmon, thank you, you know or whatever. So go and do things that challenge you that expand your boundaries that expand your you know, if you’ve made your world super small, go expand it back out again. Go try new things, go do new things. go explore. Figure out what you want. What is important to you, what makes you happy, what brings you joy.

Remember, narcissists do not feel the way we do. They don’t they don’t experience love or joy or happiness or anything else the way a healthy normal person does. And when they see somebody experiencing a healthy normal emotion, whether that’s crying or anger or joy or happiness or whatever. They come unglued because they can’t feel it. So, they try to take it away from us. They’ll take over hobbies, they’ll take over what we like to eat, they’ll take over cooking, they’ll take over whatever brings us joy. They’ll try to take it away from us so your job once you get out of an abusive relationship is to go remind yourself what you used to like to do and what you do like to do that you haven’t done in years because of the abuse. So, get back to that. I hope that answered the question.

Um, the behaviors under dependent personality disorder sound like they could have been induced by abusive treatment? Yes, absolutely. If so, isn’t it more like a set of learned behaviors that can be unlearned than a typically hard to treat disorder? Yes and no. So, think of it this way, if it was learned under abuse, and they were itty, bitty, little itty, bitty ones, okay, it’s the same thing with borderline they started being abused when they were itty bitty. And so those fears, fear is a very powerful motivator. It’s a very powerful deterrent. It’s a very powerful, it’s a powerful emotion. It is, um, you have to undo all of those fears. You have to undo all of those mistaken thoughts, you have to undo all of those mistaken beliefs. So, if you find yourself with dependent personality disorder, if you find yourself constantly being terrified of making a choice, or making a decision or whatever you’re going to want to get with a good trauma therapist absofreakinglutely. Yes, it is based in trauma. Most personality disorders are, not all of them. Not all. Narcissism is not based in trauma. Don’t let them BS you with that. They do. They try. They’re like, Oh, I had a traumatic trauma. No, you didn’t. So don’t get me started. So, but most of them like borderline, dependent, avoidant, OCD. Those are all based in trauma, all of them schizo affective, schizo schizotypal. Not, you know, but the borderline, the avoidant, the dependent, the OCD, yes, those are all based in trauma, if you have any of those, get with a good trauma therapist and start working on the trauma. And that’s going to actually help you resolve all of the behaviors that are learned that are coming up out of that. So yeah, that’s why when anybody says they have any of those, I’m like, okay, here’s what we need to work on. We need to work on the trauma, we need to work on this, we need to work on boundaries, we need to work on self-esteem, we need to work on inner child work, inner child work, because that’s where the trauma happens. So that would be The Inner Child Workbook by Katherine Taylor. Now, some people because the trauma was so great, they don’t remember their childhood. That’s okay. You don’t have to, it’s enough to know that you don’t remember your childhood, which is a huge red flag. Oh, my goodness, looking like the Communist Party seriously is like a red flag. The trauma happened, okay, something happened, you may not remember it, and that’s okay. You can still work with it. You know, I don’t remember from ages, I don’t know, zero to six. But

Kris Godinez  42:50

then after six, I remember stuff. Okay. Well, something happened. We don’t know what yet. But we’re going to start assuming that something happened. And we’re going to start working through the inner child workbook and working on the self-esteem of that little four-year-old. Do you see where I’m going with that you start building the self-esteem, build the self-esteem, build the self-esteem, build the self-esteem, build the boundaries, build the love for yourself, that’s what’s important. So yes, it is trauma informed, and it is still hard to treat because fear, like I said, is primal. It is part of the fight, flight, freeze or faun, motivator. And if these behaviors have kept us safe, while we were growing up in an abusive relationship and abusive home, it’s going to be hard to get rid of them, but not impossible. Not impossible. So, but it does take a good trauma therapist working on the inner child, working on the trauma, working on building self-esteem, working on building boundaries. deal breakers. Yep, absolutely.

Okay, let’s see, um, how to get over the shame of having made myself smaller when I was in a codependent relationship. I keep remembering how people thought about me back then. Okay. None of us are who we were. None of us. All of us have made mistakes. All of us, if we’re codependent. All of us have made ourselves small in order to try to please the partner. Forgive yourself, sweetie, forgive yourself. We’ve all been there. done that. Hello. Hi, my name is Kris Godinez, and I’m a recovering codependent. Seriously, if that’s what you have to do, because that’s how we were groomed. That’s how we were raised. There’s a reason we became codependent is because it’s usually from having been in a family of origin, where we had to care to take, care give all the time. And we had to take care of people and this and the other thing, and then we take that out into our other everyday life. So, forgive yourself, forgive yourself. You didn’t know what you didn’t know when you didn’t know it. Now you know better. Now you can do better. So, you forgive yourself and if other people oh here’s Hmm, here’s a big one. If other people try to bring up your past and make you wrong for how you were in the past and go, Oh, well, you know you did this when you were in high school, or you did this when you were in grade school, or you did this when you were a young adult. That’s when you really got to ask yourself, what’s the motivation? What’s what, what’s, what’s their agenda? Because who else does that? Hmm, that would be I don’t know, Narcissists dragging up the past trying to put shame into your head over something you did 20, 30, 40, 50, 60, 70 years ago. You always want to question the motivation of that person doing that. Why are they doing that? And when sometimes when people do that with me, like there’s a few people from my high school that when I have to go to high school reunions, they’ll try to do that, and I’ll look at them and go, Yeah, well, that’s not who I am anymore. Thanks for asking. And then I’ll buzz on off. It’s like I’m not playing your game. Thank you. So yeah, you just self-confidence is self-esteem. self-esteem is self-confidence. It really is. Boundaries is also self-esteem and self-confidence. So yeah, you want to ask yourself, what’s the motivation for dragging up the past and trying to embarrass you with it? Or if you’re the one dragging up your own past try to embarrass yourself for it. Who taught you the shame? Huh? Who taught us the shame? Abusers teach us the shame. Abuser shove their shame into our head and we think it’s ours. It is not! Hand the shame back to where it belongs CPTSD from surviving to thriving by Pete Walker. Chapter Three. I think it’s chapter three. I really need to go back and take a look at that book. Anyway. I think it’s chapter three. Putting the shame and the blame and the anger and everything else, the guilt back to where it belongs. It is not yours we do not pop out of the womb feeling guilty. We don’t! Yeah! Or shameful, we don’t, that’s taught that’s a taught behavior. So yeah, you want to forgive yourself. We all make ourselves smaller, every single one of us and we can heal and recover from being codependent. And how do we do that? We do the mirror work. We do the workbooks. We do the CPTSD From Surviving to Thriving by Pete Walker. We do the Self-Esteem workbook by Glenn Schiraldi, we do The Inner Child Workbook by Katherine Taylor, we get with a good trauma therapist, we start working through our past, where did this come from? Why did I believe this, we get rid of the mistaken thoughts and the mistaken beliefs. And you do recover from it. You do! It takes work, though. And a lot of times, people will want to get help, but they’re not really wanting to do the work. And I have to explain to them it’s like, this is not osmosis, you’re not just going to have a session with me and suddenly, you know, you’re a healed you know, it

Kris Godinez  47:48

would be great if it worked that way. Wow. Wouldn’t that be cool that that would be cool. That would be cool. doesn’t work that way, though. The only, the last person did that got, got nailed to a tree. So, you know, you can’t, you can’t expect that. When you go into therapy, you’re gonna have to do the work. And that means having to confront and feel and work through the emotions and the feelings and the thoughts and the mistaken thoughts, mistaken beliefs that happened when we were kids. And some people are just like, No, no, no, no, no, I don’t want to do I’m just, I’m just gonna ignore it well, when we ignore things we’re not dealing with, but they’re still running in the background, like a broken code. Okay, like a broken computer. There’s something there’s some malware running in the background. And it’ll come out sideways, if you’re not aware of it, if you haven’t worked on it. That’s why I’m saying you cannot allow the fear. Remember, fear is a powerful motivator not to do things because we’re afraid. You cannot allow the fear to stop you from processing the trauma. That’s what you got to do. You got to put it back on to the abuser you got to get clear that headspace out of all the mistaken thoughts, mistaken beliefs, that the abusive family or the abusive boyfriend or the abusive boss or the abusive friends shoved into your head because they’re not yours. You’ve got to confront it, you got to work with it. And guess what, you can do it! You can do it. And then you have to ask yourself, okay, how old do I feel? Why am I terrified. A lot of times when I’m working with clients, I’m starting to lose my voice. I can hear it. Um, a lot of times when I’m working with clients, they will you know, express this I don’t want to feel it. I don’t want to think it. I don’t want to have to well, how old are you right now? And then right after they tell me to go pound sand. They’ll say I’m two. You know, I feel like I’m two. Okay. Well, that’s where the abuse happened. That’s why you’re terrified at your two-year-old is terrified. Let’s comfort them. Like why don’t you put your two-year-old on your lap and hold her or hold him and hug him and tell him how wonderful he is? Tell her how great she is. Tell her she’s safe. Tell him she said he’s safe. Tell them that they’ve got you’ve got their back there. Okay. Everything’s good. So that’s what you got to do. So, there is that okay. Hey um don’t don’t make yourself feel shame if you feel shame put it back on the abuser and remind yourself you know we do what we can we do the best we can with what we’ve got at the time. And then afterwards, you know, now that we know better now, we can do better. Forgive yourself, forgive yourself.

Okay. codependents and Narcissus can both have a savior complex, how do they approach being a savior differently? different motivations? So, remember, a narcissist is never really truly interested in another person. They look at it as to how they can aggrandize themselves so those are the ones who do the charitable acts, but then they make sure to tell everybody all of their charitable acts, okay people who are really interested in doing charitable acts, don’t feel the need to go on to Facebook or YouTube or I don’t know what other social media Twitter, Instagram what’s the other one Snapchat? You know all of these you know things and go look at me, look at me, look at me, look at all these charitable acts that I’m doing. No, they’re doing it for self-aggrandizement. So self-aggrandizement. So, with a codependent is their wellbeing depends on the other person being okay I need to make sure you’re okay. I need to make sure this is good I need to make sure the family is working remember that’s kind of the original motivation for the whole codependency so it’s all about the other person making sure they’re okay so they can be okay whereas with the narcissist it’s Look at me, look at me, look at me, look at what I’m doing. Look at all my good charitable acts bla, bla bla, so there’s that, okay. All right. Um, and of course, here’s the thing, a narcissist will never put themselves out. Ever, they will never put themselves out. One of the defining acts of codependency is, the codependent will put themselves out to the point where they keel over, in order to help, Narcissists will never go out of their way for a single living creature on this planet, if it puts them out of comfort, they’re not going to do it. So that’s the difference. All right, um, let me take some more water because my voice is really going oh my god.

Okay, um, how to deal with a friend who purposely trauma dumps? Is there something specific I should pay attention to? With this personality type? Well, okay, I’m assuming that you mean and correct me if I’m wrong, I’m assuming that you mean that the person you know, comes and tells you all of their problems, okay. So people do that, not realizing

Kris Godinez  52:46

how hard it is on the listener. So, if you got to tell him to get a therapist, you know, if they start trauma dumping on you, you’ve got to be like, Look, I love you. I want to be here for you. However, this is a boundary. This is what you do all the time. You need to go talk to a professional, I am not a therapist, I can’t help you. A trauma therapist can help you. Right now, all you’re doing is you’re just regurgitating everything that’s happened. You need steps to help you keep moving forward so that you don’t keep living in the past. And if they come unglued. They may be like, well, you’re not a real friend, blah, blah, blah. But I’m sorry, if a friend walked up to me and said you should probably go see a therapist, I would go Okay, and go see a therapist. So, you know somebody who trauma dumps all the time generally is not interested in change. So, people who are interested in change, ask questions, what can I do about this? Can I change this? Can I help this? You know, what, what do you think I should do? And then you know, you can give them your opinion. But if they’re just coming and going, you know, and just vomiting all of this trauma all over you but not doing anything not working a workbook not seeking therapy, not doing anything to better themselves, then you need to stop because now that’s enabling them because now they’re just victim, victim, victim, victim, victim, and you don’t want that and they may or may not stick around, you know, because again, if they’re covert Narcissus, and they’re the constant victim or if they’re the hermit borderline, and they’re the constant victim, there’s a payoff for their behavior and if you’re not giving them the payoff, then why should they stick around? So, you have to be prepared to lose that friend so you recommend that they go get trauma therapy, recommend the books and if they don’t do anything to better themselves, then you know that they’re not interested in change. They’re just interested in being a victim and just vomiting all over you so you don’t have to take that you absolutely don’t boundaries. Boundaries. Okay.

Okay, this is going to be our last question because I am losing my voice. Can some people become codependent because we wrongly internalize messages from our parents that they didn’t intend to give? Or is it always from hearing overt messages? No, we can internalize unsaid things too. I don’t believe in coincidences. I don’t. So, parents can also give nonverbal you need to take care of me clues and that’s never a mistake. So yes, it can be nonverbal it can be over it can be covert. Absolutely. They can be both so yeah and basically again get with a good trauma therapist undo the mistaken thoughts undo the mistaken beliefs You do not have to caretake everybody in order to be loved and that’s our big thing is that we think that if we care take them we’re going to be loved but really what ends up happening is we take over responsibility for them we kill ourselves doing it and then they get resentful. Yeah, no, it always backfires always so what you want to do is you want to work on self-esteem The Self-esteem Workbook Glen Schiraldi.  All the boundaries Harriet Braiker The Disease to Please awesome book. Inner Child work. Figure out how old you were when this all started The Inner Child Workbook by Katherine Taylor. Mirror work “Hi, good to see you! Have a great day! I give you permission to say no and mean it!” and then walk out. So yeah, alright guys, I am losing my voice quickly. Be good. Take care of yourselves. Drink plenty of water and I will talk to you later. Bye.

Thank you so much for listening to this podcast. You can always listen live on YouTube every week Sunday at noon, Arizona Mountain Standard Time. And if you want to find out more or listen to other episodes, you can go to Chris godinez.com and if you have a chance, subscribe to this show on whatever podcast app you use and let other people know about. I want to thank my sponsor betterhelp.com. They are an online therapy company. Whether you are in the US or international. They will set you up with a qualified licensed therapist. PhD level or Master’s level. If you are interested in more information, go to betterhelp.com/krisgodinez.

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The post Throwback Thursday: 10-03-2021 DEPENDENT VS CODEPENDENT appeared first on Kris Godinez.

CBT works with mistaken thoughts and mistaken beliefs. One way to process said mistaken thoughts and beliefs is to JOURNAL! You probably didn’t like that suggestion and you are probably wondering why I and so many therapists recommend it. Well, it all has to do with the amygdala.

Journaling, writing and burning letters, and making poetry out of our pain all take the trauma out of our heads and puts it in black and white on to paper. Some people resist journaling because they feel that it then makes the trauma “real”. Others are afraid of their journal being found. The funny thing is when the client finally gives themselves permission to journal, they start being able to put things in perspective and really begin the healing process! That and you need to be able to document abuse, especially if you are taking your abuser to court!

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Hello and welcome to We Need To Talk with Kris Godinez podcast. I’m your host Kris Godinez, licensed professional counselor. I help people get out of, and stay out of, toxic relationships. This podcast is for informational and educational purposes only. The views and opinions stated herein are mine and mine alone. They do not represent the ACA, the APA, or any other therapist for that matter.

I want to thank my sponsor betterhelp.com. They are an online therapy company. Whether you are in the US or international. They will set you up with a qualified licensed therapist. Ph.D. level or Master’s level. If you are interested in more information, go to betterhelp.com/krisgodinez.

Okay, announcements before I dive into current events, so I will be in Vancouver, BC. On May 20th. Yeah, May 20th. I’ll be in Vancouver, BC, and then I will be in Portland, Oregon, on July 2. So, if you want to go hit one of those meet-and-greets, go to krisgodinez.com. And go to the IS IT shop? John? Did I send them to you? Oh, there’s an appearances tab. Okay, so just go to krisgodinez.com. And I’m close that, um, and then we’ll have the appearances. So right now, those are the two that I have going. So, Vancouver, BC and Portland, Oregon. I am going to be adding salt lake city, that’s probably going to be in the fall. So that is my evil plan for now. So hello, everybody. Okay, anything any other announcements need to make? I think that’s it.

Okay. Ah, current events. So, I don’t know if you remember a couple of weeks ago, I was talking about cult behavior I was talking about, you know, how cults behave and what they do and this kind of thing. Well, I just wanted to give you an unfortunate update on the one in Kenya. This was on the AP Nairobi, Kenya. 21 bodies have now been found so far on land owned by a pastor in coastal Kenya, who was arrested for telling his followers to fast to death. He literally told them that that was the best way to meet Jesus is to fast to death. Well, yeah, you’re going to meet Jesus just on the way I think you think you are. So anyway, it was crazy because they found okay. They found shallow graves. They’re now digging up. He was arrested. Paul McKenzie was arrested on April 14 over links to his cultism. Further, four people died after they and others were discovered starving at the Good News International Church. So, a tip-off from members of the public led to the police raided the pastor’s property in Melendi where they found 15 emaciated people, including the four who later died the followers said they were starving on the pastor’s instructions in order to meet Jesus that to me is just evil. Evil incarnate they the communal narcissist want to see when I say they want you dead I am not just whistling a tune here people they want to see your dead. And for a communal narcissist. That is the ultimate power trip the ultimate. I think it was coercive controls when I was talking about this but getting people to literally kill themselves because you’ve told them to that getting people to do things harmful to themselves.

So again, let’s take this a step further into the whole TikTok challenges, okay? TikTok challenges very often include dangerous things like overdosing on Benadryl or overdosing on cold medicines or whatever. And if the parents not paying attention recently, there was a child that died there was a child that died from overdosing on Benadryl because of one of the TikTok challenges. So, if somebody puts something out that they know is going to harm somebody or potentially kill somebody, I can guarantee you you’re dealing with a psychopath, you’re dealing with a narcissist, you’re dealing with a dark triad, because their ultimate goal is I’m going to say this, and can I make you do it? And they get off on it, and they get off on Oh, see, look how powerful I mean think of Jim Jones that look at Waco, Texas look at you know all of those cults who have called on their members to castrate themselves, kill themselves, starve themselves to death, etcetera, etc. If they get off on it, they literally want you dead. I’m not kidding at all. I say that, and people are like, Oh, you’re being extreme, and I’m like, really? Am I? Am I? Am I really being extreme? Let’s look at all these examples. Let’s look at how the Narcissus treats us. Let’s look at how the abusers treat us. Let’s look at what they do to soul-kill us if they can’t physically kill us. So, anyway, I just I saw that today. And my heart just dropped because I was hoping that it was limited to only four people, but now he’s killed 21 Well, 25, if you include the four that died, so communal narcissists, cult leaders, tell you to do things that are harmful, or they’re the ones on the internet, they’re still communal because they’re getting off on getting to an audience and getting people to do what they say. So, if they’re encouraging kids to go overdose on Benadryl, or you know, overdose on a cold medicine or whatever, and then not taking responsibility for having introduced this internet challenge. They’re abusive. They’re dark triads. They’re absolutely evil. They’re absolutely 110% evil, you tell somebody to go do something that you know is harmful, evil, period.

So anyway, I guess the thing is, is that I really want people to talk to their kids, again, about social media again because not everything that’s done on social media is done with good faith. Let’s put it that way. So, they, Yeah, somebody killed. Yeah, this was years ago. Oh, somebody mentioned a DJ who killed a woman with a water challenge that was in California. I remember that. And she drank so much water she died because you can screw up the electrolytes that way. And again, you should know that it’s like these idiots are like, Oh, it’s just water. It’s harmless. Well, too much of anything can become toxic. Hello, you know, but you know and, and I think what scares me is that with the social media, kids wanting to fit in, and I’m thinking more of you like younger kids, the person who drank the water was an adult. That again, obviously not educated obviously didn’t understand the danger. Obviously, you know, didn’t get you could die from drinking too much water. There’s a sad story with that one.

I have family members that have worked in the correctional situation and friends. And there was a mentally ill inmate who decided that the best way to get high was to do that was to drink too much water well, and eventually they died because they would keep continually doing that even though they took him to the hospital and tried to stop them and everything else, it just so basically talk to your kids, talk to your kids, teach your kids teach your kids that not to listen to these tick tock challenges. It scares me to death. I mean, I’ve got a whole slew of great nieces and great nephews that are like little ones, you know, and it terrifies me that you’ve got narcissists or triads sending out these harmful challenges to have them do it, and they think it’s all in good fun, but then it kills them. You know, like this kid, I’m thinking of that overdosed on the Benadryl. It’s like, how heartbreaking, so talk to your kids, make sure you make them understand that just because it’s over the counter doesn’t mean it’s safe. Just because it’s over the counter doesn’t mean you could overdose on it. Just because some idiot is telling you to go jump off the Brooklyn Bridge. Don’t effing do it. It just, Oh. I get really angry. I really do because the people who are getting hurt are the ones who are not well educated in what these things do. And the people doing it, I can guaran-frickin-tee it, you can take it to the bank and earn interest on it. They are dark triads. They’re communal narcissists. They’re disordered, and they’re getting off on hurting and hurting the kids who go for these challenges. So anyway, there is that, yes, Lori Vallow. Mm-hmm. She’s on trial right now. And that affects Idaho, Arizona, and Hawaii, she was all over the place and claimed she was a God. I think anyone who claims their god you may want to steer clear of or that they speak for God you may want to steer clear of so.

Kris Godinez  09:43

Anyway, there I just I saw that that update today, and it just broke my heart because it was horrible enough that four people starved themselves in order to see Jesus apparently, 21 others did the same thing. And he’s such a freakin coward. He hid it. So, He hid their bodies on his land. So that tells me everything I need to know about this dirtbag that he told us his followers basically starve themselves to death. And then, when they did, he hid the bodies. He hid the evidence. So yeah. Don’t get me started too late.

All right, so today, let’s dive into why it’s a good idea to journal Why is it a good idea to document? Why is it a good idea to write things down if you’re in a high conflict, divorce, or a high conflict? Custody, So, all right, so 10 good reasons to keep a journal. So, a lot of times when I’m working with people, I tell them, It’s like this is going to help. So, this is part of cognitive behavioral therapy, writing it out, getting it out of your head, getting it onto paper. Why? Lots of reasons.

So, one of it is, is that it doesn’t just sit in our head like an incomplete song. It doesn’t just there was there used to be this old coffee commercial. I’m going to show my age here, this old coffee commercial that used to go on, and it never stopped, and it would get stuck in your head. And then you’d like you’re, of course, thinking of that coffee brand. So that was the point. So, thoughts tend to ruminate. They tend to rumble around in our head until we do something with them. So, remember, the amygdala is stupid. threose Stupid, like, Oh, my God, stupid, cannot tell the difference between past present future emotional threat, real threat, thinking about a threat, it’s all the same. So, it kind of rumbles in our head. But if we write it out, the amygdala then goes, I know it then goes, Oh, I’ve done something with it. Oh, okay. I can let it go. And it drops it. I know. I know. It’s like, people are always fighting me on writing things out. They’re like, I don’t want to write it out. But I don’t want to write it out. Okay, what’s, what’s the fear of writing? Yeah, it’s going to make it real. Yeah, yeah, it is, it is going to make a real because you’re getting it out of your head, and you’re getting it onto paper, and you’re reading it, and you can process it. And the amygdala is not interfering, going, and freaking out and telling the hippocampus hypothalamus to drop cortisol in your system. And then you’re all tense. And now you’re not paying attention because you know, you’re having a panic deck. So anyway, the point being writing it out helps because it puts things into perspective. And does it make it real? Absolutely, because you’re getting it out of your head. And you’re putting it on paper. It’s in black and white. And I find a lot of survivors of abuse, especially when they have first left, especially a romantic relationship, resist writing it like nobody’s business because they don’t want it to be real. And that’s part of the gaslighting. That’s part of the lie.

Remember how I talked about all the lies and the fog and everything else? Because boy howdy you write it out? You’re able to process it. You’re able to work it through with a therapist. Yes, it’s real. Means you got to do something to help you. Yeah, absolutely. And so, a lot of survivors are really resistant to that. And it’s part of the inner child. So, it’s the inner child, that’s like, no, no, no, no, no la, la, la, la, la, I’m not listening, I don’t want to believe it, you know, and you kind of got to be like, honey, take your fingers out of your ears, it’s okay, we’re going to get through this.

So, okay, 10 good reasons to keep a journal. Now, here’s the deal. If you are still in an abusive relationship, you lock that journal down, you keep it at work, you leave it with a trusted friend or family member, and you do not leave the journal or any documentation any documentation where the abuser can find it, because they will, they have, and they will find those journals, read them, and then use whatever you’ve said in those journals against you, because that’s what those do jack wagons do. So, if you’re going to journal, keep it somewhere safe, or have it locked down so that they can’t get to it. If you if you do like on digital. I like to write it out with an actual pen and paper just because I can dig the pen into the paper if I’m really pissed off. And it just and I like writing, I just I do cursive, and I like writing.

So anyway, do what floats your boat. If you need to write it out, write it out. If you need to type it out, type it out. If you’re the artistic type, paint it out, sing it out, do whatever you need to but get it out. Does that make sense? You can record it if you’re doing the singing or you know, some form of, you know, poetry or you know, whatever, but get it out and then reread it or re-listen to it so that you can really let it sink in what you’re working on. Does that make sense?

So, 10 Good Reasons to Keep a Journal stress and anxiety and this is on Psychology Today. And this is 10 reasons to keep 10 good reasons to keep a journal by Kevin Bennett, Ph. D. This was written in January of 2023. It’s known to reduce symptoms of depression and anxiety; it can be used as a form of stress and emotional regulation. keeping a diary can be beneficial for mental well-being as well as personal growth and self-awareness, and it allows you to revisit things without having to store them up here. Creative insights and novel solutions to problems often result from habitual, uncensored writing. Now, that’s key point uncensored.

So, a lot of my clients, when they have been in a family of origin that was like controlling, manipulative, gaslighting, lying the whole thing, they have a really hard time doing the uncensored part because they feel like, Oh, my God, I’m being disloyal. No, you’re not. It is your right to write it out and get it out of your head. You can say whatever you want in the journal, I wouldn’t recommend saying it to the abuser. This is why when I say if you write and burn a letter to them, like, okay, when we come out of abusive relationships, whether it is parental, whether it’s a boss, whether it’s a lover, whether it’s whatever, there’s a lot of emotions, right? And talking to the abuser is not going to make a hill’s beans worth of difference. It’s not because they’re not going to get it. They don’t care. They don’t care. They truly do not care what they’re doing to us or how we feel about it. They’re not going to change. Listen to you now. Believe me later, they are not going to change. So when you write it out, do it how you’d like to not with the, you know, well, this is what I’m going to say that No, no, no, no, you are not, you’re going to just write it out, get it out of your head, get it onto paper and burn it, you know, or you’re leaving in your journal, one of the two, I don’t recommend personally keeping the bad stuff, once you’ve gone through all of it. You know, it’s like once you’ve divorced, and once you’re onto your happy life, you can burn that stuff if you want. That’s what I recommend because some people get stuck in writing out all the bad stuff, and they forget to put in the good stuff, too. So, as you’re not good stuff about the abuser, but good stuff about you, you know. So, if you’re doing the journal, make sure that you’re talking about your own growth, as well as how angry you are at the abuser and all of that, so that you have some balance in there. Oftentimes, I’ll tell people, it’s like, okay, you’re done with it. You’re divorced. You’ve got everything settled. You’ve got the evidence and other places. You can burn this now let it go, have a ceremony, have a ceremony, burn it bonfire. You know, it’s the big letting it go, you know, that kind of thing. And it’s really important. It’s important for our amygdala, it’s important for our inner children, it’s important for us to be able to go okay. I’m done with this part of my life now. And now I’m moving on. So don’t forget to journal about the good stuff to keep a separate journal for the good stuff. All right, creative insights, okay, stress and anxiety,

Writing about your feelings and experiences can be therapeutic, helping to relieve stress and anxiety, according to much research on mental distress in journal and keep in mind that the benefits of keeping a diary depending on how frequently you write in it and how honest you are with yourself, you got to be honest, you can’t. You can’t censor yourself is what I’m trying to say is don’t censor yourself because you’re afraid, you know, oh, my God, what would my mom and dad say? Well, they’re never going to read it. And you’re never going to tell them this is for you. And you alone. Now, when we come from abusive families, there are no boundaries. And I have seen abusive parents read the kid’s journals, read the kid’s diaries, and then use it against them. So as an adult, you lock it down. You make sure it’s secure. This is just for you. They’re never going to see it nor should they. So, this is for you to call them every name in the book or get out your anger or whatever you need to do. So. Yeah. All right.

Kris Godinez  18:48

Honest with yourself and not just write what you think others want to hear. This is not for anybody else; this is for you. enhanced creativity. Writing in a diary can stimulate your imagination and creativity. It can also be a good way to capture ideas for future projects. It improves the memory. keeping a diary can help you improve your memory as you reflect on past experiences. And remember details that may have been forgotten. So, when we are in an abusive relationship, we are dealing with CPTSD. And one of the key things of CPTSD, PTSD, is we don’t remember key aspects of the abuse. So, it’s great to write it down so that you when you go back, and you can go, oh, wait a minute, something else is being triggered in my head. What else have they said this, okay, and then you write it down. So, it helps with you. processing the trauma is what I’m trying to say. And it helps you get your memories back, which is huge, which, again, some clients are terrified of it, but it’s like, Don’t be afraid. Don’t be afraid it. Knowledge is power. Remembering is power. And we remember when we feel safe enough. So, when you start remembering aspects of the trauma, give yourself a big old hug and a pat on the back because it means you’re feeling safer, and you’re able to start recalling certain aspects. You may or may not get them all back. That’s okay. But if you start remembering, it’s a good thing. It’s a good thing. Good job, keep going.

Okay, back to this. Boost your awareness. Writing in a diary helps you to reflect on your thoughts and emotions, helping you to understand yourself better. This increased awareness can lead to potential for personal growth and development. So, a lot of times I encourage my clients to write out what their triggers are. What triggered you in this moment? What were you seeing? What are you hearing? What were you smelling? What were you tasting? What were you feeling? What was the trigger? Let’s figure out what’s going on when you have these panic attacks. What’s causing it? What’s the thought? What are you thinking? So that’s all mindfulness. And journaling it out is a really good way to help you figure out patterns. So, for example, it’s like if you suddenly find yourself having a panic attack out of the blue, and you’re like, wait a minute, where was I?

Oh, I was grocery shopping. Okay. Why was I having a panic attack? Well, I was standing in this aisle, and I could smell the bakery or something, you know, and oh, gosh, that reminded me of, you know, a family member that was abusive when they were cooking or something, you know, it just things pop up in the weirdest ways they really do. So, you just write it out. So, you can find a pattern and then not avoid remind yourself, hey, I’m going into the grocery store, and there’s going to be smells that are going to remind me of my abusive grandparents. So okay, little ones, you’re safe, you’re okay, we can do this. Take your power back. That’s really what it’s all about. writing it out, figuring out the triggers, and the trauma is taking your power back so that these dead times about swear, you know what I’m saying? These dead Jack wagons no longer have power over you, so that if you get triggered because of a smell or have a sensory thing or whatever, you can start taking your power back and be able to go into that place without feeling that huge amount of fear. And it’s usually the inner child is the one that’s freaking out. It’s like, however old we were when we were getting abused. They’re freaking out. They don’t know what to do with it. And you have to step in as the adult and be like, Hey, little ones, we’re good. I’m the adult. I will kick anybody’s hind in that tries to hurt you. You know what I’m saying? So, Mama Bear, papa bear, with your inner children, you protect them. So, and let them know, Hey, it’s okay. It’s okay, and we’re going into the grocery store, there’s going to be a little bit of a trigger, and we’re going to be safe, we’re fine. We’re okay. We got it.

Okay, motivation, oh, good mental health, sorry, good mental health. So, keeping a diary can be an effective way to manage the symptoms of depression or anxiety. So, it’s like if you’re noticing you’re feeling depressed, or if you’re noticing you’re feeling anxious, write it out, see if there’s a pattern. And you know that way, then to when you go to speak to your counselor or a psychiatrist or a doctor, you can be like, here’s what I’ve noticed over the last month, and that helps them be able to help you. Help them help you. Help them help you that really is a good idea. Okay, motivation, because the thing I don’t think people are completely aware of, especially when they’re just leaving an abusive relationship. And especially if it’s going to be a high-conflict divorce, with a high conflict, custody to follow is that you will face anxiety like you have never experienced before as you try to protect yourself and as you try to protect your child, and some people are afraid to go to the doctor because they’re afraid the ex is going to use it against them. And you document, and we’re going to get to that, you document the abuse so that it’s clear that this person is causing the anxiety. So, motivation, writing down your goals and your plans can help keep you motivated and focused. You can track your progress on how far you’ve come. And this is important because abusers take away our dreams, and our hopes and our humor, and our everything. So, writing down your goals. It’s like you have the right to have your own goals. You have the right to have your own ideas. You have the right to, you know, what do you want to do now that you’re out of the realm of the abuser? What do you want to do? What? How do you want to live your life? What does it look like? How and how can we help you get from point A to point B? How do we do that? So that too is helpful to a therapist for you to write down. What do you want? Really give yourself permission? It’s okay for me to want to have a healthy life. It’s okay. Because boy, how do they tell us it’s not so working on the mirror work is going to help, but writing out What you really want is going to help you go, oh, I want to.

So, let’s say, let’s say you’re in a state with the abuser, and there’s no kids involved because that’s the simplest solution. So, the simplest situation, we’re going to talk about if there’s kids involved, or even if there is kids involved, if there’s no kids involved, your goal is to get as far away from as possible, figure out where you want to move seriously, like, get on the internet and start looking at and figure out where you want to go to get away from them. If you have children and you cannot leave, you’re stuck, right? Then you figure out the support groups. You figure out how far you can move away from them and still be able to drop the kids off. You know, you do things to protect yourself. So, it’s taking action. It’s, it’s how do I explain this? writing it out, writing your goals out, writing out what you want and What do you need, helps you figure out where to go next. Because when they’re throwing a whole bunch of stuff over our family wizard at you, and you’re just at survival, and you’re up to here with their BS, it helps to kind of go eye on the prize. What do I need? How do I keep myself and my kid as safe as possible? Where do I need to live? What schools do they need? How do I make this happen? You know, etc. So do that it really does help. Okay, um, all right.

It gives you a sense of accomplishment when you look back. Reflecting is always a great thing. Sometimes with my clients, I have to go do reflecting with them. It’s kind of, especially when they come in and they’re hopeless. It’s like, whoa, whoa, let’s look at how far you’ve come. Let’s look at when you first walked into this office, and I’ll flip back to the very first day and read to them what they have said. And they’re like, oh, yeah, yeah, I know how to deal with this now. And I’m like, Yes, you do. Look at how far you’ve come. Look at how much you’ve learned. Good job, keep going. You’re not hopeless. There’s hope. So anyway, that’s a good thing to do. Because it helps you kind of look back and go,

Kris Godinez  27:02

Oh, yeah, I’ve come a long way. greater productivity. Writing out your emotions can help with healthy relationships. You know, what are you feeling? What are you thinking? Is this really somebody you want to be around? That’s a good thing to do. If you’re starting to date again, it’s like, oh, are there red flags? Let’s look at the red flags, if there are any. Um, yeah.

So, there is that all right now, building your case, how to document abuse, and this is on thehotline.org. So, thehotline.org. So, all I did is I put it into Google, and it just said how to document abuse. And its National Domestic Violence Hotline popped up. So, it’s thehotline.org. So that popped up. So, if you’re in an abusive relationship and are in the process of taking or deciding to take legal action against your abusive partner, documenting the abusive behaviors of your partner can be an important component of building your case. Now, this goes with getting a restraining order. This goes with divorce. This goes with, you know, Dividing property. This goes with everything. So, it’s worth noting that every state has different laws about what evidence and documentation can be used in court. Speaking with a legal advocate in your state might help better prepare you for your unique situation. Our advocates at the hotline can help locate a legal advocate near you. Fantastic. So, if you guys are looking for legal advocates, go to thehotline.org. And they can help locate an advocate for you. So, in Arizona, we have fresh start Women’s Resource Center, and they have attorneys there, the retired, that give legal advice, they can help you fill out, you know, divorce papers, or you know, custody stuff or whatever, they cannot represent you in court, but then you can at least do the paperwork with you for like 15 bucks. So that’s way better than the 400 that most charge. So yeah, you want to go to thehotline.org. And, John, if you could put that in the chat. That’d be fantastic. Thank you, um, thehotline a.org. And I’m getting to an attorney to kind of help you sort through because, again, that book, It’s on the other side of the desk. Okay. Um, The No-Nonsense Guide to Divorce by Laurie Hellis. It walks you through the mumbo jumbo of what divorce really is like. So, I strongly recommend you read that if you’re thinking of getting a divorce. And again, do not let your abusive partner see this.

When you go to do all of the legal stuff, make sure that you’re keeping all of this stuff at work or at a trusted family or friend’s house so that they don’t have access to it. Okay, so, find an advocate Fresh Start Women’s Resource Center in Arizona go to thehotline data org to find one in your state. Okay, verbal testimony from you or from your witnesses. So, make sure you have people lined up that are willing to testify that this person has been abusive, hurtful, harmful, etc., and medical reports of injuries from the abuse. Get your medical records. Absolutely. If there’s bruises, take pictures dated of any injuries seriously. Scratches, bruises, etc. And this goes for men and women because women are abusive too the dark triads. You bet. Okay, police reports of when you are witness called the police. Now, this may or may not being helpful, but I would do it anyway. Because sometimes the abuser calls the police and claims that you were the abuser, and, in some states, it’s so stupid. They’re like, well, we don’t have to arrest so many, and then they end up. Oh, gosh, thank you, Rob. They ended up arresting the target of abuse as opposed to the abuser, and I’m sitting here going, what is your damage? Well, the damage is the police departments do not train their officers, really, in psychological situations in domestic violence, and let’s face it, a lot of them are narcissists themselves. So not all but some so all right, um, where was I? I was not there. There. There I am. Okay. Police reports of when you have witnessed, or you or a witness, called police, even if they make you go, it’s like, honestly, I will definitely get that.

Household objects that have been torn or broken by the abuser. So, it is very common when they start losing it that when they realize they can no longer control you. Or they can’t control you with the intimidation, the verbal stuff, they’ll start going physical. And oftentimes, they’ll harm pets. They’ll harm objects, things that are sentimental value to you, they’ll throw things. They love…. The thing that I’ve seen the most in working with targets of abuse is the abuser, male or female, will throw something and just barely missed the person, and I don’t know whether that’s on purpose and they’re just bad shots. Or that I’m like, lipstick is everywhere. What the hell, or if that’s just done to frighten the person, you know, they’ll grab things and throw it on the ground and, you know, in a temper tantrum. Basically, you’re dealing with a two-year-old at that point. So um, take pictures, take pictures, take pictures, take pictures, listen to me. Now, believe me later. You want to take as many pictures as you possibly can of anything that was broken, torn, they’ll go in, they’ll pour bleach on clothing, they’ll cut up clothing, they’ll you know all sorts of stuff it and of course their next line will be You made me You made me. You made me jealous. I think you’re cheating. You deserved it. Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. So, you guns are flying fast and furious. Take pictures, and date it. If you can’t get witnesses, that’s what you’re going to want. You want as many eyes on this situation as possible because, remember, they isolate us. Oh, my Lord, I am going to go over time here. And I don’t care because I need to get this information out. Okay. household objects torn or broken by the abuser, and pictures of the household disarray after a violent episode. So, they’ve tossed the furniture, broken windows, whatever, pictures of any weapons used by the abuser against you, a personal diary or calendar in which you’ve documented the abuse as it happened. So as soon as possible. After the event, you want to document where they’re not. If you start documenting in front of… that’s going to that’s going to enrage them even more so as soon as you possibly can get to someplace quiet note the date, the time who was a witness, and write out what happened as best you can. That’s what that’s what’s going to help you because when you go to get that restraining order, the judge is going to be like, Well, where’s your evidence? Well, here it is, Your Honor, you know, so? Yeah, okay. Um, below are a few actions you can take to create documentation, and visit the doctor. Go to your healthcare provider, and let them know that you’re in an abusive relationship. If you’re visiting a doctor for an injury, ask them about safe ways you can make notes about the abuse, some can right the cause of injury without it having to go to the police. So again, every state is different.

You’re going to have to find out and talk to your doctor. Consider outside documentation. Do you have a trusted friend, coworker, or family member who knows what’s going on and would be willing to help? There are many ways they can document the abuse, whether that’s a coworker making notes of times your partner calls you at the office or a friend holding your journal at her house. So again, abusers will call your home, your work, your best friends your entire family. If they’re not flying monkeys have them documented. Have somebody you trust document how many times you got called at work by your abuser. That’s harassment. You’re going to need that when you file your restraining order. Because on the restraining order, at least in Arizona, it’s going to ask, well, where you not want them to be in mind? When I did mine it was like everywhere. That’s what this person anywhere near me. I think they’re cuckoo for Cocoa Puffs. So yeah, absolutely. Create a stalking log. If your partner is stalking, you create a stalking log that can be very helpful to your case. The set national center for Victims of crimes stalking Resource Center has examples of stalking logs in PDF and Word formats as well as additional information on stalking. So, the Stalking Resource Center at the National Center for Victims of crimes.

Okay, learn more about police reports, like filing about a lost bike, ask hypothetically if there was something that was happening that I wouldn’t want to report, always ask questions out, call your local police department’s non-emergency number and find out about the protocols and procedures for filing a police report. This is going to help you prepare for filing a police report if you need to, which creates a paper trail of the abuse, and this is important. So, a few years ago, I got some death threats here on YouTube. So, I found the police report, you know, not you know, not like I was expecting the police to be able to do anything, but I wanted a paper trail so that in case anything did come of it, that there was a paper trail, you know, and that’s what you want. So do that. Don’t be afraid of finding out how to file a police report. And if somebody threatens you, don’t be afraid of filing a police report. That’s what they are there for. I know some of them they’re not, because they’re narcissists, but that’s what they’re there for. So, yeah, absolutely file police reports. If you need to take pictures. Get a disposable camera, and we don’t really have disposable cameras anymore. They’re all on our phones.

Kris Godinez  36:55

And keep the pictures somewhere safe. So, you can put it on a little drive and give it to a friend. Let it go to voicemail. Is the partner or the abuser calling over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over? Let it go to voicemail and save the voicemail. That’s evidence that is evidence. Don’t erase it. Don’t listen to it necessarily, but don’t erase it. Have a friend listen to it. If you need to see what you need to, keep what you don’t save all digital evidence. Take a screenshot of 30 missed calls from your abusive partner and screenshot threatening text screenshot instead of responding to them, take a screenshot of the threatening texts to get it saved in your images folder. So, remember to send them on to a friend and delete them. If your friend if your partner sends threatening emails, don’t respond to them, but consider saving them in a folder in your inbox. Okay, so there is that.

How to document high con a high conflict parent develop a written parenting plan Everything has to be written down it all has to be written down. So, a lot of times, abusers will be like oh, we don’t need to we don’t need to go to court. We don’t need a written plan we don’t need on Uh huh. Because then they can change it however they want. And it’s usually a disadvantage to the other partners, so it needs everything needs to be in writing. Write it all down, document all digital evidence, document any physical abuse, store the evidence safely work with a lawyer experienced in dealing with a high conflict or narcissistic parent. So, this is why I strongly recommend you have it in writing. You do our family wizard, or some form of communication cannot be erased. And again, the problem is the attorney or the judges. Some will, you know, actually do their due diligence and read through the evidence, and others just side with the abuser because they’re narcissists themselves. It’s crapshoot video. It depends on the state. So, it depends on the judge. So, some judges will accept video evidence. Others won’t.

So, I mean, you could videotape it. But again, be very careful. Because if you’re videotaping it or recording it in any way, the abuser, if they find out, they’re going to use that as the excuse to physically attack you. They’ll slap the phone out of your hand. They’ll damage the phone. They’ll, you know, whatever. So, Lord, have mercy. It’s a thing, it really, it’s, it’s a thing. So, documentation is your friend. It’s scary. It makes it real. It absolutely does. The documentation is your friend. It’s going to be your friend for if you need to file a restraining order, and it’s going to be your friend if you’ve got a high-conflict divorce or a high-conflict custody battle going on. Get used to familiarizing yourself with the legal system. I hate to say this, but when we leave an abuser, you’re going to become an expert in psychology, and you’re also going to become an expert in law seriously because you’re going to need to know the law so that you understand what you’re dealing with. I think the biggest mistake people make is that they don’t understand the law and they don’t familiarize themselves with the law in their state or their procedures. And then they go in with this kind of Pollyanna attitude that the judge is going to watch out for them. No, people, no, you need to hire a damn good attorney that understands high conflict, divorce. If you don’t, you are going to be spending so much more money than if you had hired somebody who knows how to deal with these types.

So, for example, what they love to do is they love to, oh, I’m going to file a motion, oh, I’m going to file this motion, oh, I’m going to file this motion, I’m going to file that motion. Well, what the good attorney will do is they’ll start charging them, and they’ll be like, this is a frivolous motion. And then you know, counter file and be like, this is frivolous encounter file and frivolous encounter file. And eventually, if they’ve got a narcissistic attorney, the attorney will be tired of being not getting their funds because the narcissist has encouraged them to file, you know, and it’s like, now their client is getting dinged and having to pay, and yeah, you get a good attorney, get a good attorney, they’re worth their weight in gold. I’m not kidding you; if they know how to deal with high conflict, custody, and high conflict, divorce, do it, do it get an attorney. I’ve seen clients spend a ridiculous amount on attorneys that don’t know what they’re doing and don’t counter file and don’t punitively go after the BS that the abuser is trying to use. They’re trying to use the court as abuse by proxy. If you’ve got a good savvy attorney, they’ll recognize that not allowed that. But anyway, so this is why documentation is important. It is for your personal safety, it’s for your own remembering, you know, it’s like writing things down, look how far you’ve come, you know, a journal, that kind of thing. It’s for documentation for any legal stuff that you may need to do. But make sure that the documentation is safe. It’s locked down, and the abuser cannot get to it. Okay. Let’s get to the questions. All right.

As a child, I was never allowed to visit my best friend, who moved to Texas. She’d fly here to visit me. I went no contact with my family. 12 years ago, I just flew to Texas for the first time. Why did I wait so long? Well, sweetie, you know, we do what we can when we can seriously, it’s a fear. The way that parents make us afraid toxic parents make us afraid stops us from doing a lot. It really does. And don’t beat yourself up. At least you got there. At least you got there. Okay. So yeah, don’t be beating yourself up, Celebrate. Celebrate. Congratulations, you are now free to travel about the country. You know what I’m saying? So don’t be mad at yourself. It’s like, did it take a long time? Yeah. Okay, so it did. And you’re there now. Huzzah! You know, and just this is the level of damage that toxic parents inflict on their kids, the level of fear. And what we don’t realize until we’re in therapy, working on ourselves, doing the workbooks working on self-esteem, is that fear is a manipulation. It’s a manipulation. If you can make somebody fearful, you can control them. And that’s the name of the game for them is manipulation, power, and control. That’s what they want. So anytime anyone, politician, parent, coworker, or boss tries to make you fearful, really take a look at the motivation. What’s motivating this, huh? Nine times out of 10, It’s to make you malleable to make it so that they can manipulate and control you. So, fear false evidence appearing real false evidence appearing real, it ain’t real, it’s fake. But they love to instill the fear in us so that we don’t go do things because, How dare you succeed where I failed? How dare you go do things where I couldn’t? That’s what they do. So let it go. You did good. Let it go. Just keep traveling. Keep traveling, throw dart at the map, and go there? Absolutely. Travel is the best thing we can do. Honest to God.

When I was 21 Was it really when I was 21 I backpacked across Europe. And I got away from Mom and Dad, and I backpacked across Europe. And of course, my mother was freaking out. Don’t you dare. You’re going to get raped and murdered and killed, and just do that and don’t go to a communist country. So, I beelined it for East Germany. And I felt so amazing. After that trip. It’s like I came into my own. It was like, you know why? Biotches, y’all lied to me. I wouldn’t want to live in East Germany at that time. You know, but I traveled, and I was safe, and I was fine. And I met a lot of really cool people, and I’m still pen pals with one of them to this day. So, you know, it’s just, it’s great travel is great travel gets rid of fear. And you have to confront it, though. And did I have panic attack attacks all done I was traveling pretty much, pretty much, until after I got out of use Germany, and then I was going to like I’m badass. Yeah, you know. So, travel, travel, travel, do basically anything that your abusive parents said don’t do, you want to go do that? It’s true because they don’t want you to do anything fun or good. So go do the fun, good stuff, you know, obviously, don’t do anything dangerous, but you know what I’m saying. So just, you know, go travel, go do what you need to do, and good job and keep going. And don’t beat yourself up. Because that’s, that’s the training we got as kids so The Inner Child Workbook, Lucia Cappacchione or Catherine Taylor, work on that work on that aspect so that you get rid of that false evidence appearing real.

Okay, next. What are your thoughts on licensed clinical social workers running YouTube channels? And taking money for classes? Are they also helpful for healing adult children of narcissistic parents? Um, well, if they’re doing it through if they’re licensed? And it’s okay with their state. Then I suppose it’s okay. I mean, you could do that. It would be group therapy, kind of. I guess that’s kind of more they’re almost doing it like a life coach type of thing. It sounds like, but yeah, I don’t see anything ethically wrong with that. It shouldn’t go against any of the any of the ethics, so they’re taking money for classes. So, I’m assuming there. They’re putting together like a class and selling it. Yeah, there’s nothing wrong with that. As long as it’s good information, and they’re not, you know, cuckoo for Cocoa Puffs.

Kris Godinez  46:55

Are they also helpful for healing adult children of narcissistic personality disorder? They can be if they’ve done the research. If they haven’t, then no. So basically, I see. I’ve seen some people online where I’m just like, oh, who are a disordered person. Why are you on here? And again, it’s like if they’re, they’re spewing stuff out, and it doesn’t sound right. Verify. Look it up. Look at the studies. Look at look at the articles. Look at that. Do you see where I’m going with that? So yeah, it depends on whether they actually know what they’re talking about or not. I hate to say it, but those of us who have, you know, like Marsha Diane, has been through it. I’ve been through it. Susanna Quintana has been through it. Shahida Arabi has been through it. Kim Saeed has been through. So those people I trust because we’ve been there and done that! And everything I’ve read from them. I’ve liked it’s been like, yeah, you’re absolutely right. Yeah, that’s absolutely right. Oh, ha That’s how you fix it. That’s how you heal yourself. That’s how you, so yeah, so it depends. It’s kind of a trust-your-gut kind of thing. And don’t listen to somebody who is, you know, spewing stuff, but they don’t have anything to back it up. Does that make sense? So, you know, frankly, that’s why I do the Psychology Today stuff when I come on here because it’s kind of like look at this and look at this, and oh my gosh, and I just pulled this article from over here. So yeah, so that’s absolutely what you want to do.

So okay, um, there is an abusive person who commiserates with Dad enabler who then tells me this is abuse when I defend my boundaries while having discussions with him. To tell him not to interject himself into other issues to create more issues pot stirring. Since a narc does not accept take taking ownership of any reality instead of experiencing emotion. Why do they resort to ego offense is a tactic of self-victimization? So, you’re dealing with narcissistic abuse, I mean, narcissistic injury. So, narcissists can never be wrong ever on this or any other planet. They can never be wrong. And so, they will get insanely defensive. And remember, if you watched it a couple of weeks ago, they love to stir the pot, they do, and they will throw themselves into the middle of everybody else’s business. Because it’s outside of them. And it’s a way to deflect. It’s a way to distract. So, they’re looking for a distraction. That’s what the chaos and drama is all about. It’s a distraction. And again, if they’re a communal narcissist, or if they’re a dark triad, they love to stir the pot and then sit back and watch all the drama, you know, while they eat popcorn, and it makes them feel powerful. So that’s why they do what they do. And then when they get called on it. They get defensive, and they get angry because, well you’re calling them out on it, and how dare you, and I’m not wrong, and I’m always right and bla bla bla bla bla you know, whatever their BS is. So, it’s, it’s narcissistic injury to call them out on it, and honestly, you would have a deeper conversation with my backdrop, then you would say it doesn’t do any good. It doesn’t do any good.

Okay, um, are there any support groups for adult children of narcissists, there’s tons of support groups, tons and tons and tons, but I would caution you that a lot of support groups online, and I don’t know about in-person, but I do know a lot of support groups online, have called narcissists in them because it’s hunting ground for them. So, um, you could look for them online. I would be very cautious, I would trust your guts. Um, you could create your own, you know, you could look for support groups in person. They’re a little less likely to show up necessarily in person, I do find that there’s more of the trolls and more of the narcissist on the online groups. But, you know, just be careful, just be careful, support groups are great. Don’t get me wrong, I do think they’re valuable I do. And it’s great to listen to other people’s stories because it’s like, I’m not alone. Oh, my God, this happened to you too. Holy crap, I thought I was the only one. So that’s why I love support groups is because it lets you know you’re not alone. There’s, there’s so many of us have been through similar, you know, situations or things that have happened. And it’s great, but just I caution you that any support group, whether you’re looking at a support group for having been the child of a narcissist, or whether you’re looking at AA, or you know, any of these groups, there’s always going to be trolls, there’s always going to be narcissists, there’s always going to be disordered people. So just, you know, watch your six, basically, is the biggest thing I can say is like, trust your gut, watch your six, don’t fall for their sob story. That’s the biggest thing. So. Okay, um, and what support groups would there be? So, there’s one called out of the fog. I’m trying to think of other online support groups. So, what I would do is I would just go onto Google and I would look for support groups for adult children of narcissists. But then, like I said, look at the reviews. Be careful. Trust your gut. Don’t engage with somebody who’s a narcissist or who’s an Ask hole. Help me, help me, help me. And then two seconds later, Help me Help me Help me and you help them two seconds later. Help me help him. So be careful of that. There’s a lot of covert nurses. But yeah, if you can find a group, do it, it couldn’t hurt. But just be aware, not everybody’s who they pretend to be. So, there is that.

Okay, um, all right, partner has abusive parents who have never helped him, no matter what. UI he takes it out on me whenever he feels insecure. You don’t help? Why do they do this? Why cut off heads to stand taller? Okay, so this is a common thing that happens is that a partner will have had an abusive, dysfunctional family. And they take it out on the partner because the partner is the safer target. You’re dealing with an inner child at that point. At that point, you need to put your foot down through be like, Oh, I’m not doing it. You need to go get help. Here’s your options. I’m not. I am not going to be your whipping post anymore. I’m not your mom, I’m not your dad, I’m not your whoever was the abuser. Okay. So, this is common. And so, it’s an inner child thing. So inner child, rather than confronting the abuser, will go for a safe target, meaning either the safe parent or the partner, and start trying to work out the stuff that happened with the family of origin with the partner. All that’s going to do is destroy the relationship because ain’t nobody going to put up with that. So, I would strongly suggest that the partner go get help. And if they refuse, you know what to do. And it’s, it’s not the answer you wanted. Don’t stick around, don’t stick around if the partner is not willing to work on themselves. It’s not going to get better. It’s only going to get worse. And why do they do that? Because it’s an inner child. It’s a child that’s child’s way of dealing with it’s going for the safer target as opposed to dealing with the user. So, there is that okay.

All right. I think we’ve hit the questions. So next week is going to be kind of a shorter version. I’m going to be traveling with you in Universal Studios with my familia, but I’m going to take time out. And I wanted to talk about TV shows and movies that send the wrong damn message. So that is what we’re going to talk about. And we’re going to talk about how that societal thing has kind of indoctrinated men and women into accepting toxic relationships. And so, we’re going to we’re going to be talking through a couple of couples, a lot of movies and TV shows that I’ve noticed that I’ve been like, why Is this relationship considered romantic? It’s so insanely abusive and toxic. Oh my god. So, we’re going to talk about that. If you have any questions, just go ahead, and throw them either in the chat or down below. And remember, I’m going to be in Vancouver and Portland. So go to krisgodinez.com and get your tickets there. All right, kiddos, I will talk to you next week. Talk to you later. Bye.

Thank you so much for listening to this podcast. You can always listen live on YouTube every week Sunday at noon, Arizona Mountain Standard Time. And if you want to find out more or listen to other episodes, you can go to Krisgodinez.com and if you have a chance, subscribe to this show on whatever podcast app you use and let other people know about. I want to thank my sponsor betterhelp.com. They are an online therapy company. Whether you are in the US or international. They will set you up with a qualified licensed therapist. PhD level or Master’s level. If you are interested in more information, go to betterhelp.com/krisgodinez.

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